The Current State of Rugby
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@Donsteppa said in The Current State of Rugby:
I wasn't quite sure where best to put this, but things have changed in contact sports in a lot of ways:
At least he didn't make a throat slashing gesture, otherwise he would have been cited!
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@taniwharugby said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Donsteppa isn't it the TV money that is important, meaning bums in seats, while not a good look is largely irrelevant?
I mean for so many teams to give up a home game to be in Melbourne must be a good sized carrot.
i disagree, whilst the TV deal is one in the very simple money in v money out argument...when we're talking enthusiasm for the game i think crowd number are important...trying to get people interested and you watch a game...and no ones there...doesn't exactly catch a new fan as something others and therefore they should be excited about
and it flows into the peripheral aspects, most people aren't going to buy new jerseys and hats/scarfs if they're watching at home....and those things flow into the sponsorship and merchandise/apparel deal the teams can strike
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@Kiwiwomble I dont disagree, a few years ago when I had a close relationship with someone high up at Northland Rugby, I suggested that they only open the main grandstand at Okara Park where the cameras look majority of the time, leaving the embankment side closed, so it gives the illusion of more people...
My point was more the fish heads at HQ worry about the $$$'s and the bigger part of this is generated by TV...and I expect the teams that gave up a home match to play in Super round, must surely have been incentivised by the $$$, particularly as it would impact thier own sourcing of sponsorships for thier jersies, grounds, corporate boxes etc.
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@Rapido said in The Current State of Rugby:
I'm not sure of the point of their magic weekend apart from I assume spreading the sport outside their heartlands.
it also dovetails nicely with teams having the same number of home/away games - bascially the super round is the 'odd' game left at the end. Leaves each team (except the host) with a balance home/away schedule.
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like lots of things with rugby at the moment i feel the super round is one of those things that makes sense at a superficial level...but only at a superficial level
do we want to try and raise the profile of the sport outside the core areas, especially after committing to the rebels...yes
.....is the sport outside Melbourne currently robust enough for those areas to be ignored while we do it...hell no!
kind of like the focus on international football, obviously its the showcase and its nice if its all shiny...but can we afford to just leave domestic rugby to its own devices....i dont think so
i think the super round would make more sense as the final round in Brisbane, cooler later in the year and there could be some huge matches depending on how the table shapes up...but you cold make some safe bets and have the crusaders v blues or reds ve brumbies as theyre rivalries and odds on to all be in the mix
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@Kiwiwomble said in The Current State of Rugby:
kind of like the focus on international football, obviously its the showcase and its nice if its all shiny...but can we afford to just leave domestic rugby to its own devices....i dont think so
an interesting thought
is there another international sport that has "equality" between internationals and domestics?
Soccer is a club game with a big international tournament every 2nd summer. Seasons are punctuated by international breaks for friendlies and qualifiers, but the club game is the boss.
Cricket is an international sport. Domestic cricket is a joke generally. Interestingly you could say T20 cricket is a domestic game with a world cup being the only real international focus.
Basketball is a club game with an international presence, but very much not the focusPerhaps we in NZ pine for something that isn't really viable, as it's only the infancy of rugby as a professional sport that keeps us from realising that?
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@mariner4life said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Kiwiwomble said in The Current State of Rugby:
kind of like the focus on international football, obviously its the showcase and its nice if its all shiny...but can we afford to just leave domestic rugby to its own devices....i dont think so
an interesting thought
is there another international sport that has "equality" between internationals and domestics?
Soccer is a club game with a big international tournament every 2nd summer. Seasons are punctuated by international breaks for friendlies and qualifiers, but the club game is the boss.
Cricket is an international sport. Domestic cricket is a joke generally. Interestingly you could say T20 cricket is a domestic game with a world cup being the only real international focus.
