All Blacks vs Springboks I
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@act-crusader said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
The other thing WR need to crack down on with the reffing is the players in front of the ball. The Boks are the masters of it and there were at least 3 tonight that an AB defender was impeded. If I want to watch NFL, I’ll turn it to ESPN.
Absolutely.
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@act-crusader said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@steven-harris said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
World Rugby really needs to look at these continuing stoppages, you get penalised for a delayed put in at the scrum time so why not delaying walking to a lineout..?
But but… he was holding his head…
The other thing WR need to crack down on with the reffing is the players in front of the ball. The Boks are the masters of it and there were at least 3 tonight that an AB defender was impeded. If I want to watch NFL, I’ll turn it to ESPN.
Aaand the other ethically challenged tactic that annoyed me was how they'd jump into the kick receiver's space with no real desire to get the ball (not just the Vermulen incident, where at least they got penalised).
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@chris-b said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
Error ridden game - full of terrible catching and terrible passing.
I'm going to give our boys a bit of benefit of the doubt that the ball must have been slippery in the humidity (was it humid?).
Surely it was too awful to simply be incompetence by almost everybody?
Apparently between 70-80 at around 24deg:
http://www.bom.gov.au/products/IDQ60801/IDQ60801.94294.shtmlVery similar to us despite being 1100km north. Maybe a degree warmer and does not feel at all humid here. @mariner4life may be better placed to give anecdotal evidence.
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@nzzp said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
Well, settling down a bit now. Considering how badly we played, the ball we fed to teh opposition, the constant stream of scrum penalties, the number of dumb decisions we took, and the fact that we still won the Boks ahve to be nervous.
Next week will be different. Boks can't expect to even get close with that gameplan, but with Paps and Jacobsen to come back, RM coming out of quarantine, and hopefully ALB, it could be a very very different game.
Ummm
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@kirwan the game was not the normal pattern for us. We like up tempo. It was stop start and back chasing box kicks all day. Must have been a horrible game to participate in. But we need to adapt and my first post said that I hope Akira adjusted and put his nose to the grind stone. I think in the second half we saw this more. But playing SA is going to be a different proposition so he needs to understand the graft.
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@broughie said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@kirwan the game was not the normal pattern for us. We like up tempo. It was stop start and back chasing box kicks all day. Must have been a horrible game to participate in. But we need to adapt and my first post said that I hope Akira adjusted and put his nose to the grind stone. I think in the second half we saw this more. But playing SA is going to be a different proposition so he needs to understand the graft.
They all need to realise that. I think the team will be better for it next week
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@tim said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
A lot of scrum penalties against us when we are going marginally forward, this year. What's the story?
Set piece rather poor tonight.
Ref seemed to see our props after they'd been folded in by theirs.
Suspect ref may be sitting in some uncomfortable reviews this week.
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@smuts said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
This stings. I hope you’re happy.
Not as unhappy as we might have been.
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@smuts said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
This stings. I hope you’re happy.
Actually you should be quite optimistic for the next game, the Boks will be well-rested!
This post needs more love.
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@machpants said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@hooroo said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@oompb said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@booboo Springboks must cut out the kicking. All Blacks were there for the taking. Kwagga, Etsebeth and Fat Frans played really well. Hope they learn from this and improve on this performance.
That’s the only reason you stayed in the game. They were just playing force back. They weren’t there to play rugby. It was a disgrace to the game.
Meh, it's legal, is how everyone played not that long ago. So I think it's not great entertainment, but it's still rugby. The shit that really needs stamping on, is the cheating to get rests. Faking injuries is against the laws, and spirit, of the game. It's disgusting and the boks should be ashamed. But after ranting Rassie, I've realised they lying and faking are obviously fine for them. Rugby needs to play stoppage time like in game, if you're down, tough shit play carries on. Give them a few seconds to get playing, otherwise free kick to opposition. If it's a front row and scrum, then they have 30 seconds to either get him up or replace him.
I thought they brought that in years ago.
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@machpants said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@hooroo said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@oompb said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@booboo Springboks must cut out the kicking. All Blacks were there for the taking. Kwagga, Etsebeth and Fat Frans played really well. Hope they learn from this and improve on this performance.
That’s the only reason you stayed in the game. They were just playing force back. They weren’t there to play rugby. It was a disgrace to the game.
Meh, it's legal, is how everyone played not that long ago. So I think it's not great entertainment, but it's still rugby. The shit that really needs stamping on, is the cheating to get rests. Faking injuries is against the laws, and spirit, of the game. It's disgusting and the boks should be ashamed. But after ranting Rassie, I've realised they lying and faking are obviously fine for them. Rugby needs to play stoppage time like in game, if you're down, tough shit play carries on. Give them a few seconds to get playing, otherwise free kick to opposition. If it's a front row and scrum, then they have 30 seconds to either get him up or replace him.
Definitely agree with all this...
- Forceback - it's not pretty, but it is a part of rugby - and it typically sorts itself out once both teams re-org their back-line/receivers.
- Faking injuries for stoppages - is fucking atrocious.
- But... it's clearly something SA have decided is not immoral, just... "playing to the rules"
- Much like some other countries consider faking injury to draw a penalty is "fair game"...
- And, I try to think through things like this - I guess we're always talking about the "dark arts of scrummaging", and the "mysteries of the maul"... is it just a slightly different culture - drawing a slightly different crooked line between "finding the line and living on it" vs "un-sportsmanly, immoral, fucking cheating fluffybunnies"?
- "Painting a picture for the ref" at scrum or breakdown time?
- In any case - objectively or subjectively - faked injuries should be stamped out... but, how?
