Super Rugby 2022
-
Do we need Australia?
I'm going to assume yes, so what could be a situation that works?
Three competitions that run during the same year: Super Rugby Aotearoa (10 teams), Super Rugby Australia (five - six teams), And Super Rugby Pacific (Heineken Cup / 2nd division / 3rd Division).
NZ retains rights to NZ Aotearoa and expands our number of teams. We meet Australian teams in the Super Rugby Pacific Competition if they want. or add Japanese teams (or both).
It's not ideal, but it could work, but if we keep Moana Pacfika and add another pacific team, we'd only need 3 more teams.
-
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
-
@gt12 said in Super Rugby 2022:
Do we need Australia?
I'm going to assume yes, so what could be a situation that works?
Three competitions that run during the same year: Super Rugby Aotearoa (10 teams), Super Rugby Australia (five - six teams), And Super Rugby Pacific (Heineken Cup / 2nd division / 3rd Division).
NZ retains rights to NZ Aotearoa and expands our number of teams. We meet Australian teams in the Super Rugby Pacific Competition if they want. or add Japanese teams (or both).
It's not ideal, but it could work, but if we keep Moana Pacfika and add another pacific team, we'd only need 3 more teams.
So the top teams qualify to play in the SRP comp in a UCL type scenario?
-
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
-
@gt12 said in Super Rugby 2022:
so what could be a situation that works
i doubt there is one
I get the feeling NZR is very wedded to the current structure.
The NZ rugby public doesn't really know what it wants.
We need lots of money or all our best players will leave
-
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
The only person who said we act like pricks in negotiations was Derpus. I can't say based on evidence that NZ are being pricks. The last time there was a proper dust up, Marinos was the one who was proven to be talking shit, and Robinson appeared to have acted honourably. He certainly didn't resort to airing dirty laundry in public
-
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
so you want me to lie?
i also don't believe this lovely utopia where two unions work together harmoniously exists. Especially because our only leverage in anything rugby related is that we are good at it.
-
@canefan said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
The only person who said we act like pricks in negotiations was Derpus. I can't say based on evidence that NZ are being pricks. The last time there was a proper dust up, Marinos was the one who was proven to be talking shit, and Robinson appeared to have acted honourably. He certainly didn't resort to airing dirty laundry in public
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
lol fuck off Derpus, NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards
-
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@canefan said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
The only person who said we act like pricks in negotiations was Derpus. I can't say based on evidence that NZ are being pricks. The last time there was a proper dust up, Marinos was the one who was proven to be talking shit, and Robinson appeared to have acted honourably. He certainly didn't resort to airing dirty laundry in public
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
lol fuck off Derpus, NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards
bolded textand i stand by it too
-
@canefan said in Super Rugby 2022:
@gt12 said in Super Rugby 2022:
Do we need Australia?
I'm going to assume yes, so what could be a situation that works?
Three competitions that run during the same year: Super Rugby Aotearoa (10 teams), Super Rugby Australia (five - six teams), And Super Rugby Pacific (Heineken Cup / 2nd division / 3rd Division).
NZ retains rights to NZ Aotearoa and expands our number of teams. We meet Australian teams in the Super Rugby Pacific Competition if they want. or add Japanese teams (or both).
It's not ideal, but it could work, but if we keep Moana Pacfika and add another pacific team, we'd only need 3 more teams.
So the top teams qualify to play in the SRP comp in a UCL type scenario?
I'd argue for two teams from NZ, Maybe two from Oz, and perhaps one from Japan in three groups (essentially Cup for highest ranked teams from each, Plate for the next group, then Bowl for the lowest). All teams get play-off rugby and we could see Champions from each country.
-
@Kiwiwomble I don’t think that analogy works because the Wallabies are still a draw card home and abroad and generate cash. So that’s the basis on which they work. First and foremost they want a strong Wallabies so then they think what do we need to try and make that happen. Different ARU CEOs over the years have had different ideas about that - eg domestic comps, club rugby boosts, Super rugby expansion, break away from SANNZAR / NZRU etc
In NZ because of a host of reasons, the domestic comp is paramount in and of itself.
