NPC Final - Auckland vs Canterbury (free entry)
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@tim said in NPC Final - Auckland vs Canterbury (free entry):
Ieremia focused on structure, culture and discipline in a bid to rebuild Auckland into the force it once was.
Perhaps should have bolded this bit, as well!
I daresay he learned all that from Hammer!
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@chris-b Let this not distract us from the fact that Hammer's still an idiot.
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@tim Akira Ioane is clearly now a much better player than Vaea Fifita or Luke Whitelock. If he maintains form or pushes forward in Super Rugby next year, he'll be worth a place in the Rugby World Cup squad. Going easy on the beers and partying for a bit will help his cause. He might even move ahead of Kieron Read as the starting 8.
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@canes4life said in NPC Final - Auckland vs Canterbury (free entry):
@chris-b Let this not distract us from the fact that Hammer's still an idiot.
The thing is...if Hammer were an idiot...how come he keeps getting jobs - and in NZ Rugby?
It's a small world.
If Hammer had shit the bed as badly as you guys think, he'd be done in NZ.
But, I'll post this once more for you. And then note the results of the Hurricanes subsequent to Hammer's tenure.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/super-rugby/10268601/Hammett-was-popular-in-dressing-room-Smith
Hammer didn't have all the answers at the Canes - I'd say he struggled to put together a coherent gameplan.
But, he very clearly didn't destroy the franchise. He built a team that won. Pretty much as Conrad predicted.
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@sparky said in NPC Final - Auckland vs Canterbury (free entry):
@tim He might even move ahead of Kieron Read as the starting 8.
Steady on. The captain isn't being replaced unless he physically can't play.
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@chris-b And there you are - thought you'd been abducted by aliens. Following the same reasoning I am impressed with how Foster built the Chiefs so that Rennie could win with them.
It was also impressive how Vance Stewart set up the Crusaders in 1996 so that Wayne Smith could benefit and eventually win in 1998.
The work that Jed Rowlands and Frank Oliver did in setting up the Blues for Sloane/Henry to win in 2003 was impressive too.
Also, it was great how Hammett got rid of Nonu so that he could rebuild the team for four years of mediocrity and this allowed Boyd to bring Nonu back to get the Canes to the finals and set them up for the win the following year.
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@Chris-B I think we have all met that person in our work lives that continues to get hired despite all evidence that they are lacking. The type that interviews well and blinds everyone to their bad traits.
We have one where I'm working at present. The bosses were so excited when offering him the job yet he has turned out to offer nothing in the key aspects of his role and is clearly out of his depth.
Bullshitting on ability only works when you can engineer results. -
@crucial Yep - and if Conrad had come out and said Hammer was a c#nt, I'd have accepted it.
Or even if he'd said nothing at all, then I'd be more damning of Hammer.
But, he didn't. He said...
"It's not often when a head coach leaves that none of the players actually want him to go. We all love him, love what he's done for the club and he'll be sorely missed," Smith said today.
"True character is often revealed in the fullness of time and in years to come all the players under him now will look back on him now and say how much he did for the club."
That's a pretty glowing endorsement and I've heard nothing from the Hurricanes that were in that latter team to discount it.
He was also pretty popular at the Crusaders and he seems to be getting along pretty well at the Highlanders.
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@chris-b When Hammett first took over he said "judge me on my results" and as a Canes fan we gave him the benefit of the doubt, before swiftly realising he was far too inexperienced, lacked any real tactical coaching ability and obviously had no idea how to communicate with the melting pot of athletes in that Canes environment. Don't forget guys like Gear and Weepu also signed elsewhere as they knew it was probably career suicide sticking with a team that was being coached by someone completely out of his depth.
In my mind the return of players like Nonu and the introduction of local & experienced coaches in the form of Plum and Boyd probably reflects the true reason our results improved.
Mark Hammett may well be a successful coach down the track and may go on to coach a team to a Super title, but his time at the Canes was a failure because he wasn't ready to take on a position like that. He should have done his time at NPC level before getting a gig like that, something that still baffles me today.
