Highlanders 2023
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@Kiwiwomble said in Highlanders 2023:
sometimes i wonder how much commentary effects how good we think the rugby is, i had to watch on mute and didn't actually think the quality was much worse than the rest of our season...although i see everyone commenting on how bad it was in the game thread
It's worth bearing in mind you were playing the Rebels, at home, without by far and away the Rebels most important player in Carter Gordon. Both teams were very poor.
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To add to my previous post, it's really disappointing as there's a handful of players that deserve so much better.
I'd really like to see what Ainsley, EdG, Dickson, Harmon, Renton, Smith, Gilbert could do on the back of good coaching, especially surrounded by the likes of MMT, Fakatava, TUJ, Lowe, CGB, Nareki.
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not saying it wasn't, just that it might be easier to forget about stuff, to just go with the flow and not scrutinise everything without the commentary
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@Bones said in Highlanders 2023:
To add to my previous post, it's really disappointing as there's a handful of players that deserve so much better.
I'd really like to see what Ainsley, EdG, Dickson, Harmon, Renton, Smith, Gilbert could do on the back of good coaching, especially surrounded by the likes of MMT, Fakatava, TUJ, Lowe, CGB, Nareki.
Half the players you have mentioned are highly average - that is part of the issue. Looking at next season, I think this could well be a rough top 23 + the rest:
- de Groot
- NEW HOOKER
- Ainsley (If he doesn't go overseas, he is off-contract)
- Parkinson (They'll back him to bounce back)
- Holland
- Withy
- Harmon
- Mikaele-Tu'u (I'm picking he is already re-signed, reckon we let Renton go, see below)
- Fakatava (Assuming he has re-signed, though slightly concerned as Landers have not announced)
- NEW FIRST FIVE
- Nareki
- NEW SECOND-FIVE
- NEW CENTRE
- Bogado
- Gilbert
- H Bell
- Lienert-Brown
- Ma'u
- Haig
- Broughton
- Hastie
- Millar
- Paea
- TUJ won't be back I don't think, and I think it could prove a good move for all parties
- Lowe is not starting quality, he has proven that having had an extended run. Nareki has done more in three games than he has done all year
- Garden-Bachop is also very average, and presumably off-contract. Plenty of outside backs about (Bring me Tavatavanawai please!) so I think he goes
- Renton gives 100%, but if you watch him closely, he dies in the tackle. An honest toiler, but the fact that he has arguably been our best this season says more about that other players than it does about him. If we keep him in the squad, cool, but we won't go anywhere with him as our starting 8.
Other notables absentees:
- Makalio and Marshall have both disappointed, can't see either of them staying
- Apisai is on a one-year contract, and I believe we will see Henry Bell and Jack Taylor next season, so can't see him staying as the coaches will be looking for a quality hooker (What is Tyrone Thompson up to?)
- Dickson was heavily linked to Japan, the situation with his brother may have changed that, but I'm working under the assumption he departs.
- Hunt is off-contract, hard to see a world where we re-sign him... they'd be an uproar!
- Timu is an interesting one. Can't really stay fit, but is an Otago boy, so might survive the chop, purely because you can't get rid of everyone. Likely to be in the squad still.
Other Squad Members:
Props: Inch + Two More (Sheck?)
Hooker: Taylor
Lock: Hicks (?) + One More
Loose Forwards: Michaels + One More
Halfback: Arscott
First Five: Hollinshead/Faleafaga
Midfielders: Timu, Te Hiwi + One More
Outside Backs: Lowe + One MoreThe summation:
- We still likely suck, unless we can find a two midfielders (though one would be a good start) growing on a tree somewhere. If Aumua is going to the Crusaders, is there a chance McLeod is available? (No don't be silly, but I'll keep my hopes up!).
- Also ideally need to find another number ten from somewhere, likely a returner from overseas, even if they end up playing second-fiddle to Millar (Lima?)
- Hopefully Kenny Lynn can reinvigorate the attack, and with some of the other teams around getting worse we can safely make the playoffs, aiming to be in the hunt for a home quarters... more likely we finish a comfortable sixth, but that would be an improvement.
We are heading in the right direction, I firmly believe that, and whilst I somewhat question the coaching, there is no doubt that the backs suck. I have faith in Dermody, carved out a good track record with Ta$man, players seem to like him, and did some nice stuff with us in that Trans- Ta$man comp. Also reckon our set defensive set-up has been solid, as has our ruck defence. Dave Dillon gets a pass mark from me, whilst Mr Whiffin will be back to the UK, and we'll pretend it never happened.
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is paea only there because we know he's still under contract?
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@friedrugby said in Highlanders 2023:
- Hunt is off-contract, hard to see a world where we re-sign him... they'd be an uproar!
Much as you guys don't like Mitch - and he's got some limitations - you've got to find three first fives that are better than him. They might well not want him as their number one option, but I wouldn't be rushing to sack him if I were the Highlanders.
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@Chris-B thats probably fair, he has looked much less of a liability the last couple of weeks coming of the bench.
The problem is thats his position, bench, come on to 10 or 15 depending on how things are going, we we havent embraced the idea that the bench are almost specilist positions in the their own right, we always have either players coming back from injury or young guys being blooded
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@Kiwiwomble Yeah - you've got to be careful what you wish for.
The Blues fans are moaning about Beaudy and want him ousted, the Canes fans think Morgan isn't up to it, I've got some pretty large reservations about a future with Fergus holding the reins at the Crusaders.
