The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread
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@antipodean a rugby ball, two teams and a result?
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Ardie is a good player but he is a 7, he should be competing with Cane or on the bench. Jordie is a good player but he isn't a wing. Frizzell is a good player but he isn't proven test standard. The list goes on but these are all obvious to anyone with half a rugby brain.
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@sparky said in The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread:
Are any of us that surprised that Foster's team turned out to be shite?
Not really, they aren't even playing much rugby that is great to watch (one + game excepted).
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Great post, I've been stewing over this for the past few hours and I think you're right that the 'process' of appointing the new coach was just a way of appointing Foster. The key lesson from 2007 was that the best team to take forward was Ted, Smith, and Hanson. If we were looking for teams this time, it would probably be Joseph and Brown, but they didn't apply due to the 'process'.
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@Gunner said in The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread:
@canefan said in The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread:
@rotated said in The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread:
@canefan said in The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread:
@rotated said in The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread:
Pathetic. There is now way he can come back from this. Not sure what the options are at this point. Even if next season returns to a semi-normal schedule you pretty much have to fire him before the EOYT because you can't send a dead man walking off without an extension.
The faith of the players must already be slipping
Very hard to preach a 'high performance environment' when everyone knows they've been coached by at least a couple of better minds at lower levels.
Was this a Mark Robinson hire? Feels like something he would do....
Let’s be honest, Foster and the succession plan was locked in many moons ago.
Maybe this is the final end to a great era of success for the ABs (think Alex Ferguson and Man Utd) and Fozzie will be the catalyst that triggers a hard reset. We got 2 RWCs out of it, now the way forward is much less certain
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@canefan said in The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread:
@Gunner said in The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread:
@canefan said in The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread:
@rotated said in The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread:
@canefan said in The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread:
@rotated said in The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread:
Pathetic. There is now way he can come back from this. Not sure what the options are at this point. Even if next season returns to a semi-normal schedule you pretty much have to fire him before the EOYT because you can't send a dead man walking off without an extension.
The faith of the players must already be slipping
Very hard to preach a 'high performance environment' when everyone knows they've been coached by at least a couple of better minds at lower levels.
Was this a Mark Robinson hire? Feels like something he would do....
Let’s be honest, Foster and the succession plan was locked in many moons ago.
Maybe this is the final end to a great era of success for the ABs (think Alex Ferguson and Man Utd) and Fozzie will be the catalyst that triggers a hard reset. We got 2 RWCs out of it, now the way forward is much less certain
There's no maybe about it. It's well and truly ended. Probably ended a couple of years ago tbh.
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The last time we played smash it up the guts rugby against a defensive minded opposition was vs Ireland in the 2019 RWC QF. In that first half we totally eviscerated them by smashing them where they thought they were strong. Ever since then we have shown no inclination for playing a forward dominated direct style, and I can't think why not
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Rather than revisiting the appointment process, I'd like to look at another problem with the current AB coaching panel that is starting to become apparent - they are too afraid to make the tough selection calls.
In my opinion they simply can't make up their minds and are too afraid to pull the trigger on picking the right team; rather they want to put all of the individuals they rate on the field and hope that their individual brilliance will get us over the line.
I'm going to call it the "can't choose, so why not both" AB selection policy.
If you have two great 7s (Cane, Savea), let's choose both, and move one of them to 8 so we can have both, even though that means we'll have a misbalanced loose forward trio.
If you have two very good 13s, let's choose both, and move one of them to 12 where they won't be as effective. Even better, let's switch them around the wrong way so that they'll both be playing worse.
If you have two very good 10s, let's choose both, and move one of them to 15, where he can influence play and we can have two playmakers, but when the shit hits the fan neither of them will step up and drive the team around.
If you have two very good Barretts who can play 15, let's choose both, and move one of them to the wing, even though that will mean that one of the form players in the country will be out of position and will playing alongside his brother who is also playing out of position.
At least back in the day, when coaches chose between Buck versus Zinzan, or Mehrts versus Spencer, we at least knew where they were going and what they were looking towards, and those decisions drove the results and decisions (by the public) about their selections. These guys are just guessing, and they are hoping that by trying to keep as many people happy for as long as possible, they will stumble across a combination of "choose boths" that will actually be a good team.
But that exposes a fallacy in their approach. By choosing both, they clearly don't have a picture of the type of game that they want to play. For those who argue (as I have), that Cane should be 7 and Savea off the bench, it is based on an idea that we lead with physical dominance and finish with speed and energy - in other words basically the same pattern that won the WC in 2015. It may well be that we have to move on from that, and need to establish a new pattern where we use Savea's tools from 7 from minute 1, in which case it's time for Cane to go and for us to front up to identifying and implementing a new pattern of play.
Either way, these coaches need to start making decisions. Just choose.
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@canefan said in The 'How is Fozzie going?' thread:
The last time we played smash it up the guts rugby against a defensive minded opposition was vs Ireland in the 2019 RWC QF. In that first half we totally eviscerated them by smashing them where they thought they were strong. Ever since then we have shown no inclination for playing a forward dominated direct style, and I can't think why not
I was tempted to make a quip about keeping our powder dry, but won't.
That really is one of the key questions to be answered isn't it?
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Looking at the results of the last month, I reflect that the previous AB coach had to suggest that Foster look at Rieko vs Julian on the left flank.
I've seen enough that he won't select the best number eight in New Zealand as determined by SR A (Sotutu) which is followed up by not even benching Akira.
It's self evident that a golden period in All Black history coincided with a bunch of centurions. And for some reason we've determined a succession plan for coaches based on this. The house of cards is falling apart.
The underlying incompetence goes to NZR - a decade of astonishing success has covered over the incompetence of individuals relying on each other's resume to climb the greasy pole.
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We're playing the same game plan as 2015 with significantly worse players and hoping for the same results.
Actually that's not fair. 2015 we had more than 1 way to play.
Still better players but.
This is a new low for AB rugby as far as I am concerned. A supposedly superior team playing its 5th test against an inferior side playing it's first meaningful game?
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The Argentinians weren't even battle-hardened. Well done them.
But I also wonder if during the Bledisloe we have seen the limits to SB, kind of a shame he works hard. But there aren't many options at lock are there? -
@nostrildamus
Brodie was young when he burst on the international scene, not that we necessarily have another Brodie in the pipeline but Vaai was a no name with barely any pro rugby and he has done well. I'd be trying out more players rather than hoping SB turns into a test quality player, and SW and PT find their form and don't get injuries.Edit: super annoyed how Will Jordan has been handled.
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This may be a ridiculously harsh comment, but it's worth noting that Patty T has started, and been found wanting, in two key AB losses: Soldier field and Parramatta.
My point is that I think we are looking for more than one world class lock.
I wouldn't pick one of the five starters today in a world team. We're in deep shit.
