Exodus 2016

Billy Tell

Catogrande you can have a thanks from me. 
You know the thing is a farce when you can play rugby for a country before you can legally be a citizen of that same country.

Unco

Gregor Paul at the Herald is has heard that SBW will be fast tracked back into the ABs straight after the Olympics and is under the impression he'll stay in NZ:
<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11617469'>http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11617469</a>

pooler fan

I don't think there's too much wrong with the grandparent rule to be honest. 
One of my best friends from school in west Wales was born in Nottingham to a Welsh mum & English dad but moved to Wales when he was a toddler. He's now married to an English girl & living in Australia where his kids have been born. 
You wouldn't get a more fanatical Welsh rugby supporter & his kids are huge Wales fans too. They even have a smattering of the Welsh language which is odd with an Aussie accent. 
Without the grandparent rule would his kids be Welsh qualified ? They certainly don't think of themselves as Australian. 
People travel all over the world for work etc these days, far more than ever before which can make situations like this quite common I guess.

Wurzel

Getting ride of the grandparent rule would stuff the Samoan and Tongan teams.
 
I think World Rugby take the good with the bad when it comes to the Grandparent Rule.

kiwiinmelb

Not sure if this is the right thread but a story going around that SBW might be committing until the lions tour

Higgins

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Wurzel" data-cid="569992" data-time="1459892074">
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Getting ride of the grandparent rule would stuff the Samoan and Tongan teams.
 
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Perhaps not as there are still an awful lot of people born in NZ whose parents were born in the Islands thus making them eligible under the "parents" rule. I am unsure as to whether there are anything like dual citizenship sort of things available with the Pacific Islands and if there is then effectively the grandparent rule would be completely irrevelent.

booboo

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="pooler fan" data-cid="569989" data-time="1459889980">
I don't think there's too much wrong with the grandparent rule to be honest. 
One of my best friends from school in west Wales was born in Nottingham to a Welsh mum & English dad but moved to Wales when he was a toddler. He's now married to an English girl & living in Australia where his kids have been born. 
You wouldn't get a more fanatical Welsh rugby supporter & his kids are huge Wales fans too. They even have a smattering of the Welsh language which is odd with an Aussie accent. 
Without the grandparent rule would his kids be Welsh qualified ? They certainly don't think of themselves as Australian. 
People travel all over the world for work etc these days, far more than ever before which can make situations like this quite common I guess.</blockquote>
 
Really? Tough IMO. 
The grandparent rule is a farce. Really, what connection do they have with Wales? They "feel Welsh"? Apparently that doesn't qualify you.

Frye

Piss off a kid born in Australia doesn't consider themselves Australian.

pukunui

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Don Frye" data-cid="570080" data-time="1459913664">
Piss off a kid born in Australia doesn't consider themselves Australian.</blockquote>
I was born and grew up in Australia. My parents are kiwis and i have always considered myself 100% kiwi. I only have a nz passport even though i am a citizen of both countries. 
It really depends on how you are raised whether your families 'former' country is a big part of your identity or not.

MajorRage

Hmmm, dunno about that. My parents are south islanders, and I was born in the south island. But I moved to Orewa when I was 4 and stayed north ever since.
 
I consider myself a 100% North Islander.
 
Although, I'm coming up 12 year in HK and I'm moving to Surrey, UK next year so in reality I'm just a complete bastard. As well as being somebody who feels allegiance to a multitude of places.

broughie

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MajorRage" data-cid="570102" data-time="1459919279">
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Hmmm, dunno about that. My parents are south islanders, and I was born in the south island. But I moved to Orewa when I was 4 and stayed north ever since.
 
I consider myself a 100% North Islander.
 
Although, I'm coming up 12 year in HK and I'm moving to Surrey, UK next year so in reality I'm just a complete bastard. As well as being somebody who feels allegiance to a multitude of places.
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Know the feeling.

Crash

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MajorRage" data-cid="570102" data-time="1459919279">
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Hmmm, dunno about that. My parents are south islanders, and I was born in the south island. But I moved to Orewa when I was 4 and stayed north ever since.
 
I consider myself a 100% North Islander.
 
Although, I'm coming up 12 year in HK and I'm moving to Surrey, UK next year so in reality I'm just a complete bastard. As well as being somebody who feels allegiance to a multitude of places.
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</blockquote>
Yup

Billy Tell

Would anyone else be a bit worried that SBW sticks around just for the Lions then heads off...annoying NgÄtai & Crotty who head overseas too...suddenly leaving us short of 12s...

antipodean

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Don Frye" data-cid="570080" data-time="1459913664">Piss off a kid born in Australia doesn't consider themselves Australian.</blockquote> I guess it depends if they've got a shot of playing for Australia. Certainly I've worn the green and gold to win this country some silverware. I've got a nephew and niece born in Australia to an Australian mother and they're All Black supporters.

Unco

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Billy Tell" data-cid="570124" data-time="1459924959">
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Would anyone else be a bit worried that SBW sticks around just for the Lions then heads off...annoying NgÄtai & Crotty who head overseas too...suddenly leaving us short of 12s...
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Why? Hansen took four midfielders to the RWC, so they should still be in the squad unless another player pops up out of nowhere and passes them. I'd be more worried about players who're on the fringes like Tamanivalu than Ngatai or Crotty.

