All Blacks 2021
-
@nzbloke said in All Blacks 2021:
It amazes me though how some here hardly ever question this current coaching staff
TBF, I haven't seen that. There's obvious disagreements on the root causes of the current problems and what should be done but I haven't seen anyone say everything is OK in the garden.
-
Of course all the the members are not happy with the current coaching set up fellas, that's a given, otherwise they may as well be on a knitting forum ...I'm saying would like to see more analysing in depth about it.
-
@nzbloke its been done to death, you're late to the party, everyones not going to repeat what they've been saying for the last 2-3 years for you
-
@kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2021:
@nzbloke its been done to death, you're late to the party, everyones not going to repeat what they've been saying for the last 2-3 years for you
Even down to what religion Foster is and his eating habits.
-
@nzbloke said in All Blacks 2021:
Of course all the the members are not happy with the current coaching set up fellas, that's a given, otherwise they may as well be on a knitting forum ...I'm saying would like to see more analysing in depth about it.
You need to reword your statements to something we understand.
"It amazes me though how some here hardly ever question this current coaching staff - anyone that knows their rugby properly can see where we are going wrong & can also see what adjustments need to be made to fix it."
That doesn't equal what you have just post.
-
@hooroo said in All Blacks 2021:
anyone that knows their rugby properly can see where we are going wrong & can also see what adjustments need to be made to fix it."
arrogance
-
@hooroo said in All Blacks 2021:
@nzbloke said in All Blacks 2021:
@chris said in All Blacks 2021:
@nzbloke said in All Blacks 2021:
@chris said in All Blacks 2021:
@nzbloke said in All Blacks 2021:
you mean here you moan again.
No I mean more sanctimoniousness dribble.
If anyone is talking verbal diarrhoea it's you.
You tend to think the sun shines out of Foster... so what has he actually added to the team of any value then ?
When have I ever said that ,
Read my posts I have smashed Foster for 2 years .
I have been one of his biggest critics.So more crap from you yet again.
It amazes me though how some here hardly ever question this current coaching staff - anyone that knows their rugby properly can see where we are going wrong & can also see what adjustments need to be made to fix it.
This whole forum criticises the current set up. Maybe one or two have slightly defended him but not really. Your comment makes no sense in this environment.
Even the Waikato and Chiefs supporters are saying he shouldn't be there.
This isn't Cantabs defending the Deans dross, this is a united front against Foster for the most.
Especially the Waikato and Chiefs supporters are saying he shouldn't be there.
And me. And Chris. And quite a few others..
While many have pointed out the shit performances, quite a few also noted our glaring weaknesses are being more and more effectively exploited by other teams and the coaches don't know how to stem the bleeding. (IMHO). -
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2021:
@hooroo said in All Blacks 2021:
anyone that knows their rugby properly can see where we are going wrong & can also see what adjustments need to be made to fix it."
arrogance
Actually I see some logic here:
People who know their rugby properly should see where things going wrong and how to fix them.
If the poster is arrogant in thinking they are one of these proper rugby experts, I can find you a forum full of similar self-justified opinions. Here. -
I'm quite happy people here defend Foster, as I struggle to see the good myself.
Changing the assistants, and bringing in an international coach, does suggest to me some in NZ rugby have similar misgivings. Or are all these changes the product of an agile, resourceful, Ian Foster mind? -
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2021:
I'm quite happy people here defend Foster, as I struggle to see the good myself.
Changing the assistants, and bringing in an international coach, does suggest to me some in NZ rugby have similar misgivings. Or are all these changes the product of an agile, resourceful, Ian Foster mind?Or I need help because I don't know what I am doing kind of Mr Foster.Help save my job, by finding people who know how to fix this mess I have created..
-
@chris said in All Blacks 2021:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2021:
I'm quite happy people here defend Foster, as I struggle to see the good myself.
Changing the assistants, and bringing in an international coach, does suggest to me some in NZ rugby have similar misgivings. Or are all these changes the product of an agile, resourceful, Ian Foster mind?Or I need help because I don't know what I am doing kind of Mr Foster.Help save my job, by finding people who know how to fix this mess I have created..
Yeah I think he has good friends at the top.
-
this will be taken incorrectly by some but
I have seen many instances in other sports where head coaches are dead men walking, blokes thought ot not have a fucking clue, and the popular opinion was they needed to be sacked. They changed all the assistants and lo, there was a huge turn around in results.
