Springboks V All Blacks
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@mariner4life said in Springboks V All Blacks:
I think a telling indicator from the MoTM thread is Sam Whitelock has zero votes. In the absence of BBBR we have really needed him to stand up, but he has not risen to the occasion. Sam is a very very good lock, but jesus he's had a workload this year, the bloke looks like he needs a couple of months off.
Razor needs to start managing Sam's workload a bit better during Super Rugby. He plays him in virtually every game and usually for the entire 80 minutes, even when it's against weaker teams like the Sunwolves.
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From the MOTM thread:
https://www.thesilverfern.com/2018/10/08/stats-point-to-some-ab-problems/
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@akan004 said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@mariner4life said in Springboks V All Blacks:
I think a telling indicator from the MoTM thread is Sam Whitelock has zero votes. In the absence of BBBR we have really needed him to stand up, but he has not risen to the occasion. Sam is a very very good lock, but jesus he's had a workload this year, the bloke looks like he needs a couple of months off.
Razor needs to start managing Sam's workload a bit better during Super Rugby. He plays him in virtually every game and usually for the entire 80 minutes, even when it's against weaker teams like the Sunwolves.
A quick google search tells me that Sam Whitelock was rested against the Sunwolves this year (not even on the bench).
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And look at the apologist brigade, piling in straight away...
So Sam's not tired, he's out of form?
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@mariner4life How do you conclude that from the reactions? And how do these responses make us "apologists"? I was just stating facts and did't express any opinion on Sam Whitelock's performance in yesterday's game or the possible reason for it.
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@stargazer said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@mariner4life How do you conclude that from the reactions? And how do these responses make us "apologists"? I was just stating facts and did't express any opinion on Sam Whitelock's performance in yesterday's game.
dude, it was a joke FFS
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@stargazer said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@akan004 Sam missed games due to a head knock and the mandatory rest games. He played in 14 of the 19 Crusaders games. That's less than Scott Barrett (also in minutes).
What about his minutes last year for the Crusaders when he didn't have the head knocks? I also was critical of Shag's selection of only three locks this year. Felt he had picked too many loosies and should have selected an extra lock instead.
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@akan004 said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@stargazer said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@akan004 Sam missed games due to a head knock and the mandatory rest games. He played in 14 of the 19 Crusaders games. That's less than Scott Barrett (also in minutes).
What about his minutes last year for the Crusaders when he didn't have the head knocks? I also was critical of Shag's selection of only three locks this year. Felt he had picked too many loosies and should have selected an extra lock instead.
At the risk of being labeled an apologist.
So you’re saying he’s tired from super rugby last year??
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@sammyc said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@akan004 said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@stargazer said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@akan004 Sam missed games due to a head knock and the mandatory rest games. He played in 14 of the 19 Crusaders games. That's less than Scott Barrett (also in minutes).
What about his minutes last year for the Crusaders when he didn't have the head knocks? I also was critical of Shag's selection of only three locks this year. Felt he had picked too many loosies and should have selected an extra lock instead.
At the risk of being labeled an apologist.
So you’re saying he’s tired from super rugby last year??
@SammyC You Apologist!
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@sammyc said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@akan004 said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@stargazer said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@akan004 Sam missed games due to a head knock and the mandatory rest games. He played in 14 of the 19 Crusaders games. That's less than Scott Barrett (also in minutes).
What about his minutes last year for the Crusaders when he didn't have the head knocks? I also was critical of Shag's selection of only three locks this year. Felt he had picked too many loosies and should have selected an extra lock instead.
At the risk of being labeled an apologist.
So you’re saying he’s tired from super rugby last year??
APOL...
sorry sorryActually, it could be a build up of a couple of years' work? How much did he have off last year? And i doubt he's the only one. But Sam feels ever-present from about 2011, that's a lot of wear and tear on a guy who puts himself about like he does, at all levels.
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@sammyc said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@akan004 said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@stargazer said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@akan004 Sam missed games due to a head knock and the mandatory rest games. He played in 14 of the 19 Crusaders games. That's less than Scott Barrett (also in minutes).
What about his minutes last year for the Crusaders when he didn't have the head knocks? I also was critical of Shag's selection of only three locks this year. Felt he had picked too many loosies and should have selected an extra lock instead.
At the risk of being labeled an apologist.
So you’re saying he’s tired from super rugby last year??
No, I am saying that had it not been for his head knocks, he would have had an equally taxing schedule this year as well.
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Geez we're hard taskmasters aren't we?
Second best lock in the word has one game where he wasn't exceptional but was still really good and we are questioning his form/fatigue management?
Rough!
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@mariner4life said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@sammyc said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@akan004 said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@stargazer said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@akan004 Sam missed games due to a head knock and the mandatory rest games. He played in 14 of the 19 Crusaders games. That's less than Scott Barrett (also in minutes).
What about his minutes last year for the Crusaders when he didn't have the head knocks? I also was critical of Shag's selection of only three locks this year. Felt he had picked too many loosies and should have selected an extra lock instead.
At the risk of being labeled an apologist.
So you’re saying he’s tired from super rugby last year??
APOL...
sorry sorryActually, it could be a build up of a couple of years' work? How much did he have off last year? And i doubt he's the only one. But Sam feels ever-present from about 2011, that's a lot of wear and tear on a guy who puts himself about like he does, at all levels.
I think he’s always been less effective without retallick next to him.
In my opinion Whitelocks best attributes are his work at lineouts, restarts, defense and cleanouts. Retalick has always been a much better ball runner.
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@sammyc said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@mariner4life said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@sammyc said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@akan004 said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@stargazer said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@akan004 Sam missed games due to a head knock and the mandatory rest games. He played in 14 of the 19 Crusaders games. That's less than Scott Barrett (also in minutes).
What about his minutes last year for the Crusaders when he didn't have the head knocks? I also was critical of Shag's selection of only three locks this year. Felt he had picked too many loosies and should have selected an extra lock instead.
At the risk of being labeled an apologist.
So you’re saying he’s tired from super rugby last year??
APOL...
sorry sorryActually, it could be a build up of a couple of years' work? How much did he have off last year? And i doubt he's the only one. But Sam feels ever-present from about 2011, that's a lot of wear and tear on a guy who puts himself about like he does, at all levels.
I think he’s always been less effective without retallick next to him.
In my opinion Whitelocks best attributes are his work at lineouts, restarts, defense and cleanouts. Retalick has always been a much better ball runner.
yep, agree, and that's why they are a great combo. It's the last 2 that were an issue for me on the weekend.
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He was quiet, but the (limited) stats show the he contributed pretty well by taking on some other duties too - most passes (5) by a forward, second most metres (12) off five runs, with 10 tackles (second highest) and two misses, with no penalities. It fucks me off how they don't add line outs won by the jumper, or kick off receipts, but he was good there.
Interestingly, it looks like Scott Barrett couldn't get the running game going that we look for from our other lock - six runs, five metres, with one penalty, 10 tackles, with two misses. Much of this should be put at SA defense too, they were good. Nevertheless, we are just a bit limited without BBBR there - he contributes so much, as he should, being probably the best player on the planet.
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This place gets more interesting when we throw in a few less than convincing games .
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@nevorian at Super Level I think Sam does have a good running game, while the closer confines of test rugby having him and BBBR together brings out the best in both and Sam not needing to take on that load.
Have we had many AB games with BBBR starting without Whitelock?
