Highlanders 2024
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@Canes4life said in Highlanders 2024:
@frugby not quite sure of the younger players in the Landers, but the bloke with the longish hair had a good game on Saturday. Was that Haig?
Yes. Played for the very good U20s side which one the Oceania thing in the COVID year. Didn't play NPC last year because the Highlanders ordered him to get an operation. Makes you wonder if they are happy to chuck him in at the deep end.
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I'm a massive Haig fan, but think they will start the year off with Withy. Haig can come off the bench.
I think back up first five, or a decision not to pick one could occur. Both Faleafaga and Millar could easily take the spot. However, I think they could be tempted to pick both CGB and Whaanga with Gilbert covering 10.
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Of all the young talent coming through at the Landers, after Holland, I think Haig has the highest ceiling.
I think they will be reticent to play Gilbert at 10, and will want to give Millar time in the saddle. They'd probably also rather have Gilbert go back to 15 in the case of an outside back injury, than have Gilbert go to 10 in the case of a Patchell injury.
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I wouldn't be surprised with Haig if he has a few big games whether we see stories popping up about him being eligible for Australia and England as well.
I want them to play Millar or Faleafaga. I just see the idea of having Whaanga and CGB on the bench as being quite tempting. CGB looked the best I've seen him in years.
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The highly-touted Gore-product competing to become the Highlanders' next 10
There were more players from Gore in the 2022 New Zealand Under 20s than there were from Auckland including Cam Miller.
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so, a question for those more closely connect to the region
i FEELS like we're getting more "local" (see anyone coming through the system south of the Waitaki) getting a sniff than we have in a long time
if true, do we think we're doing a better job developing them or a better job spotting them?
ie did the Highlanders spend too long looking at imports and just ignore local talent or was the talent just not there for a long time before?
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@Daffy-Jaffy said in Highlanders 2024:
The highly-touted Gore-product competing to become the Highlanders' next 10
There were more players from Gore in the 2022 New Zealand Under 20s than there were from Auckland including Cam Miller.
This is the statement that concerns me with Millar... “My kicking is a strength. I think I play with good control and can manage a game. My biggest growth area is to become more of an attacking threat,” Millar told Rugby Pass.
He has shown himself to be an outstanding kicker. If he can't attack, he will just be another Noakes, Berquist, Parker or Arlidge. I really do hope he can add an attacking aspect to his game. There just isn't room in a Super side for a guy who is limited to kicking at 10. -
Jermaine Ainsley confirmed to be leaving for France at the end of the season.
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@Kiwiwomble said in Highlanders 2024:
so, a question for those more closely connect to the region
i FEELS like we're getting more "local" (see anyone coming through the system south of the Waitaki) getting a sniff than we have in a long time
if true, do we think we're doing a better job developing them or a better job spotting them?
ie did the Highlanders spend too long looking at imports and just ignore local talent or was the talent just not there for a long time before?
Combination of things. Part of it I think is a little bit of luck, but part of it is a growth of resources.
de Groot, Wingham, G Bell, H Bell, Taylor, S Withy, Stodart, Haig, Michaels, Arscott, Hastie, Millar, Te Hiwi, J Whaanga & Hurley (+ a few others I have probably forgotten) all coming through Otago and Southland within a five year period feels about as good as we could expect/hope?
That's an average of 3 Super Rugby players a year each year for five years of players to either be from or schooled in the Otago/Southland region. That feels high.
That said, I think it is notable that in that group there are three boys from McGlashan (Bells + Whaanga), two from King's High (Hastie & Wingham... Q Holland and Pledger who hold NDCs also from there) and one from Gore High (Michaels).
The fact that you have high-level players coming from 4 schools rather than just Southland Boys and Otago Boys has to help your chances of producing more players, and this is something that feels relatively new. King's have obviously produced their fair share of players, but not as many as maybe they should have. Until Josh Timu made his Super Rugby debut in 2019, McGlashan had only ever had one Super Rugby player, by the end of this year that number is likely to be 5.
