2017-18 World Sevens Series
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Sherwin Stowers announces retirement from rugby
Sevens stalwart Sherwin Stowers has today announced his retirement from professional rugby after a prominent career for the All Blacks Sevens and Counties Manukau Steelers. Stowers debuted for New Zealand as an 18-year-old in Dubai in 2004. Since then he has made 38 tournament appearances and scored 126 tries, the fourth-most by any New Zealand player. Stowers has four World Series victories, Commonwealth Games gold and silver medals and a World Rugby Sevens World Cup title to his name. Stowers said after achieving so much in his rugby career, the time was right to turn his focus to home. "I decided that after nine seasons with the All Blacks Sevens team it’s time to retire and focus on my family, and being a dad. "With two young kids at home I wasn’t able to give as much to them as I would have liked between training, recovery, camps and travel. I would be doing the team an injustice if I kept playing without giving 110 per cent which I have always strived to do." Stowers paid tribute to his family in remembering an exciting career in the black jersey.Outside of Sevens, Stowers played 78 matches for the Counties Manukau Steelers and he has 18 caps for the Blues Super Rugby club.http://www.allblacks.com/News/31627/sherwin-stowers-hangs-up-the-boots
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Isn't the problem that ultimately no one really cares about sevens? The players just didn't value the Olympics that highly. A lot of players don't want to risk their careers for a one off tournament. Winning a gold medal would be a great achievement but it is no guarantee that the All Blacks would have made that happen.
How weren't Tew or Hansen transparent?
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@frye am sure if they only needed to be in camp a week or 2, a number would have put up tier hands, but the longer term commitment was harder for them I expect as they are trying to establish thier AB career without stalling it for a year in 7s
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Above all, I think, men's sevens has an image problem in NZ. Ever wondered why Richie McCaw is almost considered a deity in NZ, but not a successful 7s captain like DJ Forbes (six Sevens Series titles, a Sevens World Cup and two Commonwealth Games gold medals)? Why do large number of rugby players and rugby fans, including on the fern, consider sevens as a "lesser" version of rugby than XVs? If a player can get a professional XVs contract (particularly Super Rugby), that's what he'll prioritise, and he's lost to sevens. Even if he can earn a professional 7s contract. And that applies also to players who will never be good enough to become ABs. You don't have that in some other countries, where a professional XVs competition doesn't seem to have that impact. Clear example is South Africa, which has consistently performed well in the World Series. Only twice in the last ten seasons, they've finished outside the top 4 in the World Series (fifth & sixth).
Changing that image should start at the top at NZR, and then trickle down. Not just their PR, but also anything that can enhance performance (like the centralisation that has only just been introduced this year), improve coaching, improve player selection and depth. If results improve, image will improve as well. Start winning, and more players will want to play the code and more rugby fans will appreciate the code. The thing is, NZR has never given sevens enough priority, probably because the financial return is lower. It's all about the money! Isn't it?
What I've also noticed is that the AB7s had to release players with an NPC contract - for example, Koroi to Otago - before the Sevens Series had finished. That's ridiculous. SR players join their NPC team after SR has finished. There's no reason why the same can't apply to AB7s players. The last leg of the upcoming Series is early June 2018. That's also NZR's job.
Another problem is player depth. In a rugby mad country like NZ there should be plenty of depth. The AB7s recruited a lot of new players last year, but the results were abysmal. Was that just a matter of bad selections and coaching? Or did they recruit mainly from XVs teams? I think they should start developing specialist sevens players much younger than is (maybe) the case now. I know secondary schools do play sevens tournaments and the condor sevens is a great example, but maybe there need to be more structured competitions like there are in XVs? And maybe a male equivalent of the Going for Gold programme that has unearthed so much talented women's sevens players (converting netball, league, football, touch players into sevens players)? Again, that's something NZR should work on.
I've just been brainstorming in the previous paragraphs, but I think there's a lot more that NZR can do to improve the sevens game and its image. I'm convinced we don't need ABs or SR players to have a great and successful men's sevens team. But NZR must WANT it. Maybe they need an innovative board member especially for sevens?
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@frye Sevens is a totally different game now so it's not that simple. I think Tietjens would be doing BFA, BB etc a disservice by selecting them with little or no preparation and tournament play to build combinations. Half-measures usually aren't successful.
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@stargazer Sevens is a lesser game - it isn't comparable with 15s and never will be in NZ, that's why DJ isn't a deity.
Quite frankly for me personally, while I want the 7s team to do well I care more about AB pathways than 7s pathways. If 7s helps the ABs then all good, but I don't want the ABs to suffer because of 7s.
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@stargazer said in 2017-18 World Sevens Series:
Above all, I think, men's sevens has an image problem in NZ. Ever wondered why Richie McCaw is almost considered a deity in NZ, but not a successful 7s captain like DJ Forbes (six Sevens Series titles, a Sevens World Cup and two Commonwealth Games gold medals)? Why do large number of rugby players and rugby fans, including on the fern, consider sevens as a "lesser" version of rugby than XVs? If a player can get a professional XVs contract (particularly Super Rugby), that's what he'll prioritise, and he's lost to sevens. Even if he can earn a professional 7s contract. And that applies also to players who will never be good enough to become ABs. You don't have that in some other countries, where a professional XVs competition doesn't seem to have that impact. Clear example is South Africa, which has consistently performed well in the World Series. Only twice in the last ten seasons, they've finished outside the top 4 in the World Series (fifth & sixth).
