'Super Rugby' 2021
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@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
they just have to be qualified for a PI
so NZ
What about Maori...? -
@taniwharugby said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
they just have to be qualified for a PI
so NZ
What about Maori...?Yeah, i say PI when I mean Fiji, Tonga, and Samoa. Easier to write, just laziness.
In addition Pacifika does not only mean NZ based/born PI
https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/pasifika
That maybe a govt definition, but it is not the only definition. And not the one used here by NZ rugby, it is used in the broader sense of "people from the islands of the South Pacific and their descendants"
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@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
@taniwharugby yes. But under NZ laws you cannot deny an NZer a job because they are not qualified to play for the ABs, but NZR successfully do.
Which law is that? I'm not so sure that's true.
@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
The quota is two non NZ qualified players per SR team, others have to apply for dispensation. I'm not an employment laws expert, but that has got to be illegal. But they get away with it because it is not challenged. Or maybe hard too challenge. Either way, same applies for PI team. There only problem they have is foreign players will have too get working visa, not easy. So they'll mostly be PI kiwis.
Again, based on which law would that be illegal?
Definitely not the Human Rights Act, which only forbids discrimination based on sex, marital status, religious belief, ethical belief, colour, race, and ethnic or national origins. Dinstinugishing players based on which country they are eligible to represent in sport doesn't fall under any of these criteria. Not signing someone who's white, however, is.
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@Snowy yeah it is the MoE definition, but it is not coomon usage - I only know it from working in a school. But there are a ton of questions that need answering, I agree. But I am pretty sure that the common usage of Pasifica is what they are meaning. Problem is they;ve let the genie out of the bottle by saying we need a pasifika SR team, but (especially now with CV) there is no way to have a team in the islands that is profitable. Travel costs etc are what they are trying to get away with by ditching SA for SR. It's worth it for the big dosh internationals, but not for the much less dosh SR. But the genie is out, NZR have fucked up again in that stupid Aratipu release. Instead of keeping their cards close to their chest, negotiating with international partners, and putting quiet feelers out. They have pissed off Oz, Sa, Arg at the same time as putting themselves in a position where they have to support another SR team. Basically from picking Foster on, NZR has been a cluster fuck.
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@Stargazer said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
@taniwharugby yes. But under NZ laws you cannot deny an NZer a job because they are not qualified to play for the ABs, but NZR successfully do.
Which law is that? I'm not so sure that's true.
@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
The quota is two non NZ qualified players per SR team, others have to apply for dispensation. I'm not an employment laws expert, but that has got to be illegal. But they get away with it because it is not challenged. Or maybe hard too challenge. Either way, same applies for PI team. There only problem they have is foreign players will have too get working visa, not easy. So they'll mostly be PI kiwis.
Again, based on which law would that be illegal?
Definitely not the Human Rights Act, which only forbids discrimination based on sex, marital status, religious belief, ethical belief, colour, race, and ethnic or national origins. Dinstinugishing players based on which country they are eligible to represent in sport doesn't fall under any of these criteria. Not signing someone who's white, however, is.
Yeha I could be totally wrong, but say I want to employ someone and I say to NZ born/passport holder who has played for Samoa - sorry won't employ you cos you can't reperesent ABs. That is what NZR do with SR. Maybe sports have a different rule that the rest of the jobs in NZ?
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@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
The team will be under Tina, Samoa and Fijian RU governance. NZR won't be running it or picking coaches, so any employment law issues will be their problem. If NZR can get away with picking NZ only qualified people in SR, then the Pacific team can do three same with island qualified. It won't be based on raced, but international qualification, is my guess.
I don't think it will. Thye have no money, and some of them (Cough, Tonga) have no governance.
It will be privately owned. It will operate from NZ, and post-covid at best with a game or 2 in Suva or Apia.
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@Rapido The NZH article: "A proposal has been tabled to run a Pasifika Moana team out of South Auckland which will be funded by a mix of broadcast and sponsorship income and governed by respective representatives from Fiji, Samoa and Tonga."
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@Machpants Just call them the Purples or something and it all goes away.
We have already seen how the Crusaders name has been questioned - let's not do it again was the point.
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@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
@Snowy ah gotcha, yeah I totally missed your point, sorry. Not going to happen cos 'positive discrimination' is cool
Yeah. Racism only goes one way ay.
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@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
Basically from picking Foster on, NZR has been a cluster fuck.
When did Tew leave?
Not impressed with how NZR have handled the negotiations with SANZAAR. Could come back to bite them (if it hasn't already)
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@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
@Rapido The NZH article: "A proposal has been tabled to run a Pasifika Moana team out of South Auckland which will be funded by a mix of broadcast and sponsorship income and governed by respective representatives from Fiji, Samoa and Tonga."
The last thing they want is any governance from Tongan representatives.
From 5 days ago: https://www.rnz.co.nz/international/pacific-news/426906/tonga-rugby-union-facing-financial-oblivion
Although it says financial oblivion, it is really governance oblivion. All they need to do is agree a tripartite agreement with World Rugby and Tongan government and the sweet, sweet WR funds tap gets switched back on. Can't even do that. Billy and Mako's Dad won't let anyone in.
World Rugby is set to pull all funding to TRU if it fails to sign a tripartite agreement to work alongside the Tonga government and global governing body by the end of the day.
The agreement would see an interim management group take charge of the Union until long-standing governance issues are resolved
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@Rapido Tonga Rugby Union did end up signing the agreement last Friday.
From an article today:
The TRU signed a tripartite agreement with World Rugby and the Tonga Government on Friday , after the global governing body had threatened to pull all financial support.
Former Tonga rugby captain questions new TRU governance
Former 'Ikale Tahi captain Inoke Afeaki is sceptical a new governing arrangement will lead to lasting change for the Tonga Rugby Union.
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@KiwiMurph said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
@Rapido Tonga Rugby Union did end up signing the agreement last Friday.
From an article today:
The TRU signed a tripartite agreement with World Rugby and the Tonga Government on Friday , after the global governing body had threatened to pull all financial support.
Former Tonga rugby captain questions new TRU governance
Former 'Ikale Tahi captain Inoke Afeaki is sceptical a new governing arrangement will lead to lasting change for the Tonga Rugby Union.
That fuck for that, not for the fluffybunnies that run it, but the hardworking palyers who sacrifice a lot to represent their country/heritage.
EDIT: Ouch scathing comments in the article
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@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
@Rapido I am not saying it is a good idea, just that it is the idea
Yes. but I'm saying the idea is probably deliberate porkies or half-truth. Putting forward a half-truth solution they know can't be followed through.
The respective representatives from Fiji, Samoa and Tonga will probably be Pasifika NZers employed by the 'NZRU and private owner partnership' that ends up paying to set this team up / owning it. Not answerable in any way to any of the 3 PI unions.
So, basically just another NZ super franchise.
Pasifika - Wikipedia
