The Silver Fern

@machpants said in Better people making better All Blacks ...:

If I was in charge, those sort of people would never play for their country (in Reece case it's a double whammy, he's not even a kiwi). Drunk drivers, spousal abusers, pissed up public assaulters, etc.

It's strange that the Better People Make Better All Blacks mantra was preached the most publicly around the 2011 RWC win. If that rule was in place at the time, especially in retrospect, it would have been pretty tough to cobble a squad together. Where do you stand on seals?

I remain somewhat old school in the sense that despite professionalism it is still a national rep team and we should be picking the best players from those eligible.

If the board were able to introduce some sort of eligibility rule and terminate Super contracts around criminal convictions of a certain length/type I would be 100% in favour providing the rules were transparent and consistently applied. But elements of the NZ legal system including diversion and name supression would seem to make that impossible.

Consistency is important though and as unpalatable as it is, unless there is a rule that can be consistently applied I would want to case by case moral judgements of individuals. I wish there were a way to do this and make things simple. The Keith Murdoch incident shows that things can go too far the other way.

@mn5 said in Other Cricket:

@rotated said in Other Cricket:

@mn5 said in Other Cricket:

@rotated said in Other Cricket:

@mn5 said in Other Cricket:

@arhs said in Other Cricket:

Josh da Silva is a hell of a challenge to get out these days. Real limpet in Windows lower order and an example for teams like NZ

Settle down. He’s only facing England. I’d still choose Blundell over him

England A with Archer, Wood, Robinson, Broad and Anderson all out.

Lame excuse. Still counts as a test match.

Not an excuse, more giving context to de Silva's innings. Pretty uninspired bowling once the shine went off the new ball.

Broad and Anderson are self inflicted and many of the injuries arguably are too.

Plus don’t forget that England are pretty shit no matter who gets selected

Any test hundred is still a worthy effort though.

England's batting is shit, their bowling is still decent at full or even mid strength as it was in the Ashes.

A five-for against England in the last few years probably isn't worth a whole lot.

@mn5 said in Other Cricket:

@rotated said in Other Cricket:

@mn5 said in Other Cricket:

@arhs said in Other Cricket:

Josh da Silva is a hell of a challenge to get out these days. Real limpet in Windows lower order and an example for teams like NZ

Settle down. He’s only facing England. I’d still choose Blundell over him

England A with Archer, Wood, Robinson, Broad and Anderson all out.

Lame excuse. Still counts as a test match.

Not an excuse, more giving context to de Silva's innings. Pretty uninspired bowling once the shine went off the new ball.

Broad and Anderson are self inflicted and many of the injuries arguably are too.

@mn5 said in Other Cricket:

@arhs said in Other Cricket:

Josh da Silva is a hell of a challenge to get out these days. Real limpet in Windows lower order and an example for teams like NZ

Settle down. He’s only facing England. I’d still choose Blundell over him

England A with Archer, Wood, Robinson, Broad and Anderson all out.

@donsteppa said in Other Cricket:

@rotated said in Other Cricket:

Strange captaincy all around and I'm sure the coach will really be laying down the law to the players.

Though that might get the coach dismissed, given recent history...

I was kind of getting at that. Definately more of the Fozzie than the Langer. Cuddles all around.

@majorrage said in Other Cricket:

@mariner4life said in Other Cricket:

with the benefit of a bit of hindsight, absolutely the right call to bat again. Best chance of winning it without risking losing it.

Your going to have to explain this one to me ....

Still looking like a terrible call to me. Draw the most likely winner at the moment. We'll never know if the follow on would have changed that or not, but we can be sure it wouldn't have increased Australias chances of losing (with the benefit of hindsight too).

I'm totally baffled why with 12 overs left and 4 wickets remaining they took the third new ball and kept Lyon and Swepson (with figures of close to 0/150) on. Cummins and Starc bowled less than 13 overs per day over Days 3, 4 and 5. That is low for a standard test , let a lone a test where you took a luxury break to put your feet up in the middle of it. Strange captaincy all around and I'm sure the coach will really be laying down the law to the players.

@african-monkey said in Other Cricket:
> @chris-b A bizarre career. I remember he played a test down here in 2009 in Dunedin (Shane Bond's last test) after scoring a big century against Sri Lanka, got dropped for over 10 years and has come back and made every post a winner.

It's like the Pakistan version of Chris Rogers.

Massive asterix on that game in hindsight.

They let the IPL guys go early which is understandable on one level but Boult now has been unavailable for four of the last six tests and three ODIs. So basically the entire home summer.

@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

@rotated said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

@shark said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

@canefan said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

@mariner4life said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

just looked at the batting records for teh summer

sick reading

in teh top 7, only Conway could be considered a consistent run scorer. 6 innings, two hundred and a 90 (plus the ever-excellent 30-odd)
Basically everyone else has one good knock and a bunch of shit. like, really bad, single figure, averaging 7 shit.

No wonder we have taken 3 absolute batterings this summer.

Those figures take me back…..the fern would have been great fun in the mid 90s when Dipak Patel batted in the top order and Willie Watson and Richard De Groen spearheaded the pace “attack”.

