RIP Muhammad Ali
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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="kiwiinmelb" data-cid="585119" data-time="1465069035">
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<p>This fight shoes Ali ( or Clay as he was at the time ) in his prime , all the skills on display that made him a unique heavyweight , Cleveland Williams was no mug and was predicted by some to make life difficult for Clay </p>
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<p>I was taking a taxi to the airport and saw "Muhammed Ali has died" come up on my phone. Told the driver and he thought at first that his mate Muhammed had died. True story.</p>
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<p>Ali V "Big Cat" Williams was the first thing I wanted to watch when I heard the news. My old man and I would always watched the old fights when I was a kid and watching Ali toy with Williams was enjoying an athlete in the finest of form, regardless of the sport. Williams was a power puncher who liked to trap his opponent in the corner. Problem was that Ali was dancing in and around him so Williams got desperate and started chasing Ali. The result? Three knock-downs, the final one creating this famous shot:</p>
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<p><img src="http://i.imgur.com/6UUTUFJ.jpg" alt="6UUTUFJ.jpg"></p>
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<p>Sure, the middleweight and welterweight divisions have the true boxers, but Ali was one of the first heavyweights who possessed the same speed and skill as those guys. His comments and views about the Vietnam war (and the overall civil rights movement) are what makes him a legend however.</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Sneakdefreak" data-cid="585168" data-time="1465097812">
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<p>I was taking a taxi to the airport and saw "Muhammed Ali has died" come up on my phone. Told the driver and he thought at first that his mate Muhammed had died. True story.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Ali V "Big Cat" Williams was the first thing I wanted to watch when I heard the news. My old man and I would always watched the old fights when I was a kid and watching Ali toy with Williams was enjoying an athlete in the finest of form, regardless of the sport. Williams was a power puncher who liked to trap his opponent in the corner. Problem was that Ali was dancing in and around him so Williams got desperate and started chasing Ali. The result? Three knock-downs, the final one creating this famous shot:</p>
<p> </p>
<p><img src="http://i.imgur.com/6UUTUFJ.jpg" alt="6UUTUFJ.jpg"></p>
<p> </p>
<p>Sure, the middleweight and welterweight divisions have the true boxers, but Ali was one of the first heavyweights who possessed the same speed and skill as those guys. <strong>His comments and views about the Vietnam war (and the overall civil rights movement) are what makes him a legend however.</strong></p>
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<p>He still lost a few, Rocky Marciano had a heavyweight record of 49-0 and no one ever called him the Greatest whereas Ali lost to Norton, Frazier and Holmes ( and a few others, tried to Wikipedia his record but not surprisingly couldn't load it ) so I think it is the way he transcended the sport that made his legacy what it is.</p> -
<p>I also think Ali aside, most considered that era , the greatest era of heavyweights , in that there was so many great heavyweights all fighting at the same time ,</p>
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<p>And he dominated it , </p>
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<p>He went on a bit long though </p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="585174" data-time="1465099114">
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<p>He still lost a few, Rocky Marciano had a heavyweight record of 49-0 and no one ever called him the Greatest whereas Ali lost to Norton, Frazier and Holmes ( and a few others, tried to Wikipedia his record but not surprisingly couldn't load it ) so<strong> I think it is the way he transcended the sport that made his legacy what it is.</strong></p>
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<p>Ali was denied boxing in his best years. If he had fought during the same period as Marciano he'd have a similar if not better record. Three of his five professional losses were the last four fights and Marciano had been retired for between four and seven years. Marciano also didn't box against fighters of the calibre Ali did.</p>
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<p>As for the bolded bit, I agree. Certainly the plaudits in death seem to show a polished reflection...</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="antipodean" data-cid="585178" data-time="1465100617">
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<p>Ali was denied boxing in his best years. If he had fought during the same period as Marciano he'd have a similar if not better record. Three of his five professional losses were the last four fights and Marciano had been retired for between four and seven years. Marciano also didn't box against fighters of the calibre Ali did.</p>
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<p>As for the bolded bit, I agree. Certainly the plaudits in death seem to show a polished reflection...</p>
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<p>I hear ya to some extent but it can be tough to gauge different eras. Would be tough to see Marciano get close enough to land a knockout blow but that dude was freakishly tough.</p> -
<p>I think in any sport , ( im sure we have been here a few times ) its too difficult to compare eras , so many ifs and buts , </p>
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<p>I just personally like to appreciate all champions for what they were , </p>
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<p>Most of them were unique in their own right anyway</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Hooroo" data-cid="585207" data-time="1465112907">
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<p>One of my best mates is devastated by this. <strong>Wants to take time off work to mourn</strong>. All Saturday was filled with Ali quotes and Billy Chrystal's tributes (both of them)</p>
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<p> :mocking: :mocking:</p>
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<p>Get outta here.</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Sneakdefreak" data-cid="585168" data-time="1465097812">
