Super Rugby Women's Competition
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@bovidae said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
No Jorja Miller either. Maybe they haven't selected either because of age.
Could be. She was the starting openside for Canterbury whenever available and wasn't physically outgunned.
As expected though this is a Canterbury plus ring-ins team rather than the SI team they are trying to sell themselves as. No Ta$man players and only three Otago. Two that should be there on merit and one probably due more to the lack of locks.
I totally get that Ta$man and Otago aren't the strongest but I think there is also a responsibility for this team to show they are serious about providing pathways and if that means having to put a bit of development in or take a chance on players that could thrive in a better team then that's what they should do.
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@bovidae said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
No Jorja Miller either. Maybe they haven't selected either because of age.
Age could explain a few Hawke's Bay players missing. For example, we have a winger who looks destined for the black jersey but she's 17.
By the way, I've seen photos of the Black Ferns 7s training and Miller was in them. Can't remember seeing Teneti; maybe she's there, too?
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I was just reading that the Blues have selected 5 teenagers, so maybe not.
@Crucial Canterbury wanting to be seen to be doing the right thing.
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@crucial Not sure I agree with your comments about Matatū and it being very Canterbury team. There's only one good/Premiership team in the SI. If what you say is true, how do you explain that there's only one current Hawke's Bay player in the Hurricanes squad (and one current in the Matatū squad)?
Where are the Taranaki players in the Chiefs squad? I also only see two Northland and one North Harbour player in the Blues team.
Otago have one player (originally from Hawke's Bay) in the Hurricanes team, one in the Chiefs, and 3 in Matatū. So five players, which isn't bad considering how they struggled this year in the FPC.
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@stargazer said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@bovidae said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
No Jorja Miller either. Maybe they haven't selected either because of age.
Age could explain a few Hawke's Bay players missing. For example, we have a winger who looks destined for the black jersey but she's 17.
By the way, I've seen photos of the Black Ferns 7s training and Miller was in them. Can't remember seeing Teneti; maybe she's there, too?
Recent photo? She was in the camp pre-games selection.
I thought maybe the Sevens angle but there are plenty of other sevens players in squads.
maybe a combination of the two. Age and number of games/workload?
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@stargazer said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@crucial Not sure I agree with your comments about Matatū and it being very Canterbury team. There's only one good/Premiership team in the SI. If what you say is true, how do you explain that there's only one current Hawke's Bay player in the Hurricanes squad (and one current in the Matatū squad)?
Where are the Taranaki players in the Chiefs squad? I also only see two Northland and one North Harbour player in the Blues team.
Otago have one player (originally from Hawke's Bay) in the Hurricanes team, one in the Chiefs, and 3 in Matatū. So five players, which isn't bad considering how they struggled this year in the FPC.
Kind of proves my point. The concept and marketing around Matatū is that they represent the SI yet players good enough for the level are playing in NI franchises. Maia Joseph playing in the Chiefs is a joke.
No one I have spoken to in the SI believe that this franchise is a SI one. It is simply Canterbury +. Trained in, coached by, 'culture supplied by Cantab Iwi' etc. many of the young Otago players (and they are a very young side)see their futures in the NI which wasn't the idea.
I would be interested in the Ta$man perspective too. -
@stargazer said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@crucial Not sure I agree with your comments about Matatū and it being very Canterbury team. There's only one good/Premiership team in the SI. If what you say is true, how do you explain that there's only one current Hawke's Bay player in the Hurricanes squad (and one current in the Matatū squad)?
Where are the Taranaki players in the Chiefs squad? I also only see two Northland and one North Harbour player in the Blues team.
Otago have one player (originally from Hawke's Bay) in the Hurricanes team, one in the Chiefs, and 3 in Matatū. So five players, which isn't bad considering how they struggled this year in the FPC.
you cant really argue its not largely a Canterbury team can you?....just because its justified doesn't make that statement untrue
@Crucial it would have been cool to be more representative of the whole SI, but i think its a bit of a chicken and egg situation, they couldn't provide pathways before now but they also need to make the team successful enough as to secure the future, so now we have a team hopefully more players from Otago and Ta$man will see this as something to aim for
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@crucial It really doesn't prove your point. You're only focusing on the Otago players and Matatū, but look at the lack of players from Hawke's Bay in the Hurricanes squad (only one!), as well as the the fact that there are - for example - two Northland players in the Blues squad, but also one in the Hurricanes and one in the Chiefs.
The spread of players over other franchises is due to the draft system they used.
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@kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@stargazer said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@crucial Not sure I agree with your comments about Matatū and it being very Canterbury team. There's only one good/Premiership team in the SI. If what you say is true, how do you explain that there's only one current Hawke's Bay player in the Hurricanes squad (and one current in the Matatū squad)?
