Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final
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@crazy-horse said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@mn5 said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@chris-b said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@mn5 said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
Not sure how accurate this article is, did those four Windies quicks really only play SIX tests together ? ( I have vague memories of Colin Croft having an outstanding but short career too ).
Whilst I love what our boys have done I’m not sure they’re at that level.
It probably is.
Roberts was near the end of his career when Marshall came on the scene. And as you point out, Croft was in the mix - as well as a production line of guys who played bit parts - Wayne Daniel, Winston Davis, Patrick Patterson, Sylvester Clarke, etc - any of whom we would have loved to have had.
It's interesting that Chappell picks Roberts as the scariest he face. I wonder if he faced Croffie? Probably in WSC. He was a scary mother - from what I've read, might have been a bit unbalanced. I recall Viv Richards said (after Croft became a pilot) that if he ever heard "This is your captain Croft speaking", he'd get off the plane!
Relatively speaking Roberts had the “worst” record too, averaging 25. Croft, Bishop and Walsh were all under that and Garner, Ambrose and Marshall had the nerve to average even better than our boy Paddles !
I agree about Croft, he looked pretty unhinged. How he didn’t get banned for life for this is beyond me.
I always thought Goodall had a very punchabke face. And dear I say it, almost Adolph like. I can see why he got under the skin of the Windies.
Just watched again, how good is it hearing Peter Williams ? Like Geoff Bryan it’s pretty cool hearing sports commentators of my youth still going strong today.
Was the umpiring really that bad or was it sour grapes from the Windies ? Given I was three years old at the time it’s fair to say my memory is a bit hazy so any recollections from old ferners would be appreciated.
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@mn5 I was only 10 so I don’t recall either. All I remember is the controversy and the piss take song someone did to the tune of Cecelia. It went along the lines of "Mr Goodall, you're breaking my heart..."
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@crazy-horse said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@mn5 I was only 10 so I don’t recall either. All I remember is the controversy and the piss take song someone did to the tune of Cecelia. It went along the lines of "Mr Goodall, you're breaking my heart..."
Well in any case a pretty ordinary team beat a brilliant one in a series. Even without Viv Richards that Windies side had some excellent players.
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@mn5 I think the umpiring was pretty bad. Can't remember whose book it was said there were several clear decisions not given in our famous second innings - might have been Geoff Howarth's.
I think it got attributed to the bowlers being so much quicker than our umpires were used to.
I think Fred was a schoolmaster and might have umpired like it.
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@chris-b said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@mn5 I think the umpiring was pretty bad. Can't remember whose book it was said there were several clear decisions not given in our famous second innings - might have been Geoff Howarth's.
I think it got attributed to the bowlers being so much quicker than our umpires were used to.
I think Fred was a schoolmaster and might have umpired like it.
Also ( and this may be wrong, going off hazy recollections of the Hadlee video I had ) I think Paddles nicked one but didn’t walk because in his words he’d had decisions go against him in the series.
He did go on and get his maiden ton as well.
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@chris-b said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@mn5 I just had a quick look and it was Lance Cairns' book I'm thinking of.
He says both sides got some poor decisions but the Windies probably got more. The Windies bowled a lot of short stuff and brushed several gloves that weren't given.
Surely they coulda flown a neutral umpire over for the match. I can see how the Windies woulda been pissed off.
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@chris-b said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@mn5 That was a Boxing Day test - the third and final in a series....last wicket we needed.
Australia won the 3-match series 1-0
Yep and Paddles to his credit went up and shook Whitneys hand for being such a battler.
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@mn5 said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@crazy-horse said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@mn5 said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@chris-b said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@mn5 said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
Not sure how accurate this article is, did those four Windies quicks really only play SIX tests together ? ( I have vague memories of Colin Croft having an outstanding but short career too ).
Whilst I love what our boys have done I’m not sure they’re at that level.
It probably is.
Roberts was near the end of his career when Marshall came on the scene. And as you point out, Croft was in the mix - as well as a production line of guys who played bit parts - Wayne Daniel, Winston Davis, Patrick Patterson, Sylvester Clarke, etc - any of whom we would have loved to have had.
It's interesting that Chappell picks Roberts as the scariest he face. I wonder if he faced Croffie? Probably in WSC. He was a scary mother - from what I've read, might have been a bit unbalanced. I recall Viv Richards said (after Croft became a pilot) that if he ever heard "This is your captain Croft speaking", he'd get off the plane!
Relatively speaking Roberts had the “worst” record too, averaging 25. Croft, Bishop and Walsh were all under that and Garner, Ambrose and Marshall had the nerve to average even better than our boy Paddles !
I agree about Croft, he looked pretty unhinged. How he didn’t get banned for life for this is beyond me.
I always thought Goodall had a very punchabke face. And dear I say it, almost Adolph like. I can see why he got under the skin of the Windies.
Just watched again, how good is it hearing Peter Williams ? Like Geoff Bryan it’s pretty cool hearing sports commentators of my youth still going strong today.
Was the umpiring really that bad or was it sour grapes from the Windies ? Given I was three years old at the time it’s fair to say my memory is a bit hazy so any recollections from old ferners would be appreciated.
Was only 11, but I think a bit of both.
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@mn5 said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@chris-b said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@mn5 I just had a quick look and it was Lance Cairns' book I'm thinking of.
He says both sides got some poor decisions but the Windies probably got more. The Windies bowled a lot of short stuff and brushed several gloves that weren't given.
Surely they coulda flown a neutral umpire over for the match. I can see how the Windies woulda been pissed off.
Not a thing in those days
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@chris-b said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
@mn5 Yeah - thought you'd remember the incident.
Dick's name is ingrained in my memory - along with Ian Robinson of Zimbabwe!
Gillespie giving Cairns to Parore down leg.
And was he Waugh to Parore off Vettori as well?
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If we were to start a thread on shameful umpiring decisions it would rival Test Ignore and probably break the Internet.
I remember in the 80's Wisden did some analysis of LBW's and NZ was the only country where the visiting team's % out LBW was lower than it was in their home country and lower than NZ's.
Every other country there was a clear advantage to the home team. Some of which could be explained e.g. sub-continent players beater at coping with spin but the article was a leading part of Wisden's campaign for neutral umps.
I think they decided NZ umpires had an unconscious bias that favoured visiting teams because our umpires expected overseas players to be better than ours.
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@dogmeat said in Cricket 2021: NZ in England and WTC Final:
If we were to start a thread on shameful umpiring decisions it would rival Test Ignore and probably break the Internet.
I remember in the 80's Wisden did some analysis of LBW's and NZ was the only country where the visiting team's % out LBW was lower than it was in their home country and lower than NZ's.
Every other country there was a clear advantage to the home team. Some of which could be explained e.g. sub-continent players beater at coping with spin but the article was a leading part of Wisden's campaign for neutral umps.
I think they decided NZ umpires had an unconscious bias that favoured visiting teams because our umpires expected overseas players to be better than ours.
Pakistan would have been a country when you were visiting you simply wouldn’t allow the ball to hit your pads. I suspect you could have been a foot outside off stump got an inside edge onto your pads and still given out.
