NZ All Time XI
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Kane was thrown into the deep end very young and had a slow start as well. His numbers in the last 5 years are absolutely astounding, no matter what era you are talking about.
Also, numbers alone don't tell the whole story. There are very few players that would score a ton in that last test under those circumstances, taking us from way behind to way ahead of the game. He's massively influential and has the ability to dominate under extreme pressure.
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@akan004 said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
Crowe also played on green tops back in the day. The pitches are much more batsmen friendly now.
Sub-continent is a lot more easy to tour, especially without home town umpiring and flagrant ball tampering.
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@act-crusader said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
Crowe used a GM earlier on before the switch to DF.
I think it was the reverse, I picked up a Crowe GM bat around 95/96. Instantly improved my technique from the Ken Rutherford double scoop I had been using previously.
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@mn5 said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
Just as long as everyones all time BC 11 features Williamson/Crowe/Taylor at 3/4/5.
Assuming Turner and Sutcliffe are selected as there openers they have to be because the remaining six positions need to be five bowling options and a keeper.
It was a fun period before Taylor and Williamson cemented their spots and there were super passionate arguments for Flem, Dempster, Wright, Congdon, Rig and my personal favourite Andrew Jones for that last spot.
Now the only real debatable slots would be third quick and keeper.
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@rotated said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@mn5 said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
Just as long as everyones all time BC 11 features Williamson/Crowe/Taylor at 3/4/5.
Assuming Turner and Sutcliffe are selected as there openers they have to be because the remaining six positions need to be five bowling options and a keeper.
It was a fun period before Taylor and Williamson cemented their spots and there were super passionate arguments for Flem, Dempster, Wright, Congdon, Rig and my personal favourite Andrew Jones for that last spot.
Now the only real debatable slots would be third quick and keeper.
Boult and Baz, very little question in my eyes
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@mariner4life said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@rotated said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@mn5 said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
Just as long as everyones all time BC 11 features Williamson/Crowe/Taylor at 3/4/5.
Assuming Turner and Sutcliffe are selected as there openers they have to be because the remaining six positions need to be five bowling options and a keeper.
It was a fun period before Taylor and Williamson cemented their spots and there were super passionate arguments for Flem, Dempster, Wright, Congdon, Rig and my personal favourite Andrew Jones for that last spot.
Now the only real debatable slots would be third quick and keeper.
Boult and Baz, very little question in my eyes
Who's your second quick if Boult is third? Watling has a strong claim to the keeper's spot but with the top order we've got, it's hard to look past what Baz can offer coming out at 300/4 (or 5 if we have an all-rounder to bat 6).
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@cyclops said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@mariner4life said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@rotated said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@mn5 said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
Just as long as everyones all time BC 11 features Williamson/Crowe/Taylor at 3/4/5.
Assuming Turner and Sutcliffe are selected as there openers they have to be because the remaining six positions need to be five bowling options and a keeper.
It was a fun period before Taylor and Williamson cemented their spots and there were super passionate arguments for Flem, Dempster, Wright, Congdon, Rig and my personal favourite Andrew Jones for that last spot.
Now the only real debatable slots would be third quick and keeper.
Boult and Baz, very little question in my eyes
Who's your second quick if Boult is third? Watling has a strong claim to the keeper's spot but with the top order we've got, it's hard to look past what Baz can offer coming out at 300/4 (or 5 if we have an all-rounder to bat 6).
Paddles Bond and Boult
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@mariner4life said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@cyclops said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@mariner4life said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@rotated said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@mn5 said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
Just as long as everyones all time BC 11 features Williamson/Crowe/Taylor at 3/4/5.
Assuming Turner and Sutcliffe are selected as there openers they have to be because the remaining six positions need to be five bowling options and a keeper.
It was a fun period before Taylor and Williamson cemented their spots and there were super passionate arguments for Flem, Dempster, Wright, Congdon, Rig and my personal favourite Andrew Jones for that last spot.
Now the only real debatable slots would be third quick and keeper.
Boult and Baz, very little question in my eyes
Who's your second quick if Boult is third? Watling has a strong claim to the keeper's spot but with the top order we've got, it's hard to look past what Baz can offer coming out at 300/4 (or 5 if we have an all-rounder to bat 6).
Paddles Bond and Boult
Bond didn't play enough test cricket for me. Boult and Hadlee strike me as the only two guys who would be a unanimous selection.
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@cyclops said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@mariner4life said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@cyclops said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@mariner4life said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@rotated said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@mn5 said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
Just as long as everyones all time BC 11 features Williamson/Crowe/Taylor at 3/4/5.
Assuming Turner and Sutcliffe are selected as there openers they have to be because the remaining six positions need to be five bowling options and a keeper.
It was a fun period before Taylor and Williamson cemented their spots and there were super passionate arguments for Flem, Dempster, Wright, Congdon, Rig and my personal favourite Andrew Jones for that last spot.
Now the only real debatable slots would be third quick and keeper.
Boult and Baz, very little question in my eyes
Who's your second quick if Boult is third? Watling has a strong claim to the keeper's spot but with the top order we've got, it's hard to look past what Baz can offer coming out at 300/4 (or 5 if we have an all-rounder to bat 6).
Paddles Bond and Boult
Bond didn't play enough test cricket for me. Boult and Hadlee strike me as the only two guys who would be a unanimous selection.
i saw enough.
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@donsteppa said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
Jack Cowie could also be a bowling contender from stuff I’ve read in the past.
i have to have seen them play to put them in these sort of teams, but that's just my personal rule (like how Pinetree doesn't make my all time AB XV)
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@rotated I don't think Flem, Congdon, Jones or Rig were ever more than footnotes in a discussion.
On their limited records and from period reports Donnelly and Dempster have to be considered ahead of Taylor but eventually discarded because of the lack of evidence despite the strong suspicion that they would be at least his equal.
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@cyclops said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
Watling has a strong claim to the keeper's spot but with the top order we've got, it's hard to look past what Baz can offer coming out at 300/4 (or 5 if we have an all-rounder to bat 6).
As a bat-first keeper Watling is in the clubhouse with a four stroke lead at this point.
The only argument is if this side were to actually play games (presumably against other nations best XIs) given we don't have a wicket taking spinner, it's probably best to select the best outright keeper in which case it would be Smith.
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Flem's not even close, a shit average, and a conversion rate about the same as that American bloke who went to that island in India the other week.
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@mariner4life said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
Flem's not even close, a shit average, and a conversion rate about the same as that American bloke who went to that island in India the other week.
Ouch!!
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@dogmeat said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@rotated I don't think Flem, Congdon, Jones or Rig were ever more than footnotes in a discussion.
On their limited records and from period reports Donnelly and Dempster have to be considered ahead of Taylor but eventually discarded because of the lack of evidence despite the strong suspicion that they would be at least his equal.
When Flem retired he had a claim to be number 2 to Crowe. I can remember plenty of discussions about whether he would have been our best ever if he hadn't had so many issues in the nineties (runs not the decade). Of course those conversations are now long forgotten and even laughable as Kane and Taylor have sailed past him and even Baz would have claim to be ahead. Even his vaunted captaincy, while still brilliant, doesn't shine as bright since Baz and Kane have both proven themselves to be able and capable captains.
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@dogmeat said in Cricket - NZ vs Pakistan:
@rotated I don't think Flem, Congdon, Jones or Rig were ever more than footnotes in a discussion.
Before Williamson and Taylor were candidates (~2013ish?) pretty much every all time test XI would have had at least one of those surely? If not only because Rig is the best pure opener we have but Flem/Sutcliffe/Turner can all be legitimately played there in an all time team.
