Formula 1 2021
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A great race to end a great season. Still can’t work out how Mercedes list that given their superiority. They must be fuming.
Either of Hamilton or Verstappen though would have been a worthy champion.
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@machpants said in Formula 1 2021:
@majorrage said in Formula 1 2021:
Max on pole! Lewis behind. Starting on diff tyres.
Should be a phenomenal race tomorrow
I wonder what's the money on Max to win, but get points deducted cos he drives like a tool. Followed by months of legal wrangling
Called it
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@machpants you’ve called nothing.
Max has played what’s in front of him. Nothing wrong with his driving at all.
Arguments against his driving already toast.
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@majorrage said in Formula 1 2021:
@machpants you’ve called nothing.
Max has played what’s in front of him. Nothing wrong with his driving at all.
Arguments against his driving already toast.
Agreed. In this race, yeah he got very lucky but he took his chance.
Officiating again an issue but what’s new?
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Is it just this year or are the officials making trouble for themselves with 'adaptive' application of their own rules?
I can see the aim of not being pedantic and trying to make it about racing but the flipside of that is that everyone then questions their decisions.
For example if it can be clearly shown that Max went in front of Lewis under the yellow flag but the officials chose to ignore it where does that leave respect for the rules?
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@crucial said in Formula 1 2021:
I can see the aim of not being pedantic and trying to make it about
racing[insert rugby, cricket, basketball, league…] but the flipside of that is that everyone then questions their decisions.What happened at the end was pretty unique given the number of laps left when the safety car came on etc.
From my perspective, Max still had to take that corner and a perfect storm scenario with softer tyres, the fact it was just one lap, championship on the line, it all appeared to play into his hands. But it’s still pretty amazing that it actually happened as it did!
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@roninwc Can't say I share your opinion. Lewis himself questioned why MB didn't take the opportunity for new tyres to cover RB.
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@act-crusader said in Formula 1 2021:
@crucial said in Formula 1 2021:
I can see the aim of not being pedantic and trying to make it about
racing[insert rugby, cricket, basketball, league…] but the flipside of that is that everyone then questions their decisions.What happened at the end was pretty unique given the number of laps left when the safety car came on etc.
From my perspective, Max still had to take that corner and a perfect storm scenario with softer tyres, the fact it was just one lap, championship on the line, it all appeared to play into his hands. But it’s still pretty amazing that it actually happened as it did!
You missed the part where they took all the traffic out between him and Hamilton so they restarted side by side. That was the biggest piece of luck.
Especially as they changed their mind on donig it after Red Bull complained.
It's like they court controversy..... -
@antipodean said in Formula 1 2021:
@roninwc Can't say I share your opinion. Lewis himself questioned why MB didn't take the opportunity for new tyres to cover RB.
Did the managers think at that stage it was no passing by lapped cars? If so the Mercedes decision was right. They stayed out and put a buffer of cars bewteen themselves and Max.
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The biggest issue is the variability across the season as the race director and stewards change race to race.
The new owners would've been (still are?) ecstatic with the outcome and resulting controversy.
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@crucial said in Formula 1 2021:
@antipodean said in Formula 1 2021:
@roninwc Can't say I share your opinion. Lewis himself questioned why MB didn't take the opportunity for new tyres to cover RB.
Did the managers think at that stage it was no passing by lapped cars? If so the Mercedes decision was right. They stayed out and put a buffer of cars bewteen themselves and Max.
No, Lewis' engineer is quite clear they believed Lewis would've lost track position, they expected the lapped cars would've been let through and don't know if the debris will be cleared to permit green flag race conditions.
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Letting lapped cars past is standard practice after a safety car. The weird thing was only the ones that were in front of Verstappen being let through.
Mercedes were presumably gambling than the safety car took them to the finish. If they came in and Verstappen stayed out they would have been behind with potentially no chance to overtake. They made the conservative call and paid for it.
I think the race director is in a really tough place. It would have been just as disappointing for the race to finish under a safety car. Having a standard rule that the race has to finish with 3 competitive laps fixes that because Mercedes wouldn't have had to gamble on how long the safety car takes. Will never happen because the TV rights holders want predictable lengths.
Spa was the real joke. That race should just have been abandoned. I'm glad the title wasn't decided by 5 points or less (the points Verstappen gained over Hamilton for that farce).
All than said, this is the most interested I've been in F1 since Rosberg (jnr) retired. Bottas was clearly not in Hamilton's league and the season was just a walk over. Now that it's competitive again I'm looking forward to next season hopefully being a good one.
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@antipodean said in Formula 1 2021:
@crucial said in Formula 1 2021:
@antipodean said in Formula 1 2021:
@roninwc Can't say I share your opinion. Lewis himself questioned why MB didn't take the opportunity for new tyres to cover RB.
Did the managers think at that stage it was no passing by lapped cars? If so the Mercedes decision was right. They stayed out and put a buffer of cars bewteen themselves and Max.
No, Lewis' engineer is quite clear they believed Lewis would've lost track position, they expected the lapped cars would've been let through and don't know if the debris will be cleared to permit green flag race conditions.
Thanks for that.
I didn't see the actual race but was there going to be a loss of track position because Hamilton was already past the pit entry and would have to come right around?
That's just shit bad luck isn't it. -
@majorrage said in Formula 1 2021:
@machpants you’ve called nothing.
Max has played what’s in front of him. Nothing wrong with his driving at all.
Arguments against his driving already toast.
Dude calm down it was a joke. However, Verstappen won on a poor decision on the race director on the last lap, as another driver said ‘unacceptable’ But my point was more it is going to come down to a legal battle rather than the result
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@crucial said in Formula 1 2021:
@antipodean said in Formula 1 2021:
@crucial said in Formula 1 2021:
@antipodean said in Formula 1 2021:
@roninwc Can't say I share your opinion. Lewis himself questioned why MB didn't take the opportunity for new tyres to cover RB.
Did the managers think at that stage it was no passing by lapped cars? If so the Mercedes decision was right. They stayed out and put a buffer of cars bewteen themselves and Max.
No, Lewis' engineer is quite clear they believed Lewis would've lost track position, they expected the lapped cars would've been let through and don't know if the debris will be cleared to permit green flag race conditions.
Thanks for that.
I didn't see the actual race but was there going to be a loss of track position because Hamilton was already past the pit entry and would have to come right around?My understanding is when the VSC and / or safety car was called, Lewis had already passed pit lane entry and hence would've had to do a lap and lost track position as he's have exited pit lane behind the safety car with Max in front off him.
That's just shit bad luck isn't it.
Yeah it is. For all the uproar on twitter etc. I see this as pretty much the same as a penalty in the dying stages of a rugby game. It's likely to be more defining of the result than decisions taken earlier, however much that sliding doors moment would've played out. Case in point, how many MB/ Hamilton supporters are acknowledging that Lewis should've given up the lead after going wide at turn seven on lap one?
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@antipodean so it is really the set of circumstances altogether that made this 'unfair' from a Mercedes pov.
- yellow and red flags wipe away track advantage from distance. Accepted since forever.
- flags also remove backmarkers. Will happen automatically from red flags so artificially created during yellows.
- so it's the pitting/changing tyres rules once again that place an element of pure luck that combined with the other things just doesn't work and can create a 'loss' in advantage to leading drivers.
They either need to make it that everyone gets to pit without losing position or that no one does.
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