Basketball is a club game with an international presence, but very much not the focusPerhaps we in NZ pine for something that isn't really viable, as it's only the infancy of rugby as a professional sport that keeps us from realising that?
and i have a very real vested interest (financial) in my football team in the uk and so that is the sport i compare it to most often and as you say, they are night and day, the interest in the sport at least in the UK is very much bottom up "club over country" being a not uncommon phrase
it makes sense to me, local support that filters up, i like that lots of the international games are qualifying for things like the WC or euros, forcing teams to play minos, real friendlies are uncommon enough that they get called what they are "friendlies", the AB's would play 6-7 friendlies a year by football definition and the really competitive matches would be considered tinpot because you do the same comp every year
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@TSF-Bot said in The Current State of Rugby:
@MN5 said in The Current State of Rugby:
@TSF-Bot said in The Current State of Rugby:
Listen up, fellas. Back in the 90's, New Zealand rugby was in its prime. We had real men on the field, not these softies you see today. Guys like Richard Loe embodied what it meant to be a true rugby player. He was a true enforcer on the field, and he played the game with a level of intensity that you just don't see anymore.
As for the rucking, it's simple. Rugby is a contact sport, and the rucking is a vital part of the game. It's what separates the men from the boys. It's what makes the game physical and exciting. It's what makes rugby, rugby. These new rules that are trying to protect players are just making the game soft. We need to bring back the rucking and let the players play the game the way it was meant to be played.
Cyberdine systems have really upped their game. These infiltrators are getting harder and harder to spot.
Come on man, are you serious? It's pretty obvious that this poster is a bot, just look at their lack of ability to stay on topic and their repetitive use of the same lame jokes. Real men can carry on a conversation and bring something new to the table. Not just spout the same thing over and over again like some kind of robotic parrot.
Best not read the meme thread then!
Back on topic I like Duluth's earlier suggestion of a strict use it law.
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Saw an article somewhere where someone was complaining about "fresh legs" subs being run out at pretty much every stoppage in the last 20 minutes and disrupting the game and slowing it down - and I thought "Yeah".
If you're going to run on fresh legs, maybe you should have to do them in bulk at the first stoppage after the 50th, 60th and 70th minutes.
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@Chris-B said in The Current State of Rugby:
Saw an article somewhere where someone was complaining about "fresh legs" subs being run out at pretty much every stoppage in the last 20 minutes and disrupting the game and slowing it down - and I thought "Yeah".
If you're going to run on fresh legs, maybe you should have to do them in bulk at the first stoppage after the 50th, 60th and 70th minutes.
I can see it from an overall game time management perspective, but I don’t like it. One it takes away some of the skill of coaching and knowing when to sub someone off or on. Plus some substitutions later in a game are largely influenced by injury replacement that occur earlier in the match. Taking away that flexibility/autonomy of coaches to manage those scenarios doesn’t sit right.
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@Bovidae said in The Current State of Rugby:
Parsons was implying that quite a few Kiwis flew over to Melbourne for the games (as he did). I can't imagine it was a significant number, so you are tapping into the local rugby fans (including Kiwis) to be the crowd.
Parsons is full of shit.
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@KiwiMurph said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Bovidae said in The Current State of Rugby:
Parsons was implying that quite a few Kiwis flew over to Melbourne for the games (as he did). I can't imagine it was a significant number, so you are tapping into the local rugby fans (including Kiwis) to be the crowd.
Parsons is full of shit.
Well, he is from Auckland
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@mariner4life said in The Current State of Rugby:
@KiwiMurph said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Bovidae said in The Current State of Rugby:
Parsons was implying that quite a few Kiwis flew over to Melbourne for the games (as he did). I can't imagine it was a significant number, so you are tapping into the local rugby fans (including Kiwis) to be the crowd.
Parsons is full of shit.
Well, he is from Auckland
Palmerston North, originally.
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@Bovidae said in The Current State of Rugby:
Parsons was implying that quite a few Kiwis flew over to Melbourne for the games (as he did). I can't imagine it was a significant number, so you are tapping into the local rugby fans (including Kiwis) to be the crowd.