So no, he doesn't deserve credit for the 2016 title.
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@canes4life said in NPC Final - Auckland vs Canterbury (free entry):
@chris-b When Hammett first took over he said "judge me on my results" and as a Canes fan we gave him the benefit of the doubt, before swiftly realising he was far too inexperienced, lacked any real tactical coaching ability and obviously had no idea how to communicate with the melting pot of athletes in that Canes environment. Don't forget guys like Gear and Weepu also signed elsewhere as they knew it was probably career suicide sticking with a team that was being coached by someone completely out of his depth.
In my mind the return of players like Nonu and the introduction of local & experienced coaches in the form of Plum and Boyd probably reflects the true reason our results improved.
Mark Hammett may well be a successful coach down the track and may go on to coach a team to a Super title, but his time at the Canes was a failure because he wasn't ready to take on a position like that. He should have done his time at NPC level before getting a gig like that, something that still baffles me today.
This is his comment after the Matthew Rees book.
"In hindsight, I think I probably tried to move things ahead too quickly, with regards to player workloads and gameplans/techniques, without understanding the nature of the northern hemisphere competition and the culture of the club.
"This was a big learning I took out of my time there and have taken those learnings into all my future coaching roles since."
Note this happened after the Canes. One of the biggest gripes about his time in Wellington was that he didn't understand the culture of the club and immediately set to change it to his way. It didn't work for him (results wise) there and didn't work again in Cardiff. He says he has now learned his lesson.
I always had the impression that Conrad Smith was happy for the culture to change as he also didn't feel accepted (probably the wrong word there) and the changes meant that he could do his job better. Hammetts ways suited Conrad. -
@crucial You could also read it that things were a bit of a shambles at Cardiff and Hammer immediately saw the need for change.
One thing I distinctly remember on this board was Canes' fans mocking Hammer for his focus on culture.
It's subsequently become pretty obvious that this is of huge importance to successful sports teams!
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@chris-b said in NPC Final - Auckland vs Canterbury (free entry):
@crucial You could also read it that things were a bit of a shambles at Cardiff and Hammer immediately saw the need for change.
One thing I distinctly remember on this board was Canes' fans mocking Hammer for his focus on culture.
It's subsequently become pretty obvious that this is of huge importance to successful sports teams!
I think we mocked his focus on culture change that affected playing style as well.
All fair enough to have a no dickheads policy and get a team tighter but he threw the baby out with the bathwater trying to turn the Canes into the Saders.
He took a generation of incoming players that grew up admiring and trying to emulate their local heroes like Cully, Lomu, Umaga, Rodders etc and tried to turn them into Tim Batemans -
This thread is hilarious.
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@crucial Yep - and I'll agree that he didn't come up with a decent gameplan. Boyd and Plumtree added that.
But, I think implemented a necessary cultural revolution and if he hadn't, you guys could have spent the last five years being the Blues!
@Canefan - by far the biggest loss of the defectors was Cruden. He played a key role in winning Rennie two titles.
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@canes4life the Coach the Canes had to have, you know like that loss the ABs had to have before the 2011 and 2015 WC victories
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@nepia said in NPC Final - Auckland vs Canterbury (free entry):
@chris-b And there you are - thought you'd been abducted by aliens. Following the same reasoning I am impressed with how Foster built the Chiefs so that Rennie could win with them.
It was also impressive how Vance Stewart set up the Crusaders in 1996 so that Wayne Smith could benefit and eventually win in 1998.
The work that Jed Rowlands and Frank Oliver did in setting up the Blues for Sloane/Henry to win in 2003 was impressive too.
Also, it was great how Hammett got rid of Nonu so that he could rebuild the team for four years of mediocrity and this allowed Boyd to bring Nonu back to get the Canes to the finals and set them up for the win the following year.
Nick White must be pleased with Auckland's win on the weekend. He built that team. Get that man a coaching gig in Ta$man.
