GOAT
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@mariner4life said in GOAT:
@MajorRage agree with everything except
Steve still bats at 6 in my all time test XI.
He's in my team for his captaincy for sure.
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@KiwiMurph said in GOAT:
Almost all of these GOATs are assholes.
It's part of what makes them great.
Some are just better at hiding it than others.
Agree with this , in that they're all assholes
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Only thing I'd add, is that some are better than others at using their asshole-ness for the benefit of the team -
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@MajorRage said in GOAT:
@mariner4life said in GOAT:
@MajorRage agree with everything except
Steve still bats at 6 in my all time test XI.
He's in my team for his captaincy for sure.
Picking an Aussie all time middle order is tough.
Bradman walks in but how do you narrow down Ponting, Smith, G Chappell, Border and S Waugh for 4-6 ? Two fucken legends miss out, THREE miss out if Miller or Gilchrist bat six.
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@KiwiMurph said in GOAT:
Almost all of these GOATs are assholes.
It's part of what makes them great.
Some are just better at hiding it than others.
True, Usain Bolt an exception though. Although almost certainly juiced to the gills.
Yes but also huge natural advantages too.
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@MajorRage said in GOAT:
@mariner4life said in GOAT:
@MajorRage agree with everything except
Steve still bats at 6 in my all time test XI.
He's in my team for his captaincy for sure.
Picking an Aussie all time middle order is tough.
Bradman walks in but how do you narrow down Ponting, Smith, G Chappell, Border and S Waugh for 4-6 ? Two fucken legends miss out, THREE miss out if Miller or Gilchrist bat six.
@MajorRage said in GOAT:
@mariner4life said in GOAT:
@MajorRage agree with everything except
Steve still bats at 6 in my all time test XI.
He's in my team for his captaincy for sure.
Picking an Aussie all time middle order is tough.
Bradman walks in but how do you narrow down Ponting, Smith, G Chappell, Border and S Waugh for 4-6 ? Two fucken legends miss out, THREE miss out if Miller or Gilchrist bat six.
Easy, the bloke who presided over cheating with sandpaper misses out.
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@MajorRage said in GOAT:
@Mackerzzzz said in GOAT:
Imo it's definitely M Jordan, with Tom Brady a distant second, and Kelly Slater third.
Jordan had a drive to win like no other, were he would push intill asshole stage. He also had talent like few others
I just don't think it makes him an asshole. Just incredibly driven.
The interviews certainly didn't suggest he was an asshole. Yeah, he seriously pushed people who weren't up to his standards etc but that should be expected if you asked me. He acknowledged he crossed the line a few times (but who doesn't) and those he pushed, and crossed the line with, seemed to have serious respect for him.
Interesting that people can watch the same doco and reach a different conclusion - he fully came across as an asshole to me when I watched it.
I find it an interesting issue about leadership how setting a standard and brooking no transgressions can come across as being an arsehole. That recognising others simply aren't putting in the same amount of effort that you believe they should be and willing to have that uncomfortable conversation in no uncertain terms can be confronting.
Arsehole behaviour to me would be seeking to make others less than they could otherwise be for your own benefit.
Generally speaking on Jordan's worthiness to be GOAT: For all that he had talent, his work ethic, self belief and desire is what made him. Plenty of people get by on talent, it's difficult to get all the attributes. So difficult we hardly see it.
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@MajorRage said in GOAT:
@mariner4life said in GOAT:
@MajorRage agree with everything except
Steve still bats at 6 in my all time test XI.
He's in my team for his captaincy for sure.
Picking an Aussie all time middle order is tough.
Bradman walks in but how do you narrow down Ponting, Smith, G Chappell, Border and S Waugh for 4-6 ? Two fucken legends miss out, THREE miss out if Miller or Gilchrist bat six.
@MajorRage said in GOAT:
@mariner4life said in GOAT:
@MajorRage agree with everything except
Steve still bats at 6 in my all time test XI.
He's in my team for his captaincy for sure.
Picking an Aussie all time middle order is tough.