Having said that, the Highlanders are now doing a much better job, having essentially copied what the Crusaders do with their pathways, though our program is a little more centred with fewer players. The goal now, is pretty much to bring players through our U20s programme, with focus on taking the best local players and adding top talents from around the country.
This will still need to be topped up with the odd import like Tavatavanawai and Ratumaitavuki-Kneepkens, but I think that is fine.
So to answer the question, Yes we are getting more local and yes we are doing a better job at developing talent rather than spotting. I think this method has coincided with an unusually good period of development, so whether we manage to keep bringing through as many players who are locally schooled time will tell, but most players now are likely to come through the U20 system.
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@SouthernMann said in Highlanders 2024:
@Daffy-Jaffy said in Highlanders 2024:
The highly-touted Gore-product competing to become the Highlanders' next 10
There were more players from Gore in the 2022 New Zealand Under 20s than there were from Auckland including Cam Miller.
This is the statement that concerns me with Millar... “My kicking is a strength. I think I play with good control and can manage a game. My biggest growth area is to become more of an attacking threat,” Millar told Rugby Pass.
He has shown himself to be an outstanding kicker. If he can't attack, he will just be another Noakes, Berquist, Parker or Arlidge. I really do hope he can add an attacking aspect to his game. There just isn't room in a Super side for a guy who is limited to kicking at 10.Which is a pity when the All Blacks have been crying out for someone good at tactically managing a game.
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@antipodean said in Highlanders 2024:
@SouthernMann said in Highlanders 2024:
@Daffy-Jaffy said in Highlanders 2024:
The highly-touted Gore-product competing to become the Highlanders' next 10
There were more players from Gore in the 2022 New Zealand Under 20s than there were from Auckland including Cam Miller.
This is the statement that concerns me with Millar... “My kicking is a strength. I think I play with good control and can manage a game. My biggest growth area is to become more of an attacking threat,” Millar told Rugby Pass.
He has shown himself to be an outstanding kicker. If he can't attack, he will just be another Noakes, Berquist, Parker or Arlidge. I really do hope he can add an attacking aspect to his game. There just isn't room in a Super side for a guy who is limited to kicking at 10.Which is a pity when the All Blacks have been crying out for someone good at tactically managing a game.
Balance though. He can't just be a kicker who shovels the ball on. He needs to offer something.
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@frugby said in Highlanders 2024:
If Harmon's weakness isn't his running game, then what is it? Tackling machine, great at the breakdown, if he is good at all this, then he must be better than Ardie, Cane and Dalton.
and an excellent team man, fixes a lot of loose ball and mistakes, something I like to see in an AB openside.
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@SouthernMann said in Highlanders 2024:
@antipodean said in Highlanders 2024:
@SouthernMann said in Highlanders 2024:
@Daffy-Jaffy said in Highlanders 2024:
The highly-touted Gore-product competing to become the Highlanders' next 10
There were more players from Gore in the 2022 New Zealand Under 20s than there were from Auckland including Cam Miller.
This is the statement that concerns me with Millar... “My kicking is a strength. I think I play with good control and can manage a game. My biggest growth area is to become more of an attacking threat,” Millar told Rugby Pass.
He has shown himself to be an outstanding kicker. If he can't attack, he will just be another Noakes, Berquist, Parker or Arlidge. I really do hope he can add an attacking aspect to his game. There just isn't room in a Super side for a guy who is limited to kicking at 10.Which is a pity when the All Blacks have been crying out for someone good at tactically managing a game.
Balance though. He can't just be a kicker who shovels the ball on. He needs to offer something.
I think it is disingenuous to say that is what he is... and even then, dare I say it, that would be a step up on just about everyone since Sopoaga.
Millar can drive the game with his boot, and can make good playmaking decisions - we know this, we have seen this for NZ U20 and for Otago.