Hard to think Mitch isn't among the top 17 first fives in NZ (with RM and BB heading off). I wouldn't mind him back at the Crusaders (with Ferg and Kemara) if you do sack him.
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@Chris-B have you watched many highlander games over the last few years? he's slowly become a shadow of himself, even his goal kicking (before it was taken off him) slowly got more and more awkward looking and his % kept dropping
Personally i think he's got into his own head, he's thinking too much which i dont think works at 10 when you just dont have the time
i dont argue that he's still in the top 17 10's....but i 100% dont think he's one of the top 5 and thats what we should be aiming for
but i've also said all along he's better at 15, all his highlight for us are at 15
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@Chris-B said in Highlanders 2023:
@Kiwiwomble Yeah - you've got to be careful what you wish for.
The Blues fans are moaning about Beaudy and want him ousted, the Canes fans think Morgan isn't up to it, I've got some pretty large reservations about a future with Fergus holding the reins at the Crusaders.
Hard to think Mitch isn't among the top 17 first fives in NZ (with RM and BB heading off). I wouldn't mind him back at the Crusaders (with Ferg and Kemara) if you do sack him.
Maybe he does go well if he ever went back to the Crusaders but he clearly isn't the right fit at the Highlanders so you can't really compare the 2.
I'd be surprised if he hung around anyway as he isn't getting any younger and will probably wanna cash in now.
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@Chris-B said in Highlanders 2023:
I wouldn't mind him back at the Crusaders (with Ferg and Kemara) if you do sack him.
This bit worries me,I like what the little I have seen of Kemera.
I am pretty comfortable with Burke at 10 When Ritchie was taking his 4 game rest last season Fergus did a really good job.
His time at FB will help as a First Five you see what is in front of you back there.Mitch was great for us off the bench,in hind sight would not mind him off the bench to cover the other 2 behind our forward pack.
we will lose a MF with experience as well as Ritchie and Mitch has SR experience it may help. -
@Chris and thats where we'll always fall short, we obviously lured him down south with the carrot of starting at 10....and we've given him plenty of chances there...but if we got someone else in and effectively said you're a bench option...most people, especially one that has a history with the crusaders, would rather sit on the bench for the crusaders than sit on the bench for the highlanders
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Hard to fix as the Landers need to be a top 4 team to attract those starting players.
I think you are going the right way producing through you Academy, will take time but they will stay loyal and you will grow a good team again.
There is some good young talent down there. -
@Chris yeah, cant see another way to do it sustainably, not going to lure pre made world class players whilst bottom of the table but cant get off the bottom without them...so we have to grow them
its always a worry though that IF we do manage to grow some....that they wont be lured away by other teams
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Who is your Highlander of the year?
Vote below for who you think deserves the fan's player of the year for 2023 and go in the draw to win a signed home jersey!
I went with renton, on paper was a clear second behind MMT of Frizell but has hugely taken the opportunity to step up
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@friedrugby said in Highlanders 2023:
Half the players you have mentioned are highly average - that is part of the issue.
They are the kind of players you can build on and rely on and get a lot more out of it you point them in the right direction - dollars to donuts Rennie or similar would've got us twice as many wins this season.
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@Chris-B said in Highlanders 2023:
@friedrugby said in Highlanders 2023:
- Hunt is off-contract, hard to see a world where we re-sign him... they'd be an uproar!
Much as you guys don't like Mitch - and he's got some limitations - you've got to find three first fives that are better than him. They might well not want him as their number one option, but I wouldn't be rushing to sack him if I were the Highlanders.
Well yeah, but who isn't as good? Tasesa Lavea can walk out there and shit the bed and look like a half decent game from Hunt. That's where we're at - I'm more than happy to have a kid out there getting better from a low point, than Hunt out there getting worse from a low point.
I'd also play any back or loosie at 13, ahead of Paea. Friz would go ten times better there.
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@Chris-B said in Highlanders 2023:
@friedrugby said in Highlanders 2023:
- Hunt is off-contract, hard to see a world where we re-sign him... they'd be an uproar!
Much as you guys don't like Mitch - and he's got some limitations - you've got to find three first fives that are better than him. They might well not want him as their number one option, but I wouldn't be rushing to sack him if I were the Highlanders.
Sometimes a clean break is just better though... Hunt is one of many players who is attached to the losing culture of the team, so getting him out and starting afresh I think is a better option.
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@Kiwiwomble said in Highlanders 2023:
is paea only there because we know he's still under contract?
Unsure... the coaches seem to like him, and I think he is fine as a squad option.
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@African-Monkey said in Highlanders 2023:
@Chris-B said in Highlanders 2023:
@Kiwiwomble Yeah - you've got to be careful what you wish for.
The Blues fans are moaning about Beaudy and want him ousted, the Canes fans think Morgan isn't up to it, I've got some pretty large reservations about a future with Fergus holding the reins at the Crusaders.
Hard to think Mitch isn't among the top 17 first fives in NZ (with RM and BB heading off). I wouldn't mind him back at the Crusaders (with Ferg and Kemara) if you do sack him.
Maybe he does go well if he ever went back to the Crusaders but he clearly isn't the right fit at the Highlanders so you can't really compare the 2.
I don't think it's about fit - I thin it's about talent.
There's probably a bunch of Super rugby second-stringers who would do not much better or much worse than Mitch at the Highlanders. If the best you can do is sign one of them, then it's deckchairs on the Titanic.
