Julian Savea

Canes4life

When Savea is on form there isn't anyone more destructive going around World rugby. Except we haven't seen him play anywhere near that level in 2016. First he was dropped by the Canes a few weeks ago and now Hansen has decided to give "bogged down" Savea a break to get mentally fresh so he can stake a claim for the Rugby Championship later in the year.
 
I understand that being an All Black comes with the responsibility of training and playing to a very high standard. I therefore 100% back Hansen in his decision and I hope the big man finds his touch soon because an All Black team without "the bus" is a less scarier proposition than one with it.
 
I've got a feeling it may be because Conrad Smith is no longer inside him, taking that pressure off on a regular basis. I'm not blaming the absence of Conrad for all Julians current flaws but that experience both for the Hurricanes and All Blacks combined with the ability to put Savea into space was crucial.
 
When you compare both centres for the Canes (Proctor) and All Blacks (Fekitoa) they don't have the biggest of voices so maybe that is hurting the big fella.
 
That's just my take on it. Maybe im just over analyzing it though.

Toddy

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Canes4life" data-cid="588690" data-time="1466056277">
<div>
When Savea is on form there isn't anyone more destructive going around World rugby. Except we haven't seen him play anywhere near that level in 2016. First he was dropped by the Canes a few weeks ago and now Hansen has decided to give "bogged down" Savea a break to get mentally fresh so he can stake a claim for the Rugby Championship later in the year.
 
I understand that being an All Black comes with the responsibility of training and playing to a very high standard. I therefore 100% back Hansen in his decision and I hope the big man finds his touch soon because an All Black team without "the bus" is a less scarier proposition than one with it.
 
I've got a feeling it may be because Conrad Smith is no longer inside him, taking that pressure off on a regular basis. I'm not blaming the absence of Conrad for all Julians current flaws but that experience both for the Hurricanes and All Blacks combined with the ability to put Savea into space was crucial.
 
When you compare both centres for the Canes (Proctor) and All Blacks (Fekitoa) they don't have the biggest of voices so maybe that is hurting the big fella.
 
That's just my take on it. Maybe im just over analyzing it though.
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</blockquote>
 
That doesn't explain why he got fat and out of form in 2015.

SammyC

Also doesn't explain him missing easy 1 on 1 tackles, or being a lazy fuck on cover defense 
I'm of the opinion his issues are fitness related just like last year

MN5

Some players just don't have the discipline to stay in shape constantly. Different metabolisms don't help though, Savea has the old "lick a postage stamp and put on weight" look about him unfortunately so its tougher.
 
I find it funny that Hansen said how good his skinfold tests were though, like he's one to judge !

Stargazer

I'm just going by what Hansen has said in several interviews posted today. Speculation doesn't bring us any closer to the truth than that.
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="588699" data-time="1466057516">
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Some players just don't have the discipline to stay in shape constantly. Different metabolisms don't help though, Savea has the old "lick a postage stamp and put on weight" look about him unfortunately so its tougher.
 
I find it funny that Hansen said how good his skinfold tests were though, like he's one to judge !
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I doubt Hansen has assessed Jules' skinfolds himself and assume he's relying on the assessment of the team's nutritionist or doctor.

MN5

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Stargazer" data-cid="588701" data-time="1466058001">
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I'm just going by what Hansen has said in several interviews posted today. Speculation doesn't bring us any closer to the truth than that.
 
 
I doubt Hansen has assessed Jules' skinfolds himself and assume he's relying on the assessment of the team's nutritionist or doctor.
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</blockquote>
 
I was referring to the fact that Fatguts is fat but thanks for clearing that up.

MajorRage

Julian Savea comes across more to me as a player who likes to be lead, as opposed to a leader, so your observation about Smith maybe correct.
 
But others have pointed out, his skillset has been down on what expected of him as well - at time's he's reminded me of 2011 Savea, a player with a lot of hype, but not much substance.

antipodean

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="SammyC" data-cid="588697" data-time="1466057457">
<div>
Also doesn't explain him missing easy 1 on 1 tackles, or being a lazy fuck on cover defense 
I'm of the opinion his issues are fitness related just like last year
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</blockquote>
 
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="588699" data-time="1466057516">
<div>
Some players just don't have the discipline to stay in shape constantly. Different metabolisms don't help though, Savea has the old "lick a postage stamp and put on weight" look about him unfortunately so its tougher.
 
I find it funny that Hansen said how good his skinfold tests were though, like he's one to judge !
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Hansen's come out and specifically refuted Julian's current form issues as being work ethic related.