Don't forget the glory days of Murphy Sua!!!

Still way better than Robert Kennedy

Sewell, O'Connor, Walmsley, the list carries on

Shayne O'Connor deserves better than that company, he was pretty useful in the right conditions with the new ball and always provided a point of difference being a left armer. At test level he probably showed more than Allott or Su'a and similar to Franklin would be in contention as our left arm seamer between Chats and Boult.

It was the more the right armers like de Groen, Kennedy, Michael Owens and Gavin Larsen who were absolute fodder at test level. And to be fair they only really played when a series of injuries struck.

I will not have to Postman spoken of like that. 24 wickets at 28 at test level. No matter what the surface he ALWAYS delivered

I think it was more the strike rate of 82 as a specialist seamer on generally favourable conditions and not particularly strong opposition. That said his average and strike rate is pretty close to Daniel Vettori - so maybe he wasn't as bad as I remember - which is mostly Gooch milking him for 200 on debut. Obviously class for the time at ODI level.

@shark said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

@canefan said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

@mariner4life said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

just looked at the batting records for teh summer

sick reading

in teh top 7, only Conway could be considered a consistent run scorer. 6 innings, two hundred and a 90 (plus the ever-excellent 30-odd)
Basically everyone else has one good knock and a bunch of shit. like, really bad, single figure, averaging 7 shit.

No wonder we have taken 3 absolute batterings this summer.

Those figures take me back…..the fern would have been great fun in the mid 90s when Dipak Patel batted in the top order and Willie Watson and Richard De Groen spearheaded the pace “attack”.

Don't forget the glory days of Murphy Sua!!!

Still way better than Robert Kennedy

Sewell, O'Connor, Walmsley, the list carries on

Shayne O'Connor deserves better than that company, he was pretty useful in the right conditions with the new ball and always provided a point of difference being a left armer. At test level he probably showed more than Allott or Su'a and similar to Franklin would be in contention as our left arm seamer between Chats and Boult.

It was the more the right armers like de Groen, Kennedy, Michael Owens and Gavin Larsen who were absolute fodder at test level. And to be fair they only really played when a series of injuries struck.

@bayimports said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

@rotated said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

The WTC was gone from the moment we lost at home to Bangladesh on the back of a loss to India. I just don't see us running the table in Pakistan and England even at our best with a depleted batting line up.

The batting was the primary issue in both the losses this home summer, there are no easy fixes there as there just isn't the depth.

But there is no escaping that our bowling attack had opportunities overnight in the second innings to run through the lower order and they bricked it both times. That problem seems solvable, but buggered if I know how.

In respect to our bowlers dont forget although we pulled off a couple of speckies, we also put down a couple of sitters at crucial times even when our bowlers occassionally did get it right.. doesnt make it any better either

Wags was unlucky at the Mount with no balls, DRS and catches the rest looked awful until Boult found his groove with the third new ball.

They started Day 3 against the Bangles at 175/2 after 67 overs? How does it get to 361/3 after 140 overs?

All the bowlers fresh, a new ball due in 13 overs, two batsman occupying the crease but struggling to score. Almost the perfect set up.

The Day 4 set up here was a bit different but similarly dissapointing.

The WTC was gone from the moment we lost at home to Bangladesh on the back of a loss to India. I just don't see us running the table in Pakistan and England even at our best with a depleted batting line up.

The batting was the primary issue in both the losses this home summer, there are no easy fixes there as there just isn't the depth.

But there is no escaping that our bowling attack had opportunities overnight in the second innings to run through the lower order and they bricked it both times. That problem seems solvable, but buggered if I know how.

@donsteppa said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

I hadn't realised just how much Latham's batting average of 41.68 is based on doing very well against the lesser international sides.

Source: Cricinfo.

It is tough to understand why Martin Guptill apparently can't cut it at test level and Tom Latham is test captain - yes.

Don't worry specialist bat Daryl is in.

@mariner4life said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:

good work skipper. top contribution

Difficult for the current commentary team to fault his effort.

I don't mean to stick the boot in - we have some serious legends in this team. But some serious questions need to be asked as to how this bowling attack totally laid eggs on Day 3 against Bangladesh and Day 4 here of this size.

Unfortunately, this seems like one of those situations where the tail is going to make it look easy and then our top order won't be able to lay a bat on it.

@act-crusader said in Super Rugby AB Watch 2022:

@kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby AB Watch 2022:

@act-crusader Ive said before, if we had a 2011 situation again i think someone like hunt could step up and not loose it for us, he can play safe...but i dont think we're strong enough at 10 to start blooding these kinds of guys just in case...we didn't do it when we had people like DC and Cruden, lets not start now

Yes we did, Slade was brought into the squad in 2010. And there was also Donald who had been in the squad when there were other options ahead of him.

They tried Delany and a returning McAlister on the 2009 EOYT too.

Still I don't think either Slade or Cruden were considered "blooded" when the RWC came around. They had been capped, but Slade looked like a total deer in the headlights against Canada in that final pool game.

Terrible session with the exception of two screamers. The pitch seems to be improving though at least against pace, but that is not much of a silver lining.