Pommie BaaBaa & Froggie XV
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@antipodean I don't understand what you're saying. Those 8 internationals have been called up for France. The players they fielded were already in their squad or development squad. Why does it matter what nationality they have?
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@stargazer better for French rugby?
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@taniwharugby I was commenting on the remark about the clubs team sheets, not the quality of the French national team or French rugby in general.
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@stargazer but that is what I think @antipodean was saying that you said you didn't understand.
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@taniwharugby Maybe I should have asked @antipodean "What is a fault of their own making"? Having many players in the XV de France? Having many injuries? Having to field many second stringers and two amateur players as a result of all those missing players? If you're missing approx. 19 first choice players (= incl. a lot of French players), isn't it unavoidable that they have to field a lot of 2nd choice players (and 3rd choice players is some positions)? How is that a fault of their own making? And why would they have to rely on more French players if they're fielding more 2nd or 3rd choice players? It all depends on the players they have in their squad (and development squad). I don't know what nationality those 2nd or 3rd choice players have, but I don't see why it matters for putting names on the club's team sheet.
My initial response wasn't about the state of French rugby and their national team, because I agree that a (big) part of the problem is the influx of a lot of foreign players. I was solely responding to the comment about the team's line-ups and the way they played in this particular game.
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@stargazer If you rely more and more on foreign players, it harms the development of local, French eligible players. If both teams are fielding as @Crash put it; 'first and second string NZ/PI/SA player' where's the depth going to come from?
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Cruden made our backline look dangerous but I have to say I have noticed a distinct improvement in the last year or two in BB's tackling. And still not sure if he is better at 10 or 15. Perhaps when Jordie returns we will have a better idea.
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@nostrildamus Defo Jordie should take over the kicking duties from his bro anyway...
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11938489
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@antipodean said in Pommie BaaBaa & Froggie XV:
@stargazer If you rely more and more on foreign players, it harms the development of local, French eligible players. If both teams are fielding as @Crash put it; 'first and second string NZ/PI/SA player' where's the depth going to come from?
Exactly. But the millionaire club backers dont care a toss about international game, as long as their club keeps on winning, hence buying more foreign players
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It's also the quality of the game that is suffering in France. With all these old, fat and lazy foreigners, it doesn't make for a very good spectacle, does nothing to grow or evolve the game in France. Players like Sella, would run amok withtodays breed,.
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Have recently been watching some weekly Top 14 highlights. Echoing the above, I can't believe how many Fijian wingers play there! And sizable numbers of PI fatties, including several supersized locks.
Noticeable that many/most clubs go for size over technique. An exception is Clermont, which has two quite 'normal' (115kg) Frenchman, Slimani and Chaume (both in running for Saturday), props who often push the opposition fatties off the ball at scrum time. But somewhat easier to stop in loose than 130kg of prime PI beef! -
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@pakman said in Pommie BaaBaa & Froggie XV:
Read in today's Times that there are 700 professional and semi-professional PI rugby players in Europe. Many paid a pittance for teams as low as French sixth division.
I know Islanders who play rugby for free in NZ.
I hope you are up in arms about that too!
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@chester-draws I retired cos no one would pay me!
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NZ Development XV (latest)
**Perry/Harris/JTA/Savea/PatT/Bird/Ioane (A)/Whitelock (L)/TKB/DMac/Laumape/Goodhue/Seta T/Duffie/Havili
Bench: Crockett/Aumua/Moli/Hunt/Barrett (S)/Drummond/Mo'unga/ALB**
Questions: Bird to start, in line with his usual 60 minutes? Ioane (A) to get 40 minutes (assume Read and Cane will be rested); DMac to get 40 @ 10 -- what one would expect as no. 3 10; final bench back: made for a spare winger, but assuming Ioane (R) and Naholo will be rested and ALB has handy utility value.
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Looking at French test team I get the feeling they haven't picked much more than half their best team on Saturday and the official announcement bills NZ team as including a number of 'new' players. Expect the Tuesday side to be close to test strength, so will be a big challenge for NZ XV.
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French XV will have seasoned test locks and gnarly experienced Top 14 props. Backs will all have a fair number of caps each. Trinh Duc has been released to play. Sole area where they'll be very green is back row, where only Lauret has any test experience.
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NEWS | The All Blacks team has been named to play a French XV in the third match of the Vista 2017 All Blacks Northern Tour at Groupama Stadium (Parc Olympique Lyonnais) in Lyon on Tuesday 14 November.
The matchday 23 is as follows (with Test caps. Players making their first All Blacks appearance are in bold):
- Tim Perry
- Nathan Harris (9)
- Jeffery Toomaga-Allen (1)
- Patrick Tuipulotu (15)
- Dominic Bird (2)
- Liam Squire (13)
- Ardie Savea (22)
- Luke Whitelock (1) - captain
- Tawera Kerr-Barlow (27)
- Lima Sopoaga (13)
- Seta Tamanivalu (3)
- Ngani Laumape (4)
- Jack Goodhue
- Matt Duffie
- David Havili (3)
- Asafo Aumua
- Atu Moli
- Ofa Tu'ungafasi (12)
- Scott Barrett (15)
- Akira Ioane
- Dillon Hunt
- Mitch Drummond
- Richie Mo'unga
Loose forward Luke Whitelock, who was called into the All Blacks squad last week, will captain the All Blacks for the first time in what is a young, exciting All Blacks team. Fourteen players from the team which played the Barbarians return to the matchday 23 and six new All Blacks have been named: Jack Goodhue is at centre, while on the reserves bench Atu Moli has been named as prop cover. Akira Ioane and Dillon Hunt are loose forward cover off the bench. Mitch Drummond is reserve halfback and Richie Mo'unga is the other reserve back.
All Blacks Head Coach Steve Hansen said: "This is another exciting opportunity for a young, group of men to go out and experience what it's like to wear the All Blacks jersey and deal with all the pressures that come with that. We are sure that they will represent themselves, their families and the All Blacks proudly.
"Whilst Luke Whitelock is only playing his second game for the All Blacks, he was an obvious choice as captain given his experience and leadership as captain of both the Highlanders and Canterbury Mitre 10 Cup team. On behalf of the All Blacks, we'd like to congratulate Luke as well as the players who are pulling on the black jersey for the first time. It will be a proud moment for all of them."
Hansen added: "This match was included in the Vista Northern Tour itinerary at our request to allow us to provide an extra opportunity for this group. It'll allow us to continue to grow our depth, which will not only bode well for the here and now, but also 2019 and well beyond.
"This group has trained well and we're looking forward to watching them play at this level. We're expecting another boisterous crowd of 60,000 in Lyon which will create an exciting atmosphere for them and we're all looking forward to it."
Key notes
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Luke Whitelock will become the 133nd player to captain the All Blacks. 68 players have captained the Test side while Whitelock will become the 64th to captain the side in a non-Test.
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The Lyon match does not carry Test status so Test caps aren't awarded to those All Blacks who play in the match.
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The All Blacks have played in Lyon six times since 1964, with the last match against France in 2006 at Stade de Gerland, which the All Blacks won 47-3.
