2022 Black Ferns
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@Bovidae said in 2022 Black Ferns:
It's interesting to see that some high profile BFs like Woodman, Fluhler and Cocksedge have come out in support of Moore. So it might have only have been a vocal minority from some fringe/younger players that the report based their criticisms on.
Sounds like the more professional the player, the more likely they are to support Moore? That's not a great sign.
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@taniwharugby said in 2022 Black Ferns:
@Machpants and if they can turn that team around and even win the RWC that I assume is Englands to lose, their legendness will grow even more!
Yeah, England not winning this RWC would be the biggest choke ever, they're on a different level to all the other women, only France come close.
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lol nah NZ Rugby isn't insular at all
Coaching hole? Shit better get Wayne Smith to do it
Oh, and we need a Hansen too.
All we need now is someone who played for the Crusaders in the early 2000s to complete bingo -
Jokes aside they needed Hansen there and if she wasn't they would just be ignoring one of the issues with the setup.
If you are serious about establishing pathways for players you also need to do so for coaches. Hansen has been apprenticed to both the BFs and Matatu and this is a logical step.
As for the players supporting Moore I think it is pretty clear that the problems weren't with him as such, they were on the disconnect of expectations and preparedness of players entering the environment. Those that had been around and were first picks experienced one thing while those that were fringe starters (or squaddies) experienced some hard treatment they they weren't prepared for.
A very good point was made on the Breakdown the other week about how, by the time a male player has reached the top they have likely been through all sorts of top selections and environments (NZSS, Age Group, Super WTG, Super, NPC) while the women have had none of that except non-pro FPC.
I have sympathy for both sides and its clear that the fault was with a lazy NZR.NB: I also know of another long term high profile player that is perplexed about Moore leaving. There was definitely groups experiencing things very differently.
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On the news they said that Hansen will be in charge of the forwards, so it makes me wonder who had that responsibility on the tour last year. Was that Moore, with some input from Hansen? Clearly, the performance of the forwards needs to improve markedly to be competitive with England and France. John Haggart has also left but he was a backs coach.
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No matter how good the coaching team may be now, they are really up against it for the RWC.
England beat
Ireland 69-0
Wales 58-5
Italy 74-0
Scotland 57-5
France to come, their only possible competitors in the worldEmily Scarrat is one of their two centurions, they had almost 300 caps on the bench Vs Ireland.
Yes they are all low ranked teams, until the France match, but these girls are hardened pros, with significant experience
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@Machpants said in 2022 Black Ferns:
Emily Scarrat is one of their two centurions, they had almost 300 caps on the bench Vs Ireland.
There was a trivia tidbit shown during the tests against NZ which stated that Sarah Hunter had played 120 odd tests. That is more tests than the Black Ferns had played in their entire test history.
It was a pity that NZ didn't play some of the lesser 6N teams before England and France.
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@Crucial I decided to do a bit of digging and I was absolute staggered at some of the stuff I was able to dig up and I do find myself feeling incredibly sorry for Glen Moore that his career has been cut off at the knees.
The story needs to start in 2020 Te Kura Ngata Aerengamate played for the Northland FPC team in 2020 , she is the partner of Krystal Murray .
Not entirely sure what happened , but she decided to leave Northland siting that she needed to move to a stronger union were she could work on her fitness and core skills .
However in her time in at Counties Manukau it was rocky , needless to say the Head Coach quit 2 weeks before the season started , stories of TK being disruptive were rife .
Come the time of Black Ferns selection , she rocked up to the first training camp in even worse shape then when she left Northland and her core skills were no better but Moore took a punt on her because she was experienced and she let the management know that fact ..If you think back to the first test against England , her lineout throwing was sub par , missing the mark 5 out of 6 times ..
Just in a side note ,Chelsea Alley was so incensed that she missed the cut for the first test also against England , she packed her bags and threatened to leave ..
To be honest all Moore did was tell a few home truths in a direct forum , for me TK cheated this team with her ethic or lack of it , needless to say the rest of the team would have turned south for her.If you also take into account that both Rubi Tui and Portia Woodman have come in full support for Moore along with a good number of the team , I thought Woodmans coms on the breakdown were on point ,Glen is a very good communicator , his clarity in and around game plans crystal clear .