Where are the Taranaki players in the Chiefs squad? I also only see two Northland and one North Harbour player in the Blues team.
Otago have one player (originally from Hawke's Bay) in the Hurricanes team, one in the Chiefs, and 3 in Matatū. So five players, which isn't bad considering how they struggled this year in the FPC.
you cant really argue its largely a Canterbury team can you?....just because its justified doesn't make that statement untrue
Sorry, I have read that about five times and can't grasp the point.
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@crucial said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@stargazer said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@bovidae said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
No Jorja Miller either. Maybe they haven't selected either because of age.
Age could explain a few Hawke's Bay players missing. For example, we have a winger who looks destined for the black jersey but she's 17.
By the way, I've seen photos of the Black Ferns 7s training and Miller was in them. Can't remember seeing Teneti; maybe she's there, too?
Recent photo? She was in the camp pre-games selection.
I thought maybe the Sevens angle but there are plenty of other sevens players in squads.
maybe a combination of the two. Age and number of games/workload?
Yes, recent photo. Found this on Gayle Broughton's instagram. Teneti is in it, too.
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@crucial said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@stargazer said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@crucial Not sure I agree with your comments about Matatū and it being very Canterbury team. There's only one good/Premiership team in the SI. If what you say is true, how do you explain that there's only one current Hawke's Bay player in the Hurricanes squad (and one current in the Matatū squad)?
Where are the Taranaki players in the Chiefs squad? I also only see two Northland and one North Harbour player in the Blues team.
Otago have one player (originally from Hawke's Bay) in the Hurricanes team, one in the Chiefs, and 3 in Matatū. So five players, which isn't bad considering how they struggled this year in the FPC.
you cant really argue its largely a Canterbury team can you?....just because its justified doesn't make that statement untrue
Sorry, I have read that about five times and can't grasp the point.
i was agreeing with you, missed the "not" part, it is largely a canterbury team and that cant really be argued against as the vast majority of players are from canterbury
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@stargazer said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@crucial It really doesn't prove your point. You're only focusing on the Otago players and Matatū, but look at the lack of players from Hawke's Bay in the Hurricanes squad (only one!), as well as the the fact that there are - for example - two Northland players in the Blues squad, but also one in the Hurricanes and one in the Chiefs.
The spread of players over other franchises is due to the draft system they used.
I did say way back in the thread that I feared this comp would go the way of early versions of the men's super where you had a better chance if you played for the 'home' union. Whether that is from logistics, player time demands and travel or whatever I was fairly sure that the Chiefs may be the only side with a spread across the Unions.
Yes, I am focusing on the situation in the south but do realise that other non franchise teams cop it as well. We have heard the HB, Northland and Naki complaints for years and nothing has changed.
@kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@Crucial it would have been cool to be more representative of the whole SI, but i think its a bit of a chicken and egg situation, they couldn't provide pathways before now but they also need to make the team successful enough as to secure the future, so now we have a team hopefully more players from Otago and Ta$man will see this as something to aim for
I don't think it shows much incentive at all. It shows that unless you fill a positional need for Canterbury you will have to target the draft. In the long term aims that wasn't the idea. This concept is meant to show clear pathways for all womens rugby not say to players that the pathways are there if you move to Chch, Auckland or Wellington.
Chiefs may have the advantage of more depth in the region but their squad looks like they have exhausted the region's players first before looking outside. -
@crucial i see it as a bit different, the team is there now and they have selected some Otago players, i don't think they needed to select loads to prove they will, there is still a need for players in Otago to earn their spot
I dont know enough about the individual players to be able to point out Otago players that should have been selected over canterbury ones, i might have a different opinion if i did
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I will add, this is why im really happy they are using a very different brand to any of the existing super or NPC ones, i can treat Matatū like a proper Rep team, like when i can support crusaders players when playing for the AB's
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@kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@crucial i see it as a bit different, the team is there now and they have selected some Otago players, i don't think they needed to select loads to prove they will, there is still a need for players in Otago to earn their spot
I dont know enough about the individual players to be able to point out Otago players that should have been selected over canterbury ones, i might have a different opinion if i did
I don't disagree. As 'should be picked' the same Otago players I would expect to see are selected for the comp.
I guess that the different view I am coming from is highlighted by a player like Joseph. Still developing but with immense promise and maybe still not confirmed as whether a 9 or 10. Matatū have stated that they don't have depth at 10 and who knows how much longer Cocksedge will play for them. Exactly the type of player that they need to grab for the future alongside having experienced options as starters. She would be the signal for other young players to aspire to being part of the franchise and show the path. -
@crucial I can only assume that Matatū would have picked Joseph if the Chiefs hadn't already picked her in the draft.
By the way, I understand from the Matatū media release that the addition of the two Wallaroos players is due to lack of depth at lock and first-five in the SI, and probably NZ.