One for a couple of guys on here is Damien Hardwick Richmond were trapped at 9th, they were going nowhere, and everyone thought the coach should get fired. Richmond kept him, but got rid of heaps of others. What, 5 years later he's regarded as basically the best coach in the league, with Richmond being the best side over that time, winning a bunch of flags.
-
I wonder if Razor was ever offered a 'team' role or he insists on being head honcho or nothing?
When you take the all or nothing approach the risk of nothing comes with it. As much as I would hate to lose Razor to NZ Rugby the NZRU had (in their minds) good reason to appoint Foster. He knows the international demands on teams and how to manage it (although Covid has thrown him some curve balls that possibly forced errors). You don't just throw that experience away.
Could we not have Foster managing the team with Razor being in charge of on field stuff with a view of taking over when Foster goes? -
It would make sense to give Robertson the NZ A team if they do play games this season.
-
@nostrildamus Does anyone anticipate further regig of the assistant coaching staff?
-
taniwharugbyreplied to mariner4life on 25 Jan 2022, 02:19 last edited by taniwharugby 25 Jan 2022, 02:21
@mariner4life it is like any organisation though isnt it if you dont have a good support team.
I would bet money that if Wayne Smith returned into Fozzies team, we'd see changes almost immediately (hoping for something similar with Schmidt)
Some people are meant to lead, but doesnt mean they dont need good assistants/advisors/team, similarly, some are not meant to lead, but thier value to the leader is imeasurable.
Sure NZR got it wrong with Fozzie, and I can understand the need to allow him to pick his team, but I think with the relatively weak team he assembled, coupled with his, er, indifferent record as head coach created a perfect storm of mediocrity.
-
@sbw1 said in All Blacks 2021:
@nostrildamus Does anyone anticipate further regig of the assistant coaching staff?
yes
and if there is not, then i would really like that decision explained. I will not, however, hold my breath.
-
It's concerning to me that McLeod is the assistant that has been with the team the longest.
This will be McLeod's 6th season with the All Blacks as defence coach if he stays on.
The defence has been concerning for a long time.
-
kiwi_expatreplied to taniwharugby on 25 Jan 2022, 02:37 last edited by kiwi_expat 25 Jan 2022, 02:40
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2021:
@mariner4life it is like any organisation though isnt it if you dont have a good support team.
I would bet money that if Wayne Smith returned into Fozzies team, we'd see changes almost immediately (hoping for something similar with Schmidt)
Some people are meant to lead, but doesnt mean they dont need good assistants/advisors/team, similarly, some are not meant to lead, but thier value to the leader is imeasurable.
Sure NZR got it wrong with Fozzie, and I can understand the need to allow him to pick his team, but I think with the relatively weak team he assembled, coupled with his, er, indifferent record as head coach created a perfect storm of mediocrity.
Except Victor Meldrew would have you believe Foster's assistants were foisted upon him unwillingly.
-
@kiwi_expat You gotta relax, dude. The season hasn't even started yet.
-
@kiwi_expat I guess maybe they were in a way if his preferred assistants were unavailable...
-
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2021:
@mariner4life it is like any organisation though isnt it if you dont have a good support team.
I would bet money that if Wayne Smith returned into Fozzies team, we'd see changes almost immediately (hoping for something similar with Schmidt)
Some people are meant to lead, but doesnt mean they dont need good assistants/advisors/team, similarly, some are not meant to lead, but thier value to the leader is imeasurable.
Sure NZR got it wrong with Fozzie, and I can understand the need to allow him to pick his team, but I think with the relatively weak team he assembled, coupled with his, er, indifferent record as head coach created a perfect storm of mediocrity.
Except Victor Meldrew would have you believe Foster's assistants were foisted upon him unwillingly.
dude, chill, unless i have missed some other posts, @Victor-Meldrew 's post really did just sound like questioning how the assistants would be decided, has it been taken off fozzie hands and so we might get some positive change? does he get the ultimate call and so we might see more of the same
-
@kiwimurph said in All Blacks 2021:
It's concerning to me that McLeod is the assistant that has been with the team the longest.
This will be McLeod's 6th season with the All Blacks as defence coach if he stays on.
The defence has been concerning for a long time.
It was a big surprise when he was first appointed IIRC and I have seen no obvious evidence that he brings anything better than average.
In fact we have insisted on playing contrary to the rest of the world. That would be great if the point of difference was effective for us but the opposite has happened and astute coaches have instead taken advantage.
