Foster, Robertson etc
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@Billy-Tell said in Foster, Robertson etc:
Either Joseph or Robertson is fine with me. Regardless of how we perform at RWC this has been a tumultuous 4 years and the « continuity appointment » will be textbook how not to appoint a coach. ABs brand has taken a hammering not least becoming a relative easybeat for the Irish.
Razor for me. Ryan appears to be getting the forwards clicking, and he will stay. Jamie has been away for some time, it will take him a while to get back into the NZ scene, worst case it's a little like Gatland who seemed to be talking a different language and couldn't seem to relate to his players to get the most out of them
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@canefan said in Foster, Robertson etc:
I thought the RFU said Fozz was not going to be considered for the job going forward? In which case saying he wasn't going to re-apply was a little redundant wasn't it?
I never saw anything like that?
There was one article by a random journo a week or two again who claimed Fozzie wouldn't be appointed
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@Frank said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Victor-Meldrew
And particularly notable for the pomposity of a couple of posters viewing themselves as the voices of reason missing the forest for the trees.Don’t confuse the testing/ challenging of views as pomposity
It’s pompous to think that way 😉 -
@Stargazer so has he made that decision in the last week has he? He coulda just said that last week instead of moaning about the distraction?
But what I hope this does, removes the distraction, and allows the players who are vying for spots, those who will be about next year, really step up.
I mean maybe the ultimate payback for the loyalty these players have to Fozzie would be to give him the ultimate send off to an employer that didnt want him...c'mon lads, do it for Foz!
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Foz went rogue last week with his comments and speaking out against his employers. He could have been sacked in other industries for that.
I am sure he annoyed a number of people on the board of the NZR, especially after they saved him last year so his announcing that he won’t be re-applying is probably due to him being told he won’t be interviewed for the position again
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Foz has had 11 years as part of the team. Was lucky to continue in 2019 and were it not for Jase Ryan rocking up and the forwards going off in SA last year he’d be gone already.
From his perspective, I can’t understand why he would want to continue even if they won. He’d be on a 2-year extension with a brand new squad instead of clearly leaving when the time was right after completing the story arc.
He’s already overstayed his welcome, if he can pull it out of the bag later this year then well done. But there have been far too many things to point out that he’s got wrong.
Results should be rewarded and come 2024 it will be Razor’s time.
Joseph probably should have got it (or at least a proper chance at it alongside Rennie) in 2019 with Tony Brown and maybe their innovation could have staved off the team’s decline.
NZRU are so far behind in the race they actually think they’re winning.
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@Stargazer said in Foster, Robertson etc:
The All Blacks will have a new head coach in 2024 after Ian Foster confirmed he would not be reapplying.
Foster’s announcement came five hours after New Zealand Rugby announced the All Blacks coach for 2024 and beyond would be named within four to six weeks.
He said in a statement on Wednesday afternoon that he would not be throwing his hat in the ring.
“As I said last week, I felt the best thing for our team and for our entire management group was to have this process done after the Rugby World Cup. That hasn't happened but we will accept the decision and move on.
"My sole focus remains unchanged. It is to lead this All Blacks team and management group in our planning and preparation so that we go to France with the goal of winning the Rugby World Cup and making this country proud.
"I won't be re-applying for the job of head coach."I thought he wanted to put his hand up?
Not sure I am following everything that is going on at NZR and inside Foster's brain..edit: I see a post above now that he will not be considered? What the rhubarb?
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@DaGrubster said in Foster, Robertson etc:
Foz went rogue last week with his comments and speaking out against his employers. He could have been sacked in other industries for that.
I am sure he annoyed a number of people on the board of the NZR, especially after they saved him last year so his announcing that he won’t be re-applying is probably due to him being told he won’t be interviewed for the position again
it did seem a little defiant.
update I read here
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/all-blacks/300819037/nz-rugby-confirms-new-all-blacks-coach-will-be-appointed-within-six-weeksReddy said it was “up to Ian’’ whether he reapplied for the job. -
Do we know who is being considered or applying?
A certain Mark Hammett has overseas coaching experience. -
@nostrildamus said in Foster, Robertson etc:
Do we know who is being considered or applying?
A certain Mark Hammett has overseas coaching experience.That has to be the biggest troll in this thread (and that's saying something)
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NZR shame on you . Has been a debacle
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@BerniesCorner said in Foster, Robertson etc:
NZR shame on you . Has been a debacle
Please explain.
The debacle has been caused by the media and various public people chipping in with opinions (and demands)
No timing issue existed once the Eddie shuffle completed.NZR can be a bunch of muppets at times but was Reddy says is entirely true. They had things under control behind closed doors (as employment procedures are) at at the same time had told everyone that they were reviewing how 2019 went down and what would be the best thing to do this time. As she says, 'there is no perfect window'. Hopefully the decision to go early is to get the best range and number of candidates. Foster's only hope if he wanted to decide whether to reapply was to wait longer.
I really hope that NZR have made their decisions on what is best for the process and not because of pressure from Razor or the media.
The public desire to 'punish' Foster shouldn't come into it at all. -
@Crucial no doubt the media has been blowing things up and feeding rumors more than anyone
but i think NZ rugby have done themselves no favours extending fozzies contract the first time after poor results...and then having a formal review...thats backed him again...after more poor results
if they stopped giving the press an opportunity to spark up then we'd all just be moaning about the results
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@Crucial I think they've done the smart thing.
Speculation about what is happening is by far the biggest distraction - once people have certainty, it will all die down.