Bradman walks in but how do you narrow down Ponting, Smith, G Chappell, Border and S Waugh for 4-6 ? Two fucken legends miss out, THREE miss out if Miller or Gilchrist bat six.
Easy, the bloke who presided over cheating with sandpaper misses out.
Yeah that might sway it.
It’s a straight clash with him Ponting and G Chappell for me given that one of S Waugh or Border gets the 5-6 spot ( I’m not sure I can pick both of them )
Ponting was exceptional for soooooooooooo long although the average dipped a bit in his later years. The old man tells me G Chappell was brilliant, can’t say I remember him though.
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MJ is the greatest basketballer I’ve seen. I watched Dr J, Magic and Bird as a kid. Seen Hakeen, Shaq and Kobe. Watched Lebron since he was a high school kid and now seeing Luka absolute torch it up. But MJ is still the man as a complete package offensively, defensively and competitively.
Some of my favourite basketball is prior to the Bulls first three-peat and the Knicks EC semis and the Pistons CF series where MJ carried ordinary Bulls teams. Pistons were loaded and beat them in 88 and 89 in the ECFs but some of the ball MJ played on both ends was awesome.
He just got better and better and so did his team mates and the rest is history.
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@ACT-Crusader said in GOAT:
MJ is the greatest basketballer I’ve seen. I watched Dr J, Magic and Bird as a kid. Seen Hakeen, Shaq and Kobe. Watched Lebron since he was a high school kid and now seeing Luka absolute torch it up. But MJ is still the man as a complete package offensively, defensively and competitively.
Some of my favourite basketball is prior to the Bulls first three-peat and the Knicks EC semis and the Pistons CF series where MJ carried ordinary Bulls teams. Pistons were loaded and beat them in 88 and 89 in the ECFs but some of the ball MJ played on both ends was awesome.
He just got better and better and so did his team mates and the rest is history.
No argument here. Clear #1 for me, then #2 LeBron and I'd have Kareem #3.
The worst is hearing the generation after ours bang on about Kobe like he's anywhere close to the conversation. He's debatable for top 10 in my view.
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@mariner4life said in GOAT:
No argument here
liar, you are currently crying and drinking cask wine in your LBJ jammies
You're obviously right about the cask wine, but you know full well that I never wear pants with my Taco Tuesday Nightie
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@voodoo the way I think about Kobe is that if I was coach and I said I need 20 from you in the 4th quarter and we need to win - other than Wilt and MJ, Kobe will probably get 25 and hit the winning basket. From a pretty young age he understood how to exploit the seams and cracks in defences.
Plus the Kobe 9s are still the best basketball shoe I’ve ever played in 😉
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@ACT-Crusader said in GOAT:
@voodoo the way I think about Kobe is that if I was coach and I said I need 20 from you in the 4th quarter and we need to win - other than Wilt and MJ, Kobe will probably get 25 and hit the winning basket. From a pretty young age he understood how to exploit the seams and cracks in defences.
Plus the Kobe 9s are still the best basketball shoe I’ve ever played in 😉
Pffft. He was a gunner, a 44% volume shooter. Worked his ass off, and a genuine great. Just not top 5, maybe scrapes into top 10.
Also WTF?
Now this is a shoe
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@ACT-Crusader said in GOAT:
@voodoo the way I think about Kobe is that if I was coach and I said I need 20 from you in the 4th quarter and we need to win - other than Wilt and MJ, Kobe will probably get 25 and hit the winning basket. From a pretty young age he understood how to exploit the seams and cracks in defences.
Plus the Kobe 9s are still the best basketball shoe I’ve ever played in 😉
Pffft. He was a gunner, a 44% volume shooter. Worked his ass off, and a genuine great. Just not top 5, maybe scrapes into top 10.
Also WTF?
Now this is a shoe
Agreed, for me now Steph has displaced him in top 10.
I go:
- LeBron
- MJ
- Kareem
- Wilt
- Magic
- Bird
- Duncan
- Shaq
- Russell
- Steph
- Kobe
I know 1-2 winds people up, but for me the longevity now + much higher standard of "average" NBA player now vs 80s/90s gives it to LeBron. The game is truly international now.
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Arnold Schwarzenegger