Both siting he has helped them with their careersI was told by a couple of Black Ferns who played in Moores team that won the World Cup in Ireland , it was his tactical masterpiece that he came up with the idea to take on the English through the middle which was a master stroke and not what the English expected
Moving forward to 2022, TK is currently up in Northland as CM don’t want a bar of her , she is currently trying to get her partner Krystal Murray to quit the game as they have both achieved everything in the game .
I find that attitude appalling , hoping Northland move on from her .
I have also been told there is sense of entitlement that the womens game should have a whole lot of money thrown at , but my answer to that is , at least show some initiative and get your own level of fitness up to standard where you actually have an athlete’s attitude -
@Machpants said in 2022 Black Ferns:
No matter how good the coaching team may be now, they are really up against it for the RWC.
England beat
Ireland 69-0
Wales 58-5
Italy 74-0
Scotland 57-5
France to come, their only possible competitors in the worldEmily Scarrat is one of their two centurions, they had almost 300 caps on the bench Vs Ireland.
Yes they are all low ranked teams, until the France match, but these girls are hardened pros, with significant experience
Always encouraging to see the Scots put up the biggest fight
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I said at the start of this that there was always going to be two sides to this story, and what you say about Ngata-Aerengamate confirms what I thought. She might say she is experienced but 23 of the 32 tests she has played were as the backup hooker to Fa'amausili, where she played minimal minutes. Clearly, she isn't amongst the top 3 hookers and not having a NZR contract confirms this.
Moore deserves criticism with some of the selections he made last year, particularly at prop and in the midfield, but Ngata-Aerengamate didn't show any form to deserve more games. Ironically, Krystal Murray is one of the props who should have played more than a solitary test on tour.
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2022 Pacific Four Series
Black Ferns vs Australia, Monday 6 June, 2.45PM, Venue TBC
Black Ferns vs Canada, Sunday 12 June, 2.45PM, Trusts Arena, Waitakere AUCKLAND
Blacks Ferns vs USA, Saturday 18 June, 4.00PM, Semenoff Stadium, WHANGAREILaurie O’Reilly Series (one of two test matches, the second to be played in Australia)
Black Ferns vs Australia, 20 August, 7.05PM, Orangetheory Stadium, CHRISTCHURCH -
New Zealand Rugby has today announced that former Black Ferns Sevens Coach Allan Bunting will join the Black Ferns in a newly created role, Manager of Culture and Leadership.
The new role has been introduced after the external Black Ferns review which highlighted the need to strengthen the team environment with specific focus on culture and leadership.Bunting has begun work with the management team and will join the Black Ferns squad at their next camp. The squad for the upcoming Pacific Four Series will be named next Wednesday, 4 May.
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@Steven-Harris yeah, as I have been saying I have sympathy for Moore as he was seemingly doing his job without coordinated support preparing players for a 'professional' environment.
Long term first teamers and ex Sevens players are the ones that, as a whole, can't see what the issues were because they were brought up in pro set ups.
It wasn't just TK but quite a few of the squad that brought up issues with the lack of organisation and communication unless they were in the firsts. That falls on NZR and the people they 'shoulder-tapped' but Moore was dragged down with them.
I think it was clear that a big shake up is/was needed and it is sad that this had to be the way that started it.
There is still a missing piece of the puzzle which is age-grade rep teams that do more than just assemble and play a one-off. They should be the tier below FPC and Super needs to be a bigger thing. -
@Steven-Harris It looks like she's off to the next province.
This is from the (Wellington focused) club rugby website:
Welcome to Wellington club rugby Te Kura Ngata-Aerengamate, who made her debut on the Norths bench on Saturday, joining her sister and lock Te Amohaere . Te Kura comes from the Counties Manukau Heat and is a recent former Black Ferns hooker. She is with Norths for the rest of the club season and could be in line to play for the Wellington Pride in the Farah Palmer Cup.
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@Stargazer said in 2022 Black Ferns:
@Steven-Harris It looks like she's off to the next province.
This is from the (Wellington focused) club rugby website:
Welcome to Wellington club rugby Te Kura Ngata-Aerengamate, who made her debut on the Norths bench on Saturday, joining her sister and lock Te Amohaere . Te Kura comes from the Counties Manukau Heat and is a recent former Black Ferns hooker. She is with Norths for the rest of the club season and could be in line to play for the Wellington Pride in the Farah Palmer Cup.
Would any team be that interested in her?