The question is how good is his running game, and that will decide whether he ends up just being a very good Super Rugby first five (E.G Bryn Gatland) or an All Blacks first five. From what I have seen, he isn't exactly slow, sure probably not as quick as BB or RM, but certainly no Mary Banks. Sexton and Farrell etc. aren't lightning and had success attacking the line.
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@frugby said in Highlanders 2024:
@SouthernMann said in Highlanders 2024:
@antipodean said in Highlanders 2024:
@SouthernMann said in Highlanders 2024:
@Daffy-Jaffy said in Highlanders 2024:
The highly-touted Gore-product competing to become the Highlanders' next 10
There were more players from Gore in the 2022 New Zealand Under 20s than there were from Auckland including Cam Miller.
This is the statement that concerns me with Millar... “My kicking is a strength. I think I play with good control and can manage a game. My biggest growth area is to become more of an attacking threat,” Millar told Rugby Pass.
He has shown himself to be an outstanding kicker. If he can't attack, he will just be another Noakes, Berquist, Parker or Arlidge. I really do hope he can add an attacking aspect to his game. There just isn't room in a Super side for a guy who is limited to kicking at 10.Which is a pity when the All Blacks have been crying out for someone good at tactically managing a game.
Balance though. He can't just be a kicker who shovels the ball on. He needs to offer something.
I think it is disingenuous to say that is what he is... and even then, dare I say it, that would be a step up on just about everyone since Sopoaga.
Millar can drive the game with his boot, and can make good playmaking decisions - we know this, we have seen this for NZ U20 and for Otago.
The question is how good is his running game, and that will decide whether he ends up just being a very good Super Rugby first five (E.G Bryn Gatland) or an All Blacks first five. From what I have seen, he isn't exactly slow, sure probably not as quick as BB or RM, but certainly no Mary Banks. Sexton and Farrell etc. aren't lightning and had success attacking the line.
It isn't disingenuous to say that. He personally said his weakness is his running game.
“My kicking is a strength. I think I play with good control and can manage a game. My biggest growth area is to become more of an attacking threat,” Millar told Rugby Pass."
I know you are a fan of the guy and rate him highly. But, when the lad is saying he is currently a kicking first five primarily, it is there plain to see. Super Rugby defences sides can squeeze 10s like that and make it difficult for them to operate.
I hope he succeeds. It is just we haven't seen him play a lot. He may step up and be the long-term first five we need. That'll be great. Both him and Faleafaga have different skillsets. He is a kicker who knocks them over from all over the place, Faleafaga, may fit in to a backline, nailing kick passes and skip out balls. But again, we haven't seen a lot of either player. The sample size against decent opposition is about half a dozen games each.
Bryn Gatland is a Super Rugby battler, three teams and never nailed down a starting spot. I would be disappointed if that is his ceiling, after the way that some have talked about the kid.
I haven't rubbished the guy. I've just said numerous times that I have seen first fives come through the Otago or Highlanders system, dominating at junior levels, primarily kicking 10s, step up and find they don't have the skillset to lead sides at the high levels. As mentioned guys like Berquist, Alridge, Parker and Chris Noakes come to mind.
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@SouthernMann said in Highlanders 2024:
@frugby said in Highlanders 2024:
@SouthernMann said in Highlanders 2024:
@antipodean said in Highlanders 2024:
@SouthernMann said in Highlanders 2024:
@Daffy-Jaffy said in Highlanders 2024:
The highly-touted Gore-product competing to become the Highlanders' next 10
There were more players from Gore in the 2022 New Zealand Under 20s than there were from Auckland including Cam Miller.
This is the statement that concerns me with Millar... “My kicking is a strength. I think I play with good control and can manage a game. My biggest growth area is to become more of an attacking threat,” Millar told Rugby Pass.
He has shown himself to be an outstanding kicker. If he can't attack, he will just be another Noakes, Berquist, Parker or Arlidge. I really do hope he can add an attacking aspect to his game. There just isn't room in a Super side for a guy who is limited to kicking at 10.Which is a pity when the All Blacks have been crying out for someone good at tactically managing a game.
