Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?

Kiwiwomble

still working through how I feel about it

I follow and am a member of the Trust that Owns AFC Wimbledon in the English League 1. The Short story, our club was stolen and so a group of fans got together and started a new club at the bottom of the football pyramid, solely owned by a Trust we the fans owns shares in, one fan one vote deal

We have a rock solid constitution aimed at protecting the founding Principe of the club, "Fan Owned". We are getting to the point in the football ladder where that model is getting tested, financially. Building our new stadium last year has required a lot of us to invest cash, loans, grants...and finally a minority share holder.

It took a lot of work and tweaks, things like special shares, non transferable, limited voting rights so he got his profit but couldn't control the direction of the club

it can be done...but it has to be done properly

MN5

Well at least it beats being associated with a horrible beer like Steinlager.

rotated

I would need to see exact agreement before passing judgement (if it is just negotiating global media/digital rights then go ahead) but the first principle for me, as with the AIG sponsorship, has always been at least rationalize the ITM Cup and Super Rugby tournament before prostituting the All Black legacy.

kev

The shareholders of NZ Rugby are the clubs and the provinces - selling ownership is forever and my starting position is I hate it, but of course I don’t know the detail.

As soon as you put the short term profit motive (as businesses do) in front of longer term goals you will ruin the sport. I can just see the cost cutting discussions now.....Rugby in NZ has always been about participation in a team sport that’s a lot of fun. From that inclusiveness and its support you get an egalitarian sporting model - from club to provincial to S15 to the ABs. The All Black legacy is nothing without Clubs and Provinces. For me the ABs are just the cherry on top of NZ Rugby. If the English and French want to bankrupt themselves buying players they can’t afford let them - we should implement transfer fees though.

They can rationalise to their hearts content Super 15 rugby (or whatever it is now) but they should just leave the rest alone. Provinces are not just some branch office in a banking network.

Stargazer

Victor Meldrew

@Kiwiwomble

Sounds a bit like my old team, Wycombe Wanderers, who have a long history of supporter ownership but have also work closely (and successfully) with businessman like Ivor Beeks. The club has just negotiated a 75% sale to an American businessman but the supporter-owned trust still owns the ground and physical assets.

It has a phenomenal record of producing top flight managers too - Martin O'Neil, John Gregory & Lawrie Sanchez all cut their teeth at the club.

Victor Meldrew

@kev said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:

The shareholders of NZ Rugby are the clubs and the provinces - selling ownership is forever and my starting position is I hate it, but of course I don’t know the detail.

It CAN work (some football clubs have done it successfully) but needs the right partner and risks need to be managed.

Wonder if this is Covid cashflow-related - hope not as there could be dangers with a short-term view.

Machpants

@Victor-Meldrew is not covid related, it was talked about before. NZ rugby is totally unsustainable with the current structure, so they need to do something about it if we want to stay a world power

Snowy

@Machpants said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:

@Victor-Meldrew is not covid related, it was talked about before. NZ rugby is totally unsustainable with the current structure, so they need to do something about it if we want to stay a world power

Covid certainly didn't help (NZRU had a bit stashed away for a rainy day) but yes I do think that they need to restructure the business model. Profits mean players ultimately. Selling part of the business to private enterprise though...not convinced.

This is a bit out there, but I wonder how they would go with an IPO and a share of the business was distributed to the NZ population. I would buy in even knowing that I would get little or no ROI but I would get to keep my rugby team.

The odd thing about the finances is the NPC seems to be a major drain on cash and yet it is where our player base comes from as well as a lot of the fan support. All very difficult.

taniwharugby

@Snowy yeah I think WR had offered cash to the Unions, but NZ opted not to take thier's just yet?

Rapido

In fern tradition, I haven't read the article. It's cricket season, good time to release depressing news like this.

I'd rather nerd out on cricket stats than read a depressing article about private equity in the All Blacks. I'm going to assume it isn't true ... sometimes foreign media use the terms "All Blacks" and "NZRU" as meaning the same thing, I'm going to hope NZRU are looking for equity for a competition, not the team ... please?

Would it even be legal? Form a WR perspective? NZRU have 3 votes on the world council, as a representative of NZRU which is a representative of the provincial unions which are are representatives of the clubs.

Could we go all 1990 retrospective a-la every post from MN5 and speculate on a Rupert Murdoch buying 3 SARU votes from rugby-hating ANC stooges? etc etc

Snowy

@taniwharugby said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:

@Snowy yeah I think WR had offered cash to the Unions, but NZ opted not to take thier's just yet?

Hadn't heard that. Any idea what the terms were? Why would you not take it...

Rapido

I'd rather NZRU just gave up on competing at sub-national level, settled for top players being foreign based. Come back to play test rugby.

Obviously will play less tests per year (fine with me).

Then, if they are playing for foreign clubs I don't give a shit about, I won't even need to be angry ever again about terrible bland tribeless franchise rugby kits. Sub-national rugby has become so identity-less that I don't really care anymore.

Rapido

@Snowy said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:

@taniwharugby said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:

@Snowy yeah I think WR had offered cash to the Unions, but NZ opted not to take thier's just yet?

Hadn't heard that. Any idea what the terms were? Why would you not take it...

It's just bringing forward the payout from RWC years, where the Big 10 tier 1 unions get 'compensated' for not playing November and June EOYTs in a RWC year.

So, ARU had a cashflow crisis, WR paid them their future income 3 years early.

NZRU hasn't as they had 5 x this amount in their own reserves.

Just Australia and Wales, I think, have tapped it.
There is a separate, much smaller, pot. That WR have created as a covid crisis fund for tier 2s. I believe.

taniwharugby

@Snowy what he said

Victor Meldrew

@Machpants said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:

@Victor-Meldrew is not covid related, it was talked about before. NZ rugby is totally unsustainable with the current structure, so they need to do something about it if we want to stay a world power

Thanks. Is it the structure, the money from Silver Lake or both?