Changing that image should start at the top at NZR, and then trickle down. Not just their PR, but also anything that can enhance performance (like the centralisation that has only just been introduced this year), improve coaching, improve player selection and depth. If results improve, image will improve as well. Start winning, and more players will want to play the code and more rugby fans will appreciate the code. The thing is, NZR has never given sevens enough priority, probably because the financial return is lower. It's all about the money! Isn't it?
What I've also noticed is that the AB7s had to release players with an NPC contract - for example, Koroi to Otago - before the Sevens Series had finished. That's ridiculous. SR players join their NPC team after SR has finished. There's no reason why the same can't apply to AB7s players. The last leg of the upcoming Series is early June 2018. That's also NZR's job.
Another problem is player depth. In a rugby mad country like NZ there should be plenty of depth. The AB7s recruited a lot of new players last year, but the results were abysmal. Was that just a matter of bad selections and coaching? Or did they recruit mainly from XVs teams? I think they should start developing specialist sevens players much younger than is (maybe) the case now. I know secondary schools do play sevens tournaments and the condor sevens is a great example, but maybe there need to be more structured competitions like there are in XVs? And maybe a male equivalent of the Going for Gold programme that has unearthed so much talented women's sevens players (converting netball, league, football, touch players into sevens players)? Again, that's something NZR should work on.
I've just been brainstorming in the previous paragraphs, but I think there's a lot more that NZR can do to improve the sevens game and its image. I'm convinced we don't need ABs or SR players to have a great and successful men's sevens team. But NZR must WANT it. Maybe they need an innovative board member especially for sevens?
The reason sevens isn't popular is because it isn't a very exciting sport to watch. The nature of sevens means that a player like Carlin Isles can be considered one of the best while having a very limited skill set. Sevens requires tremendous fitness and most of the players who play the sport are great athletes. Yet I just can't get that excited about a length of the field try when you are only beating 7 players. Games often turn on a few moments and are highly influenced by refereeing decisions. I have watched whole halves where one team doesn't even touch the ball.
You mention South Africa. South Africa seem to do better than us because they have better natural athletes. However, we have done far better than them over the past ten seasons. South Africa have been better over the past three but last season was the only one they were head and shoulders above us.
Sevens seems to be in the same position that woman's rugby is in. How can it generate revenue? You only have ten tournaments a year and most of that money probably goes to World Rugby. You also have sixteen teams to provide for. If you want to have professional sevens players like DJ Forbes treated like Richie McCaw then you are just going to struggle to find the money to do that. Any funding of Sevens like womens rugby will probably never get that financial return. So you have to ask yourself, is the prestige from winning worth the financial cost and the opportunity cost of spending that money on the grassroots? For Sevens I think the answer is no.
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@hydro11 My comparison of DJ Forbes and McCaw wasn't about pay. It was just an illustration of the wide gap between both codes as far as appreciation for the players and the game are concerned. In my opinion, that's - to a great degree - an image problem. You and @Nepia present it as facts that "sevens is a lesser game" or not "a very exciting sport to watch", but that's a very subjective opinion, even if it's shared by (many) others.
I personally think the well-performing teams of the last few years, South Africa's and Fiji's men's teams and Australia's and our very own NZ women's teams are very exciting to watch. I like the fast-paced games and good teams, and I think they display more skills than great speed and strength alone (I don't think Isles is that good). If the NZ men could play like that, they'd attract more publicity, more sponsorship, and also more talent. But NZR needs to invest (not just money!) before they can reap the rewards.
NZR must show that they take the game seriously, can be innovative by changing the training set-up and are willing to invest a bit more. It doesn't all revolve about player's pay, so it doesn't have to cost excessive amounts of money. I doubt other countries have thrown huge amounts at it. The reason why South Africa have done better than NZ the last few years is because the game has been changing and they have adapted better (I mentioned the permanent, centralised training base as an example). NZ used to be ahead of everyone, but didn't keep up with the developments in the sport. Complete lack of vision on the part of NZ.
@hydro11 said in 2017-18 World Sevens Series:
South Africa seem to do better than us because they have better natural athletes.
That's just a silly comment. We have plenty of excellent natural athletes as well; the Ioane brothers are probably the tip of the athletic iceberg in NZ. I think a lot of those athletes for some reason remain undiscovered or end up in other sports.
Anyway, I don't think we'll agree on this. I think we can agree that improvements are necessary and better vision is needed to achieve those improvements.
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Titch talking to Veitch here (starts 3.20 in to first link):
http://120.138.20.16/WeekOnDemand/radiosport/2017.10.28-12.15.00-D.mp3
http://120.138.20.16/WeekOnDemand/radiosport/2017.10.28-12.30.00-D.mp3
A couple of random points.
I have no doubt that the players that pulled out were influenced to do so by the All Blacks. That's pretty much been confirmed by all parties.
That was wrong, especially Savea when he'd committed so heavily and been part of the team.
On that basis I don't blamr Titch for being pissed off.
Secondly we were ravaged by injury. Ben Lam was a huge blow, absolutely massive, Curry, DJ, SBW etc etc. As I heard Loosehead Len talking about later in the arvo you've got to have luck with injury in a tournament. He was actually referring to 2015 ABs (in response to moron and rugby hater Mark Watson ... but that's another story) but it applies durectly here.
Thirdly, not being able to pick XVs players meant he was left with his 7s specialists who have done fantastically over the previous 22 years, so could/should have been able to produce better.
In summary, swings and roundabouts, I have sympathy as I think it disrupted his campsign.