Fozzie has done the smart (and good) thing by ruling himself out. He needs to take the line that it is a privilege to coach the ABs and very few get the chance to do it for one RWC let alone two. His realisation that "there is an appetite for change" is on the money.
But, an important point with the timing - as well as ensuring we get good candidates who haven't locked themselves in elsewhere (like last time) - is that if Razor (a front-runner) gets the job, apparently he's going to take Leon and Holland with him. If they don't run the process now, three Super franchises may suddenly find themselves in need of a coach in mid-December (6 weeks after the RWC ends).
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@Kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crucial no doubt the media has been blowing things up and feeding rumors more than anyone
but i think NZ rugby have done themselves no favours extending fozzies contract the first time after poor results...and then having a formal review...thats backed him again...after more poor results
if they stopped giving the press an opportunity to spark up then we'd all just be moaning about the results
So you are saying that their decisions should be based on public and media perception to stop the noise? That really would be poor.
We need to understand that we don't have all the facts they do. Just like when we criticise individual players or selection without the info coaches have.
We just judge on the W/L column (and I get that for some that is all that matters) but what if there is a close loss and a behind the scenes acknowledgement that a key officials' decision was wrong. We say they should have overcome it but we still tick close W's as W's if it goes the other way.
I'm not saying that is what happened in this case but Foster's extension came at a really odd time. Maybe they felt it was unfair to not let him work through a laid out plan (that was then disrupted).
The facts he brings to that table was a retention of the Bled, Winning back the Freedom Cup and 3 years of TRC titles. If titles and trophies are the KPIs in his contract then he meets them.
If not losing to Ireland or France (who his team has only played once) was a KPI then he didn't meet that but I guess that they weren't.Razor in the background just muddies the waters. There is the public fear of him going elsewhere and media making out that he is impatient. Personally I won't tar him with that brush as the facts (contract commitment) point elsewhere.
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@Chris-B said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crucial I think they've done the smart thing.
Speculation about what is happening is by far the biggest distraction - once people have certainty, it will all die down.
Fozzie has done the smart (and good) thing by ruling himself out. He needs to take the line that it is a privilege to coach the ABs and very few get the chance to do it for one RWC let alone two. His realisation that "there is an appetite for change" is on the money.
But, an important point with the timing - as well as ensuring we get good candidates who haven't locked themselves in elsewhere (like last time) - is that if Razor (a front-runner) gets the job, apparently he's going to take Leon and Holland with him. If they don't run the process now, three Super franchises may suddenly find themselves in need of a coach in mid-December (6 weeks after the RWC ends).
Agree, and I am sure it was a consideration.
I'm not disagreeing with the timing decision at all. Just hoping that it has been made for good reasons.
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@Crucial no, the opposite, im saying they seem to be responding to the public when they shouldnt
continuously they seem to have responded to the public's lack of confidence in fozzie with...."yeah...us too kind of....oh well", they should have either just straight up backed him from the start, hell or high water.....or they should have swapped him when they have him the first renewal
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@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crucial no doubt the media has been blowing things up and feeding rumors more than anyone
but i think NZ rugby have done themselves no favours extending fozzies contract the first time after poor results...and then having a formal review...thats backed him again...after more poor results
if they stopped giving the press an opportunity to spark up then we'd all just be moaning about the results
So you are saying that their decisions should be based on public and media perception to stop the noise? That really would be poor.
no he is saying NZR media management is poor. Given two coaches have spoken out or had a rap on the knuckles recently I'd say there is ammo there.
We need to understand that we don't have all the facts they do. Just like when we criticise individual players or selection without the info coaches have.
Actually, (with a bow to Rene Descartes), you/we don't know for certain that none of us have all the facts, maybe there really is an omniscient poster on here! Queror, ergo sum. (Forgive my porcine Latin).
We just judge on the W/L column (and I get that for some that is all that matters) but what if there is a close loss and a behind the scenes acknowledgement that a key officials' decision was wrong.
No completely true, posters on here complain if we play badly, without tactics or resourcefulness as well. And there is such a thing as losing ugly.
I'm not saying that is what happened in this case but Foster's extension came at a really odd time. Maybe they felt it was unfair to not let him work through a laid out plan (that was then disrupted).
The facts he brings to that table was a retention of the Bled, Winning back the Freedom Cup and 3 years of TRC titles. If titles and trophies are the KPIs in his contract then he meets them.And percentages, and not losing tests or series that were never lost before.
If not losing to Ireland or France (who his team has only played once) was a KPI then he didn't meet that but I guess that they weren't.
We don't know.
Razor in the background just muddies the waters. There is the public fear of him going elsewhere and media making out that he is impatient. Personally I won't tar him with that brush as the facts (contract commitment) point elsewhere.
-He did mention it himself I believe.
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@Chris-B said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crucial I think they've done the smart thing.
Speculation about what is happening is by far the biggest distraction - once people have certainty, it will all die down.
Fozzie has done the smart (and good) thing by ruling himself out. He needs to take the line that it is a privilege to coach the ABs and very few get the chance to do it for one RWC let alone two. His realisation that "there is an appetite for change" is on the money.
But, an important point with the timing - as well as ensuring we get good candidates who haven't locked themselves in elsewhere (like last time) - is that if Razor (a front-runner) gets the job, apparently he's going to take Leon and Holland with him. If they don't run the process now, three Super franchises may suddenly find themselves in need of a coach in mid-December (6 weeks after the RWC ends).
Good post.