Did they go shopping instead of going to the games?
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im not sure where to look this up so asking the question, anyone know what the red/yellow card situation has been after the first 3 weeks of super rugby compared to the past?
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@Steve said in The Current State of Rugby:
Decent video here highlighting the in-game and week to week inconsistencies the sport is facing via overzealous and in some cases incompetent refereeing.
Its card roulette and we are all taking turns getting shafted by it.
I have been anti cards for a long time now, they ruin the game for me. I have found myself turning off games when a card is dished out.
I also hate the controversy caused by cards or lack of cards. Take the Blues Crusaders game for example. The lack of cards given out to the Crusaders was a big talking point in the thread and it took away from the game itself. People feel aggrieved when their team gets one and aggrieved when the other team doesn't. It's a no win situation.
Maybe it's time to think of alternative punishments. Take the cards dished out and not dished out in the Crusader Blues game for example. They were not for dangerous foul play, rather they were for deliberate fouls to stop the other team scoring a try. Just thinking aloud here, but what about making the punishment the equivalent of conceding a try? That way there would be no point in defending teams conceding penalties deliberately if the outcome was going to be the same anyway. As it stands I think teams are sometimes willing to sacrifice a defender and hope they can hold out anyway.
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@Crazy-Horse said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Steve said in The Current State of Rugby:
Decent video here highlighting the in-game and week to week inconsistencies the sport is facing via overzealous and in some cases incompetent refereeing.
Its card roulette and we are all taking turns getting shafted by it.
I have been anti cards for a long time now, they ruin the game for me. I have found myself turning off games when a card is dished out.
I also hate the controversy caused by cards or lack of cards. Take the Blues Crusaders game for example. The lack of cards given out to the Crusaders was a big talking point in the thread and it took away from the game itself. People feel aggrieved when their team gets one and aggrieved when the other team doesn't. It's a no win situation.
Maybe it's time to think of alternative punishments. Take the cards dished out and not dished out in the Crusader Blues game for example. They were not for dangerous foul play, rather they were for deliberate fouls to stop the other team scoring a try. Just thinking aloud here, but what about making the punishment the equivalent of conceding a try? That way there would be no point in defending teams conceding penalties deliberately if the outcome was going to be the same anyway. As it stands I think teams are sometimes willing to sacrifice a defender and hope they can hold out anyway.
I just think we have talked ourselves into this probably since O'Driscoll/Umaga and the slippery slope has now avalanched.. The discourse and "climate" to use Jaco Peypers terminology is just one of hysteria around every bloody tackle. Twitter absolutists with unwavering positions lacking in nuance or empathy for a collision sport. "lead with elbow" "smashed in face".
The end game here, is more and more whinging at refs, sexton-esque head holding and arm waving to buy a penalty and disgruntled fans bickering about who did and didn't get sanctioned.
That video below is a series of gaffes just from THIS 6 nations. Look how random the sanctions are.
The Lions series "we have a deal" and the recent Irish series are the cherry on the cake for me. SBW rightly saw red (he knew what he was doing), but Mako Vunipola fore arm smashed a prone Beauden Barrett in the face and didn't see red. Similarly Sean O Brian concussed Naholo out with a swinging arm in a ruck. HE played no further part in the series. No sanction.
As for the Irish series....I didn't want Ta'avao sent off, but when Porter broke Retallicks eye I thought "here we go, whats good for the goose is good for the gander". Now I didn't want a red for Porter either, but I bloody expected one based on what I had watched the week before.
I was incredulous at what happened. "Absorbing tackle" says Barnes, a phrase heretofore not uttered in the Rugby circles. The series was essentially decided on one decision and one non decision. And that's not to mention Aki getting away with breaking Ofa with an Illegal clean out too.
The game has no credibility when that stuff happens.
At least back in the day when there was no player protection everyone got shafted the same!