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<p>I was taking a taxi to the airport and saw "Muhammed Ali has died" come up on my phone. Told the driver and he thought at first that his mate Muhammed had died. True story.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Ali V "Big Cat" Williams was the first thing I wanted to watch when I heard the news. My old man and I would always watched the old fights when I was a kid and watching Ali toy with Williams was enjoying an athlete in the finest of form, regardless of the sport. Williams was a power puncher who liked to trap his opponent in the corner. Problem was that Ali was dancing in and around him so Williams got desperate and started chasing Ali. The result? Three knock-downs, the final one creating this famous shot:</p>
<p> </p>
<p><img src="http://i.imgur.com/6UUTUFJ.jpg" alt="6UUTUFJ.jpg"></p>
<p> </p>
<p>Sure, the middleweight and welterweight divisions have the true boxers, but Ali was one of the first heavyweights who possessed the same speed and skill as those guys. His comments and views about the Vietnam war (and the overall civil rights movement) are what makes him a legend however.</p>
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<p>You won't get any disagreement from me about his boxing ability but I don't see how his views on civil rights should make him a legend?</p> -
<p>Because of the implications of having those views in times he lived in, and how he used his fame, talent and charisma to focus on civil rights?</p>
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I think what also gets overlooked a lot is that underneath the bravado, swagger and silky skills was the fact that he was one tough bastard. He could soak up punishment like no other. To execute the rope a dope with Foreman took a lot of courage and a fair bit of intestinal fortitude. In the "Fight" by Norman Mailer he talks of Ali pissing blood for days after the contest.<br><br>
Ultimately his courage probably led to his downfall but I'm sure he wouldn't have wanted it any other way. -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Cookie" data-cid="585239" data-time="1465133604">
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<p>I think what also gets overlooked a lot is that underneath the bravado, swagger and silky skills was the fact that he was one tough bastard. He could soak up punishment like no other. To execute the rope a dope with Foreman took a lot of courage and a fair bit of intestinal fortitude. In the "Fight" by Norman Mailer he talks of Ali pissing blood for days after the contest.<br><br>
Ultimately his courage probably led to his downfall but I'm sure he wouldn't have wanted it any other way.</p>
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<p>And at the end of the day , that may have been his downfall , </p>
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<p>In the early years , he was so slick he never got hit flush , but that changed at the end, </p>
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<p>And his sparring sessions have become legendary , where he would line up a heap of fresh sparring partners for long sessions,sometimes would do 15 rounds with a fresh sparring partner for each round, and basically cop too much punishment , he was of the belief he could absorb pain like no other fighter </p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="kiwiinmelb" data-cid="585246" data-time="1465151322">
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<p>And at the end of the day , that may have been his downfall , </p>
<p> </p>
<p>In the early years , he was so slick he never got hit flush , but that changed at the end, </p>
<p> </p>
<p>And his sparring sessions have become legendary , where he would line up a heap of fresh sparring partners for long sessions,sometimes would do 15 rounds with a fresh sparring partner for each round, and basically cop too much punishment , he was of the belief he could <strong>absorb pain like no other fighter </strong></p>
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<p>I reckon that's debatable. Rocky Marciano, Jim Jeffries and our own Tuaman were like walking slabs of granite.</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="585280" data-time="1465180429">
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<p>I reckon that's debatable. Rocky Marciano, Jim Jeffries and our own Tuaman were like walking slabs of granite.</p>
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<p>But they didn't give the lip like he did even when being smashed.</p>
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<div>“I'll beat him so bad he'll need a shoehorn to put his hat on.â€</div>
<div>-Muhammad Ali</div>
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<div>Oh and</div>
<div>“If you even dream of beating me, you'd better wake up and apologize.â€</div> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="nostrildamus" data-cid="585281" data-time="1465180774">
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<p>But they didn't give the lip like he did even when being smashed.</p>
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<div>“I'll beat him so bad he'll need a shoehorn to put his hat on.â€</div>
<div>-Muhammad Ali</div>
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<div>Oh and</div>
<div>“If you even dream of beating me, you'd better wake up and apologize.â€</div>
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<p>Well yeah but that's not what I'm debating, no denying he was the best raconteur in boxing ( if not all sports ) history.</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Toddy" data-cid="585226" data-time="1465119960">
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<p>[media]
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<p>I like the stare between Ali and Liston at 0.33-0.35 in the ring after Ali had just beaten Liston in the rematch.</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="585280" data-time="1465180429"><p>
I reckon that's debatable. Rocky Marciano, Jim Jeffries and our own Tuaman were like walking slabs of granite.</p></blockquote>
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George Chuvalo hands down for me -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="SammyC" data-cid="585291" data-time="1465182573">
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<p>George Chuvalo hands down for me</p>
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<p>Great call, completely forgot him but don't reckon it's completely unanimous.....knockout loss to Ali notwithstanding George Foreman is another.</p>