It was frustrating to watch England keep pushing us back like we were the Warriors on a bad day.
Rope a dope has proven to be a terrible idea. -
@sbw1 said in All Blacks 2021:
@crucial Has Warren Gatland or Chris Boyd been considered for an All Black role. I think John Mitchell should be called upon especially when taking on England.
Under the current law management by refs it has been proven time and time again that league style defensive systems work the best.
We need to adapt to that unless we are aware of some law interpretation that is going to change that picture.
Instead of trying to isolate ball carriers on our side and work off turnovers we need to be forcing errors and doing the same.
I don't see any of our Super teams really doing that well except maybe the Blues. We are meeting the opposition on the gain line at best (or using umbrella defenses to try and force the runners back toward the forwards. -
@mariner4life Chris Boyd...
-
@crucial said in All Blacks 2021:
@kiwimurph said in All Blacks 2021:
It's concerning to me that McLeod is the assistant that has been with the team the longest.
This will be McLeod's 6th season with the All Blacks as defence coach if he stays on.
The defence has been concerning for a long time.
It was a big surprise when he was first appointed IIRC and I have seen no obvious evidence that he brings anything better than average.
In fact we have insisted on playing contrary to the rest of the world. That would be great if the point of difference was effective for us but the opposite has happened and astute coaches have instead taken advantage.
It was frustrating to watch England keep pushing us back like we were the Warriors on a bad day.
Rope a dope has proven to be a terrible idea.That line struck deep into my terrified heart.
-
@sbw1 said in All Blacks 2021:
@crucial Has Warren Gatland or Chris Boyd been considered for an All Black role. I think John Mitchell should be called upon especially when taking on England.
Please, not Warren. We have had our quota of Chief coaches, surely?
-
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2021:
@mariner4life it is like any organisation though isnt it if you dont have a good support team.
I would bet money that if Wayne Smith returned into Fozzies team, we'd see changes almost immediately (hoping for something similar with Schmidt)
Some people are meant to lead, but doesnt mean they dont need good assistants/advisors/team, similarly, some are not meant to lead, but thier value to the leader is imeasurable.
Sure NZR got it wrong with Fozzie, and I can understand the need to allow him to pick his team, but I think with the relatively weak team he assembled, coupled with his, er, indifferent record as head coach created a perfect storm of mediocrity.
Except Victor Meldrew would have you believe Foster's assistants were foisted upon him unwillingly.
You own a bull terrier, don't you!? Just can't let it go!
-
nostrildamusreplied to nostrildamus on 25 Jan 2022, 08:33 last edited by nostrildamus 25 Jan 2022, 08:33
I'm pretty sure in articles Foster went on about his coaching team so I personally feel he chose them, but haven't found the article yet.
I have however found some of Ian Foster's stellar analysis, such as after the Ireland game, where he blames the players, not any coach:
-
Victor Meldrewreplied to kiwi_expat on 25 Jan 2022, 09:15 last edited by Victor Meldrew 25 Jan 2022, 09:30
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
Except Victor Meldrew would have you believe Foster's assistants were foisted upon him unwillingly.
Well, obviously I wouldn't, as I have never said they were.
-
Victor Meldrewreplied to nostrildamus on 25 Jan 2022, 09:22 last edited by Victor Meldrew 25 Jan 2022, 09:31
I'm pretty sure in articles Foster went on about his coaching team so I personally feel he chose them.
That could just be a taking ownership thing.
The question for me is around the who selection process for the Assistants. Was or is he able to recruit who he likes, does the NZRFU give a list of candidates, or do they work with the coach to give him what he needs while maintaining continuity/ building experience of coaching the national team?
The sort of thing any review should look at, as it doesn't seem to be working...
I have however found some of Ian Foster's stellar analysis, such as after the Ireland game, where he blames the players, not any coach:
What part of his analysis didn't you agree with? I thought it was pretty much in line with the post-match comments on here and other media, particularly the kicking away of possession and playing like headless chooks under pressure which has been evident for 4-5 years
Th real question to Foster should be: So what are you going to do about it?
-
kiwi_expatreplied to Victor Meldrew on 25 Jan 2022, 09:36 last edited by kiwi_expat 25 Jan 2022, 09:39
@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks 2021:
The question for me is around the who selection process for the Assistants. Was or is he able to recruit who he likes, does the NZRFU give a list of candidates, or do they work with the coach to give him what he needs while maintaining continuity/ building experience of coaching the national team?
