Damian Mckenzie
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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Milk" data-cid="567679" data-time="1459089382">
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<p>I think he needs to be considered a fullback only, from an All Blacks point of view, until he shows better first five form at Super Level.</p>
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<p>Just to add to that, I listened to Veitch's interview with Steve Hansen's, and Hansen listed him as the fourth first five they were keeping an eye on. So I guess he'd disagree that he should be considered a fullback only at test level at the moment :)</p>
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<p><a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://soundcloud.com/nzherald/tony-veitch-talks-to-steve-hansen'>https://soundcloud.com/nzherald/tony-veitch-talks-to-steve-hansen</a></p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Tim" data-cid="567648" data-time="1459070521"><p>Where is Kirwan these days?</p></blockquote>
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Work is a bit nuts at the moment. <br><br>
This conversation reminds me of 2002 and Ben Blair. Very similar players. -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Kirwan" data-cid="567776" data-time="1459125302">
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<p>Work is a bit nuts at the moment.<br><br>
This conversation reminds me of 2002 and Ben Blair. Very similar players.</p>
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<p>Wash your mouth out.</p>
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<p>Similar size maybe but until DMac has a meltdown of Blair magnitude I don't equate the two of them at all</p> -
<p>Big positive for me in the Chiefs Force game was he looked pretty comfortable under the high ball. It's something I haven't really noticed before, and I guess I assumed he wouldn't be too flash at due to his height etc - but he certainly got up there when needed.</p>
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<p>I guess the reason I am struggling to take the calls for McKenzie to be included in the June tests seriously is that they are based on five games of SR form. No-one was calling for Damian to be included in the All Blacks for the RWC which means that he's effectively being labelled an All Black after five SR games. Don't get me wrong I think he's a prodigious talent who hopefully has a long representative career ahead of him, but it seems like every year a young player finds a rich vein of early season form and suddenly people are demanding for the All Black team to be shuffled around so that room can be found for them. As a five eighth, and I don't think he's anywhere close to overtaking players like Cruden and Sopoaga. As a fullback no-one on the planet is close to Ben Smith. And as a utility 10/15 bench option I think Beaudan Barrett has done a spectacular job filling that role for the ABs over the past 24 months and deserves all rights of incumbency. Whilst I can completely understand why people are excited about McKenzie's early season form I don't believe there is any rush to get him into the All Blacks. If he is to take the next step with his career and become an All Black then I believe he needs to make a compelling case by outplaying one of the incumbents over a substantial period of time. And I don't think he has come close to doing that yet.</p>
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I think MacKenzie's rep is built on more than 5 Super Rugby games. <br><br>
He's been around for a couple of years at first class level and people have been keeping an eye on him as a potential AB for even longer. <br><br>
The fact that his rep has slowly been building and he doesn't yet seem prone to brain farts and seems to deliver more often than not suggests he is getting ready to deliver on that potential. <br><br>
Hence he's forced his way into the conversation. <br><br>
It's more than just us public numptys picking the flashy guy in form and saying he's the man.<br><br>
Remember Hansen dropped him into the conversation un promoted over weekend. And he's not exactly known for irrational sekection decisions. -
<p>plus most are just 'talking about him' around AB conversations, I dont think anyone is suggesting they drop someone for him just yet, this is what we do. </p>
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<p>We speculate about players who might become ABs.</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="booboo" data-cid="567817" data-time="1459136077">
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<p>I think MacKenzie's rep is built on more than 5 Super Rugby games.<br><br>
He's been around for a couple of years at first class level and people have been keeping an eye on him as a potential AB for even longer.<br><br>
The fact that his rep has slowly been building and he doesn't yet seem prone to brain farts and seems to deliver more often than not suggests he is getting ready to deliver on that potential.<br><br>
Hence he's forced his way into the conversation.<br><br>
It's more than just us public numptys picking the flashy guy in form and saying he's the man.<br><br>
Remember Hansen dropped him into the conversation un promoted over weekend. And he's not exactly known for irrational sekection decisions.</p>
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<p>Whilst your point about Hansen is a valid one, I don't remember McKenzie being discussed as a potential AB last year at all, although I am happy to be proven wrong if people were advocating for him. So what's changed since then? 5 Super Rugby games.</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Crucial" data-cid="567784" data-time="1459126576">
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<p>Wash your mouth out.</p>
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<p>Similar size maybe but until DMac has a meltdown of Blair magnitude I don't equate the two of them at all</p>
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<p>Also, DMac is a creative player, IIRC Blair was more of a runner, kind of a B grade Cullen.</p>
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<p>In a general sense, DMac shouldn't be thought of as a starter by any stretch of the imagination, but the ABs pull in good guys young/inexperienced all the time, I don't know why people would have an issue with him being in the discussion ... unless they haven't seen him play (his improvement on last year has been noticeable, time in the AB camp might help speed up the ironing out of his issues).</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="taniwharugby" data-cid="567818" data-time="1459136536">
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<p>plus most are just 'talking about him' around AB conversations, I dont think anyone is suggesting they drop someone for him just yet, this is what we do. </p>
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<p>We speculate about players who might become ABs.</p>