MN5

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="antipodean" data-cid="588715" data-time="1466060455">
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Hansen's come out and specifically refuted Julian's current form issues as being work ethic related.
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......and ?
 
Mud sticks, once labelled lazy it can be a pretty tough one for a sportsperson to shake and fact is he was in poor shape last year.

SammyC

Well he's definately shown a lack of work ethic when running (jogging slowly) back on cover defense 
He was also extremely fat at the start of the season 
Hansen probably knows it's not gonna help criticising him in the media. I don't read too much into his comments

antipodean

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="588716" data-time="1466060641">
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......and ?
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And I tend to believe him over your guessing.
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="SammyC" data-cid="588718" data-time="1466060822">
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Hansen probably knows it's not gonna help criticising him in the media. I don't read too much into his comments
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Your opinion would have some weight if Hansen didn't have a track record of calling a spade a spade.

SammyC

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="antipodean" data-cid="588719" data-time="1466061112">
And I tend to believe him over your guessing. 
Your opinion would have some weight if Hansen didn't have a track record of calling a spade a spade.</blockquote>
 
What's your opinion? 
It was pretty obvious he wasn't working as hard as he could on defense last week wasn't it?

MN5

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="antipodean" data-cid="588719" data-time="1466061112">
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And I tend to believe him over your guessing.
 
 
Your opinion would have some weight if Hansen didn't have a track record of calling a spade a spade.
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Not really guessing, the proof is in the pudding.....
 
If there's any leftover at Julians place.....

antipodean

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="SammyC" data-cid="588720" data-time="1466061197">
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What's your opinion? 
It was pretty obvious he wasn't working as hard as he could on defense last week wasn't it?
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He missed two tackles. He wasn't alone in that regard. No one is suggesting it was his best test.
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="588721" data-time="1466061251">
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Not really guessing, the proof is in the pudding.....
 
If there's any leftover at Julians place.....
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</blockquote>
 
<img src="http://i.imgur.com/oEhVvjZ.gif" alt="oEhVvjZ.gif">

SammyC

It was more than 2 tackles, it was a general lack of effort on cover defense

nostrildamus

Such incisive commentary but perhaps he is just suffering from more competitors' video analysis than when he burst on the scene.
Plus he seemed to have such wonderful balance and intuition a few years ago. So maybe not just fitness but also confidence-related.

mimic

its a pity
5th on nz all time try scorer with 39 tries (in only 42 tests i think?).. i honestly thought he would be the first all black to crack 50.. hes only 25.. lets hope he gets his head right.. don't really understand everyone bagging him.. we should be supporting him in his recovery.. 
 
everyone bags him for 2015.. but forget that he's tied for most tries in a rugby world cup with habana and lomu.. with 8 tries...
 
 
did i mention 39 tries in 42 test matches? best strike rate of any nz player with 30+ tries..

rotated

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="mimic" data-cid="588771" data-time="1466088501">
<div>did i mention 39 tries in 42 test matches? best strike rate of any nz player with 30+ tries.. </div>
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That's great - but we have Nathan Harris try scoring machine now. He is scoring at a similar rate playing about 20 minutes a test. Savea is superfluous.

kiwiinmelb

Going to be interesting to see what happens from here , 
 
Has been a fantastic player IMO, best winger in the world, 
 
Surely not all washed up at 25 ??
 
that would be pretty bizarre really

rotated

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="kiwiinmelb" data-cid="588776" data-time="1466101604">
<div>Surely not all washed up at 25 ?? 
that would be pretty bizarre really 
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Cully stopped being Cully at 25.
Joe Roks last good season was 2009 and he was 26.
Goldie's was 26 for most of the 1999 season.
More recently we had Dagg written off 18 months ago at 26.
Sivi started a bit later, but essentially lasted 4-5 years at the top from 2005-09/10. After that he was behind guys like Kahui, Toeava, Gear and even SBW probably in 2011.
 
A tad early, but hardly bizzare - especially if the issues are mental and RWC success related (in addition to whatever personal issues). That's not to say he won't return for spot starts - all those did. He is still a serviceable international wing in his current form. He would start for most other countries. Problem with the All Blacks is that there is always someone ready to take your spot.
 
Could also strike back too, Mils, Howlett, Jane and Ben Smith all had different career trajectories, but if you compare that group to the above one seems to rely much more heavily on physical gifts than the other.

The Silver Fern

Julian Savea