-
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
so you want me to lie?
i also don't believe this lovely utopia where two unions work together harmoniously exists. Especially because our only leverage in anything rugby related is that we are good at it.
then maybe we just need to let them go and try and make the best of a domestic comp....if we dont think we can make it work then maybe we dont have the cards we think we do
-
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
so you want me to lie?
i also don't believe this lovely utopia where two unions work together harmoniously exists. Especially because our only leverage in anything rugby related is that we are good at it.
then maybe we just need to let them go and try and make the best of a domestic comp....if we dont think we can make it work then maybe we dont have the cards we think we do
Didn't they try to start one a few years ago and failed?
-
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
so you want me to lie?
i also don't believe this lovely utopia where two unions work together harmoniously exists. Especially because our only leverage in anything rugby related is that we are good at it.
then maybe we just need to let them go and try and make the best of a domestic comp....if we dont think we can make it work then maybe we dont have the cards we think we do
what does "make it work" look like to you?
-
@canefan said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
so you want me to lie?
i also don't believe this lovely utopia where two unions work together harmoniously exists. Especially because our only leverage in anything rugby related is that we are good at it.
then maybe we just need to let them go and try and make the best of a domestic comp....if we dont think we can make it work then maybe we dont have the cards we think we do
Didn't they try to start one a few years ago and failed?
That was a 3rd tier comp ala the NPC - different from a domestic 2nd tier comp.
-
I don't know how Australia fixes their domestic woes. Even at the height of their international powers they were still resorting to buying high profile leagies to bolster the ranks. Rugby isn't popular and doesn't seem to know or be able to make inroads against the NRL and AFL. Maybe SR isn't the answer, but it is better than nothing, a bit like the Warriors playing in Oz
-
@canefan said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
so you want me to lie?
i also don't believe this lovely utopia where two unions work together harmoniously exists. Especially because our only leverage in anything rugby related is that we are good at it.
then maybe we just need to let them go and try and make the best of a domestic comp....if we dont think we can make it work then maybe we dont have the cards we think we do
Didn't they try to start one a few years ago and failed?
and thats their problem, maybe we just worry about ourselves
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
so you want me to lie?
i also don't believe this lovely utopia where two unions work together harmoniously exists. Especially because our only leverage in anything rugby related is that we are good at it.
then maybe we just need to let them go and try and make the best of a domestic comp....if we dont think we can make it work then maybe we dont have the cards we think we do
what does "make it work" look like to you?
financially sustainable (or as much as any sports comp can be), entertaining and finally developing players for the AB's
-
@KiwiMurph said in Super Rugby 2022:
@canefan said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
so you want me to lie?
i also don't believe this lovely utopia where two unions work together harmoniously exists. Especially because our only leverage in anything rugby related is that we are good at it.
then maybe we just need to let them go and try and make the best of a domestic comp....if we dont think we can make it work then maybe we dont have the cards we think we do
Didn't they try to start one a few years ago and failed?
That was a 3rd tier comp ala the NPC - different from a domestic 2nd tier comp.
So what is stopping them expanding SR Oz style? Then sending the top 3 or 4 teams from that comp into a larger comp with us and the Pacific teams?
-
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@canefan said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
so you want me to lie?
i also don't believe this lovely utopia where two unions work together harmoniously exists. Especially because our only leverage in anything rugby related is that we are good at it.
then maybe we just need to let them go and try and make the best of a domestic comp....if we dont think we can make it work then maybe we dont have the cards we think we do
Didn't they try to start one a few years ago and failed?
and thats their problem, maybe we just worry about ourselves
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
@mariner4life said in Super Rugby 2022:
@Kiwiwomble so we should lose on purpose to make them feel better and they will play with us?
of course not....but we can stop saying things like "NZ rugby get to act like pricks in any negotiations because they hold most of the cards"
so you want me to lie?
i also don't believe this lovely utopia where two unions work together harmoniously exists. Especially because our only leverage in anything rugby related is that we are good at it.
then maybe we just need to let them go and try and make the best of a domestic comp....if we dont think we can make it work then maybe we dont have the cards we think we do
what does "make it work" look like to you?
financially sustainable (or as much as any sports comp can be), entertaining and finally developing players for the AB's
@ACT-Crusader said in Super Rugby 2022:
In NZ because of a host of reasons, the domestic comp is paramount in and of itself.
do we think thats the case? id say the AB's have been the priority for years to the detriment of a domestic comp
-
@Kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby 2022:
financially sustainable (or as much as any sports comp can be), entertaining and finally developing players for the AB's
sounds like there's a need for a bit of self interest there
