Wallabies v France 3
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@nta said in Wallabies v France 3:
I prefer the side angle wide shot where you can see both guys start upright and then both lower into contact.
The question is: how low should the ball carrier be? This isn't him running into contact, it is bracing for impact.
I think he has a reasonable dip there, so it should have been yellow. Not sure what a "reasonable" dip is for the mitigation dance.
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The other thing i don't really understand about the protocol is why wasn't Valetini yellow or even red carded later in the game when he clocked the guy directly in the head? The protocol doesn't seem to say that shoulder contact is worse than forearm.
The player was exactly where you would expect him to be making that run so i don't see how you could argue body height as mitigation (which seems to be the interpretation above).
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@kirwan said in Wallabies v France 3:
And here we are arguing about it days later, and the ref had what, 1 or 2 mins to make the call watching the big screen? Refs are in an impossible situation with this new focus on head highs.
This is a great point, but it highlights the error I think BOK and his team made: with each angle showing something slightly different (especially in regards to first point of contact), why did they not acknowledge the presence of doubt and opt for a YC?
It's still the key question days afterwards, and the judiciary mess only serves to reinforce it I think.
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@gibbonrib said in Wallabies v France 3:
@steven-harris where did you find that?
Sadly that statement doesn't clarify the decision at all. I'd like to watch that video to see if that helps (fully expecting that it won't though).
@stargazer said in Wallabies v France 3:
@gibbonrib It's only the media release. Not the decision.
Oh, shit, I forgot that if a red card is dismissed, there won't be a written decision. Just the media release.
So the media release is all we get. It has been published on the WR website now, btw.Forget getting a further clarification of the decision.
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@stargazer
Well that's just the icing on top of the shit sandwich isn't it? So the Aussies can go away believing that the tackle was 100% legal and the red was only given because of French play-acting, and most NH observers will assume it's a yellow card level offence, and the whole thing will blow up again the next time there's a similar tackle in a high profile game. What an utter, completely unnecessary shambles. -
@gibbonrib said in Wallabies v France 3:
@stargazer
Well that's just the icing on top of the shit sandwich isn't it? So the Aussies can go away believing that the tackle was 100% legal and the red was only given because of French play-actingI don't think anyone here believes it was because of play-acting. People think it was a mix of rugby's rules being too rigid, and the officials being unable to correctly interpret them.
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@barbarian said in Wallabies v France 3:
I don't think anyone here believes it was because of play-acting.
When you say "here" do you mean the fern or Oz? Cos I've spoken to quite a few mates who think the Frenchie should receive punishment and MK was fine.
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Regardless, every coach should be pointing out to their teams that attempting tackles like that you're playing russian roulette with the ref.
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@barbarian said in Wallabies v France 3:
This is a great point, but it highlights the error I think BOK and his team made: with each angle showing something slightly different (especially in regards to first point of contact), why did they not acknowledge the presence of doubt and opt for a YC?
If it was a red card and reduced to yellow because of mitigating factors I think the majority of people would have accepted that decision and moved on. IIRC it was Fraser who first said that there was direct contact to the head so O'Keeffe might have been swayed by that comment. Certainly some of those camera angles supported that.
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@barbarian said in Wallabies v France 3:
@bones People hate what the Frenchie did here (Oz), but I haven't spoken to anyone that thinks the RC was issued because of the play acting.
Interesting, the people I've spoken it feels like they think it influenced the decision.
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@antipodean said in Wallabies v France 3:
Regardless, every coach should be pointing out to their teams that attempting tackles like that you're playing russian roulette with the ref.
This to the nth degree
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@bones said in Wallabies v France 3:
@barbarian said in Wallabies v France 3:
@bones People hate what the Frenchie did here (Oz), but I haven't spoken to anyone that thinks the RC was issued because of the play acting.
Interesting, the people I've spoken it feels like they think it influenced the decision.
From what I've seen on social media, this is a common view
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@machpants said in Wallabies v France 3:
I don't think it influenced the decision, but if he didn't go down like a right cocksucking soccer piston wristed gibbon there would have been no decision to be made. The game would have carried on
Not so sure on that. I'd say that's heavily influencing the decision!
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@antipodean and to take a dive when its on.
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@machpants your post contradicts itself!
I think it was said earlier in the thread but as soon as MK made the tackle I immediately thought of the Ofa one. So I thought it was going to be a fairly straightforward RC or there would be lots of replays looking for other factors to downgrade to a YC.
French player reaction didn’t matter.
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@bones said in Wallabies v France 3:
@barbarian said in Wallabies v France 3:
@bones People hate what the Frenchie did here (Oz), but I haven't spoken to anyone that thinks the RC was issued because of the play acting.
Interesting, the people I've spoken it feels like they think it influenced the decision.
I think it more influenced the decision to look at it (which I guess is the pre-cursor to the decision)
We all saw a very similar shot on DMac in that Fiji game that went unchallenged because DMac is Mataura tough. Pretty sure that if he had stayed down or grabbed at his head the protocols would have been followed and a card dished out.