- I get the impression that for the Boks - it's not actually in order to get a breather - but to get the sideline staff on-field, passing coaching messages
- Perhaps the levels of fitness have dropped because of this, rather than the reverse cause-effect?
- And perhaps - it would be interesting to see if this behaviour continued with neutral medics? (I know, I know... never going to happen, but... thought experiment)
- Otherwise - yeah - it becomes very difficult to implement a fix.
- 'Neutral'/venue-supplied medics? Unworkable, and I don't see any team agreeing to this.
- Strict time limits on the injury stoppages? Cries of "player safety"
- Strict time limits on injury stoppages, but mitigated with freer reign to use the bench to replace players while they're tended to? Will be gamed by teams wanting to use the bench like NFL.
- Have a neutral medic attend the team's medics every time - and a) judge that the communications are all injury-related; and b) if possible, that the injury is genuine? That's the best fix I can think of in just 5 minutes of considering it - but... is overly complicated, introduces MORE complexity/rules, and pretty much introduces a "medical referee" member to the reffing team, flying around the world to attend internationals... which is ludicrous. Isn't it?
Referee: Nigel Owens
Assistant Referee 1: Wayne Barnes
Assistant Referee 2: Jonathan Kaplan
TMO: Ben Skeen
Medical Match Offical: Gregory House M.D. -
@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@canefan said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
I'd never even heard of him. And after that shower he put on I'd be happy to never hear of him reffing the ABs again
He's normally really good and up there with the best. Not today though.
He was disgracefully incompetent
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Another thing to show the ref had no feel for the game was how often he was in the way of players running or passing or they had to adjust what they were doing with him in thier line or peripheral.
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@stargazer said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
In the end, it's the result that counts.
What’s Jacobson doing there, obviously his illness not contagious
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@booboo said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
So how can we prepare for next week via selections? Not that many choices. I imaginge Foster would face a bit of pressure if he picks Bridge to start again but he did keep him on the paddock a bit longer than I expected.
He's not my favourite player and he had a shocker especially in the area of expertise in which he was picked.
But I'd kind of back him to sort that and keep him there as the Bok tactics aren't changing.
He should have been dragged last night, not Jordan, but I can see him playing again next week.
That often seems to be the way of the world, but in this case probably not what I'd do. George looked like he lost confidence after the howler drop they scored from.
If ALB is fit this week I'd play him at centre and push Rieko out to the wing. Other than that, probably the same team that was initially named - so Blackadder to the bench and Jacobson No. 8.
Not sure what I'd do with Richie - he'd need to look sharp as a tack in training. Probably leave him out if BB is properly fit.
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@kruse said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@machpants said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@hooroo said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@oompb said in All Blacks vs Springboks I:
@booboo Springboks must cut out the kicking. All Blacks were there for the taking. Kwagga, Etsebeth and Fat Frans played really well. Hope they learn from this and improve on this performance.
That’s the only reason you stayed in the game. They were just playing force back. They weren’t there to play rugby. It was a disgrace to the game.
Meh, it's legal, is how everyone played not that long ago. So I think it's not great entertainment, but it's still rugby. The shit that really needs stamping on, is the cheating to get rests. Faking injuries is against the laws, and spirit, of the game. It's disgusting and the boks should be ashamed. But after ranting Rassie, I've realised they lying and faking are obviously fine for them. Rugby needs to play stoppage time like in game, if you're down, tough shit play carries on. Give them a few seconds to get playing, otherwise free kick to opposition. If it's a front row and scrum, then they have 30 seconds to either get him up or replace him.
Definitely agree with all this...
- Forceback - it's not pretty, but it is a part of rugby - and it typically sorts itself out once both teams re-org their back-line/receivers.
- Faking injuries for stoppages - is fucking atrocious.
- But... it's clearly something SA have decided is not immoral, just... "playing to the rules"
- Much like some other countries consider faking injury to draw a penalty is "fair game"...
- And, I try to think through things like this - I guess we're always talking about the "dark arts of scrummaging", and the "mysteries of the maul"... is it just a slightly different culture - drawing a slightly different crooked line between "finding the line and living on it" vs "un-sportsmanly, immoral, fucking cheating fluffybunnies"?
- "Painting a picture for the ref" at scrum or breakdown time?
- In any case - objectively or subjectively - faked injuries should be stamped out... but, how?
- I get the impression that for the Boks - it's not actually in order to get a breather - but to get the sideline staff on-field, passing coaching messages
- Perhaps the levels of fitness have dropped because of this, rather than the reverse cause-effect?
- And perhaps - it would be interesting to see if this behaviour continued with neutral medics? (I know, I know... never going to happen, but... thought experiment)
- Otherwise - yeah - it becomes very difficult to implement a fix.
- 'Neutral'/venue-supplied medics? Unworkable, and I don't see any team agreeing to this.
- Strict time limits on the injury stoppages? Cries of "player safety"
- Strict time limits on injury stoppages, but mitigated with freer reign to use the bench to replace players while they're tended to? Will be gamed by teams wanting to use the bench like NFL.
- Have a neutral medic attend the team's medics every time - and a) judge that the communications are all injury-related; and b) if possible, that the injury is genuine? That's the best fix I can think of in just 5 minutes of considering it - but... is overly complicated, introduces MORE complexity/rules, and pretty much introduces a "medical referee" member to the reffing team, flying around the world to attend internationals... which is ludicrous. Isn't it?
Referee: Nigel Owens
Assistant Referee 1: Wayne Barnes
Assistant Referee 2: Jonathan Kaplan
TMO: Ben Skeen
Medical Match Offical: Gregory House M.D.If a player goes down they should be removed from the field of play and be assessed and treated if required. During that time no subs can be put on. The injured player has to wait for a stoppage before re-entering the field. That might discourage fakers