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<p>Oh I enjoy doing that too. I also enjoy discussing reasons why a player might miss out on selection as well.</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Cantab79" data-cid="567819" data-time="1459136611">
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<p>Whilst your point about Hansen is a valid one, I don't remember McKenzie being discussed as a potential AB last year at all, although I am happy to be proven wrong if people were advocating for him. So what's changed since then? 5 Super Rugby games.</p>
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<p>NMS was in the discussion from a few Super games last year ....</p> -
<p>It may only be five games into the season but the improvements he's made to his game since his shakey first season last year are fucking astonishing. Last year he tried to run everything and when nothing was on, he'd do something dumb and hope it miraculously came off. This year he's cut out all the dumb shit and is perfectly happy to run the ball up or kick it into the corners if he has to. He's a much smarter and more accurate player than he was just last year.</p>
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<p>Don't get me wrong, I don't think he's going to suddenly be a regular starter this year, but I do think he'll be given a few runs like a lot of the young guys were back in 2012 (Cane, BBBR, Coles, A Smith, Savea and TKB).</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Unco" data-cid="567828" data-time="1459137024">
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<p>It may only be five games into the season but the improvements he's made to his game since his shakey first season last year are fucking astonishing. Last year he tried to run everything and when nothing was on, he'd do something dumb and hope it miraculously came off. This year he's cut out all the dumb shit and is perfectly happy to run the ball up or kick it into the corners if he has to. He's a much smarter and more accurate player than he was just last year.</p>
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<p>Don't get me wrong, I don't think he's going to suddenly be a regular starter this year, but I do think he'll be given a few runs like a lot of the young guys were back in 2012 (<strong>Cane, BBBR, Coles, A Smith, Savea and TKB).</strong></p>
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<p>Barrett too.</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Cantab79" data-cid="567822" data-time="1459136727">
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<p>Oh I enjoy doing that too. I also enjoy discussing reasons why a player might miss out on selection as well.</p>
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<p>and thats part of discussing people around AB selections...player a might be doing great, but might miss out as player b fits in better....</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Cantab79" data-cid="567819" data-time="1459136611">
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<p>Whilst your point about Hansen is a valid one, I don't remember McKenzie being discussed as a potential AB last year at all, although I am happy to be proven wrong if people were advocating for him. So what's changed since then? 5 Super Rugby games.</p>
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<p>I think people were talking about him being a future AB while he was still at high school. No one was really expecting him to make last years squad, but he was still seen as a player that would in the future, at least in my mind.</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Cantab79" data-cid="567819" data-time="1459136611"><p>
Whilst your point about Hansen is a valid one, I don't remember McKenzie being discussed as a potential AB last year at all, although I am happy to be proven wrong if people were advocating for him. So what's changed since then? 5 Super Rugby games.</p></blockquote>
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You're wrong. Plenty people been talking about him as a potential AB for years...<br><br>
Ok, I assume you mean not much mention of him making the 2015 team at that stage. And yes you are correct not too much pushing for him then. (Although i do seem to recall some crackpot talkback callers on the back of DC's "poor form" ...)<br><br>
There have been an ADDITIONAL 5 Super rugby games (on top of an NPC/ITM Cup), and the retirement/unavailability of two incumbent 10s. So he moves up the pecking order.<br><br>
He's in the conversation...<br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br>
...whether he's from Canterbury or not
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<p>I was going to say he probably wants to forget his handful of years among the inbreds of the plains but then he is from Matuara so going from there to Chch to Hamilton has been a gradual progression through the evolutionary scale.</p>
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<p>(and he still has a way to go)</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Cantab79" data-cid="567807" data-time="1459132301">
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<p>I guess the reason I am struggling to take the calls for McKenzie to be included in the June tests seriously is that they are based on five games of SR form. No-one was calling for Damian to be included in the All Blacks for the RWC which means that he's effectively being labelled an All Black after five SR games. Don't get me wrong I think he's a prodigious talent who hopefully has a long representative career ahead of him, but it seems like every year a young player finds a rich vein of early season form and suddenly people are demanding for the All Black team to be shuffled around so that room can be found for them. As a five eighth, and I don't think he's anywhere close to overtaking players like Cruden and Sopoaga. As a fullback no-one on the planet is close to Ben Smith. And as a utility 10/15 bench option I think Beaudan Barrett has done a spectacular job filling that role for the ABs over the past 24 months and deserves all rights of incumbency. Whilst I can completely understand why people are excited about McKenzie's early season form I don't believe there is any rush to get him into the All Blacks. If he is to take the next step with his career and become an All Black then I believe he needs to make a compelling case by outplaying one of the incumbents over a substantial period of time. And I don't think he has come close to doing that yet.</p>
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<p>I think some are looking at him as a possibility to be a squad member and or we are a right winger down with no one really putting there hand up yet , there is the option of ben smith playing there and selecting another fullback. </p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Nepia" data-cid="567823" data-time="1459136768">
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<p>NMS was in the discussion from a few Super games last year ....</p>
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<p>and Naholo and Piatau the year before , Hanson has shown he is not afraid to select a bolter </p>