Balance though. He can't just be a kicker who shovels the ball on. He needs to offer something.
I think it is disingenuous to say that is what he is... and even then, dare I say it, that would be a step up on just about everyone since Sopoaga.
Millar can drive the game with his boot, and can make good playmaking decisions - we know this, we have seen this for NZ U20 and for Otago.
The question is how good is his running game, and that will decide whether he ends up just being a very good Super Rugby first five (E.G Bryn Gatland) or an All Blacks first five. From what I have seen, he isn't exactly slow, sure probably not as quick as BB or RM, but certainly no Mary Banks. Sexton and Farrell etc. aren't lightning and had success attacking the line.
It isn't disingenuous to say that. He personally said his weakness is his running game.
“My kicking is a strength. I think I play with good control and can manage a game. My biggest growth area is to become more of an attacking threat,” Millar told Rugby Pass."
I know you are a fan of the guy and rate him highly. But, when the lad is saying he is currently a kicking first five primarily, it is there plain to see. Super Rugby defences sides can squeeze 10s like that and make it difficult for them to operate.
I hope he succeeds. It is just we haven't seen him play a lot. He may step up and be the long-term first five we need. That'll be great. Both him and Faleafaga have different skillsets. He is a kicker who knocks them over from all over the place, Faleafaga, may fit in to a backline, nailing kick passes and skip out balls. But again, we haven't seen a lot of either player. The sample size against decent opposition is about half a dozen games each.
Bryn Gatland is a Super Rugby battler, three teams and never nailed down a starting spot. I would be disappointed if that is his ceiling, after the way that some have talked about the kid.
I haven't rubbished the guy. I've just said numerous times that I have seen first fives come through the Otago or Highlanders system, dominating at junior levels, primarily kicking 10s, step up and find they don't have the skillset to lead sides at the high levels. As mentioned guys like Berquist, Alridge, Parker and Chris Noakes come to mind.
I'm more so saying, that I think Millar can have a limited running game, and still be far superior than Berquist, Alridge, Parker and Chris Noakes. I'd go as far to say, you could have a fringe All Blacks career by being an elite kicker and passing playmaker.
Obviously his running game is a bit of a weakness, but I think that is more a confidence thing. He seems quite intelligent on the field, so I'd back that he will take the ball to the line enough to keep the defence honest.
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You'd have to think the top side is now sorted. I'd be fairly surprised if that isn't what we see start R1 barring Patchell for Millar, though maybe they want to give the young man the keys. Would be a huge show of faith.
Parkinson will be in 19 I reckon if fit, so probably between Broughton and Haig for the bench spot. I'd imagine if he can play well, Broughton's ability to cover number eight would probably see him get the edge? The 23 spot it also open. Seems they have ruled out M Whaanga and CGB, though with the way the backline suits up, I'd suggest it is Te Hiwi's spot as we need midfield cover.
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Yeah I think we are a player swap or two away from nailing down the top side. I'd be very disappointed of Patchell isn't our starting 10, he was the best on field during the Hurricanes last week, and from what others have said he was pretty tidy against MP. Millar gets first crack off the bench, but, will share bench time with Faleafaga.
Ma'u and Ainsley will be a flip of the coin. Will p share game time fairly evenly though.
reckon they will give Haig some time at lock in this game, just to check his comfort playing there. If he goes well, they'll give him the 19 and allow Parkinson another week or two. If not, Parkinson comes back. Then a decision between Haig and Broughton. Both Withy and Harmon can play at eight, so plenty of flexibility in the back row for players to move around.
Henry Bell looks like he will have first go at the hooking role, the spot still looks like a lottery. Ricky Jackson did look good last weekend while he was on.
I'm stoked that it looks like Hastie has got the edge over Arscott.The midfield/outside back replacement is interesting. I think Whaanga/CGB will offer more. But, with Te Hiwi able to play 11,12,13,14 he gives more coverage. So, agree it could be him.
Some nice options to have for a team that has had some rather average players suit up in the last couple of years.