"We have made it clear that anybody who gets into this process, come along with your team," Impey said.
"Whether it's your scrum coach, your backs coach, your defence coach, whatever it is we want to see a team going forward."
"Those 26 candidates know what we've been saying so we're expecting that in the applications."
-
Victor Meldrewreplied to kiwi_expat on 25 Jan 2022, 09:38 last edited by Victor Meldrew 25 Jan 2022, 09:43
And your point is what exactly?
How does Impey saying "come along with your team," translate into "you have 100% carte blanche to choose who you like"?
-
@crucial said in All Blacks 2021:
Instead of trying to isolate ball carriers on our side and work off turnovers we need to be forcing errors and doing the same.
I don't see any of our Super teams really doing that well except maybe the Blues. We are meeting the opposition on the gain line at best (or using umbrella defenses to try and force the runners back toward the forwards.Pretty much this 100%. We have to question if NZ Super Rugby teams are preparing players for international completion
-
@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks 2021:
@crucial said in All Blacks 2021:
Instead of trying to isolate ball carriers on our side and work off turnovers we need to be forcing errors and doing the same.
I don't see any of our Super teams really doing that well except maybe the Blues. We are meeting the opposition on the gain line at best (or using umbrella defenses to try and force the runners back toward the forwards.Pretty much this 100%. We have to question if NZ Super Rugby teams are preparing players for international completion
To be fair to them, that's not their role. If NZR want to use it as a defacto Test competition, then they should ensure the seasonal be rules are conducive rather than the entertainment they've backed.
I'm a firm believer that coaching careers are made on the back of rosters. More astute observers can see a coach that gets more than the sum of their players.
And that goes double for assistants. I don't think there's a person on this forum who doesn't believe Wayne Smith bettered every setup he was involved in.
It's entirely possible that he's saddled with donkeys because everyone else was already engaged. What's not arguable in my mind is Mooar has to go.
-
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2021:
@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks 2021:
@crucial said in All Blacks 2021:
Instead of trying to isolate ball carriers on our side and work off turnovers we need to be forcing errors and doing the same.
I don't see any of our Super teams really doing that well except maybe the Blues. We are meeting the opposition on the gain line at best (or using umbrella defenses to try and force the runners back toward the forwards.Pretty much this 100%. We have to question if NZ Super Rugby teams are preparing players for international completion
To be fair to them, that's not their role. If NZR want to use it as a defacto Test competition, then they should ensure the seasonal be rules are conducive rather than the entertainment they've backed.
Agreed. Need for joined-up thinking across the piece is pretty clear to me. Interesting comment you make on "entertainment" - makes me wonder how much the $$ is influencing things more than before
It's entirely possible that he's saddled with donkeys because everyone else was already engaged.
If you're appointing a new coach, wouldn't you want to ensure you had the ducks reasonably in a row, assistant-wise, first?
-
@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks 2021:
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2021:
@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks 2021:
@crucial said in All Blacks 2021:
Instead of trying to isolate ball carriers on our side and work off turnovers we need to be forcing errors and doing the same.
I don't see any of our Super teams really doing that well except maybe the Blues. We are meeting the opposition on the gain line at best (or using umbrella defenses to try and force the runners back toward the forwards.Pretty much this 100%. We have to question if NZ Super Rugby teams are preparing players for international completion
To be fair to them, that's not their role. If NZR want to use it as a defacto Test competition, then they should ensure the seasonal be rules are conducive rather than the entertainment they've backed.
Agreed. Need for joined-up thinking across the piece is pretty clear to me. Interesting comment you make on "entertainment" - makes me wonder how much the $$ is influencing things more than before
It's entirely possible that he's saddled with donkeys because everyone else was already engaged.
If you're appointing a new coach, wouldn't you want to ensure you had the ducks reasonably in a row, assistant-wise, first?
I always thought applicants had their perspective coaching teams in place, as part of the selection process
-
Victor Meldrewreplied to canefan on 25 Jan 2022, 12:26 last edited by Victor Meldrew 25 Jan 2022, 12:27
@canefan said in All Blacks 2021:
I always thought applicants had their perspective coaching teams in place, as part of the selection process
It appears that they front up with a team in place, but I'd certainly think the selection panel/NZR to have a significant input on the final coaching set-up.
I can't believe that used a "take everyone or no-one" approach when deciding on the coaching group. Worrying if they do.
Post 3102 of 3293