Crucial

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MajorRage" data-cid="570102" data-time="1459919279">
<div>
Hmmm, dunno about that. My parents are south islanders, and I was born in the south island. But I moved to Orewa when I was 4 and stayed north ever since.
 
I consider myself a 100% North Islander.
 
Although, I'm coming up 12 year in HK and I'm moving to Surrey, UK next year so in reality I'm just a complete bastard. As well as being somebody who feels allegiance to a multitude of places.
</div>
</blockquote>
 
 
Sidetrack the thread moment. Is this the big move you were thinking about a while ago MR?
 
Looking very likely that in a month or two's time I will also be moving to Blighty for a few years. Most likely looking at Wimbledon as an area to live so I'll be up the road from you.

Stargazer

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Billy Tell" data-cid="570124" data-time="1459924959">
<div>
Would anyone else be a bit worried that SBW sticks around just for the Lions then heads off...annoying NgÄtai & Crotty who head overseas too...suddenly leaving us short of 12s...
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</blockquote>
 
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Unco" data-cid="570131" data-time="1459925744">
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Why? Hansen took four midfielders to the RWC, so they should still be in the squad unless another player pops up out of nowhere and passes them. I'd be more worried about players who're on the fringes like Tamanivalu than Ngatai or Crotty.
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Also, Crotty's contract runs until 2017, so he won't be going anywhere before the Lions Tour (Ngatai comes off contract after this season).

taniwharugby

You'd think that if what the media has reported transpires, then someone else will likely have the inside ruinning to the AB 12 jersey by then, and SBW will again be a bench player, which he seems happy with.
 
Is a shame though, he has the skillset and obviously the physical attributes to be have been an absolute great, but has contented himself doing things his own way.
 
Have to wonder where his career may have gone had he simply not returned to league, would Nonu have featured so prominantly last year given the form SBW was in when he left and Nonu was injured.

Catogrande

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="pooler fan" data-cid="569989" data-time="1459889980">
<div>
I don't think there's too much wrong with the grandparent rule to be honest. 
One of my best friends from school in west Wales was born in Nottingham to a Welsh mum & English dad but moved to Wales when he was a toddler. He's now married to an English girl & living in Australia where his kids have been born. 
You wouldn't get a more fanatical Welsh rugby supporter & his kids are huge Wales fans too. They even have a smattering of the Welsh language which is odd with an Aussie accent. 
Without the grandparent rule would his kids be Welsh qualified ? They certainly don't think of themselves as Australian. 
People travel all over the world for work etc these days, far more than ever before which can make situations like this quite common I guess.
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I wonder if his kids will still be that way after they've gone through all the age grade rugby and are still in Aus at age 20 or so.
 
Anyway moot point really. There will always be individual cases that suggest things are OK/not OK but in general the Grandparent rule is being used purely as an excuse. I think it is one generation too far removed. If my Grandparents had have been born in another country I could then have represented that country but I've never even met my Grandparents, so where's the connection?
 
And before you ask, I have actually met my parents.

ulsterman

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Catogrande" data-cid="569979" data-time="1459867720">
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Ulsterman, I don't see a problem with all that as far as it relates to the provinces, just the same as I don't see any great moral issue with the English or French clubs paying stupid amounts of cash for foreign players. I do think though that any concerted effort by ANY Union to actively source players from another country is downright piss-poor and ought to be sorted out sooner rather than later, no matter which Union it may be. I'm not altogether sure about how the French national team are doing in regard to recruitment of foreign players, but so far have seen little from England in this respect. There are certain players that have qualified on residency grounds and the obscure Grandmother rule and these I reckon ought to be sorted out too. Five years not three for residency. Parents not Grandparents for qualification via family. 
I'm not saying here that England have been exemplary in some of their selections Barrit is perhaps moot. Hard to deny his qualification as he is a UK passport holder but, given his history I'd rather not have picked him. Waldrom is another. He moved to the UK to play in a different environment and it was found he qualified through the Grandparent rule. He was not targeted by the RFU. However, as he is a dyed in the wool Kiwi I think we were wrong to pick him. He may have been deserving in regard to his performances and he may be qualified but was it "right"? IMO, No. Same for Hughes. Great player. Will be qualified for England soon. Should he be picked? IMO No. 
Hartley, Vunipolas and Tuilagi I have no problems with. They've been here for ages and have made the UK their home since they were kids or adolescents. Rokoduguni - again no problem with this one. He is a soldier first and foremost. If he is allowed to die for the UK I'm more than happy to let him play international rugby for any of the UK nations. Also he was not an established player that was targeted. 
I have to say I'm surprised at any fan defending the Project Player thing. I'd be devastated and ashamed if the RFU did something like that. I'd also question the sense in sending out a message to any aspiring genuine players that if we get the chance and see someone better than you elsewhere, then we'll dump you at a moment's notice. It just stinks from an ethical viewpoint and from a how to treat your own players viewpoint. I honestly think that if England were stacked with a load of foreign mercenaries I would lose any desire to see them play.
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To repeat myself - I basically agree with your point. Project players should require 5 or 6 years residency period.

The Silver Fern

Exodus 2016