Transformer Boks v Irish Projects - Ireland's SA Tour 2016 - Series Decider

cgrant

Is McCloskey injured ?

Derm McCrum

Actual Ireland squad announced
 
Forwards (18) 
Finlay Bealham (Corinthians/Connacht) 
Rory Best (Banbridge/Ulster) (c) 
Sean Cronin (St Marys/Leinster) 
Ultan Dillane (Corinthians/Connacht) 
Tadhg Furlong (Clontarf/Leinster) 
Jamie Heaslip (Dublin University/Leinster) (vc) 
Iain Henderson (Ballynahinch/Ulster) 
David Kilcoyne (UL Bohemians/Munster) 
Jack McGrath (St Marys/Leinster) 
Jordi Murphy (Lansdowne/Leinster) 
Sean Reidy (Belfast Harlequins/Ulster) 
Mike Ross (Clontarf/Leinster) 
Quinn Roux (Galwegians/Connacht) 
Rhys Ruddock (St Marys/Leinster) 
Donnacha Ryan (Shannon/Munster) 
CJ Stander (Munster) 
Richardt Strauss (Old Wesley/Leinster) 
Devin Toner (Lansdowne/Leinster)
Backs (14) 
Keith Earls (Young Munster/Munster) 
Luke Fitzgerald (Blackrock/Leinster) 
Robbie Henshaw (Buccaneers/Connacht) 
Paddy Jackson (Dungannon/Ulster) 
David Kearney (Lansdowne/Leinster) 
Rob Kearney (UCD/Leinster) 
Kieran Marmion (Corinthians/Connacht) 
Luke Marshall (Ballymena/Ulster) 
Conor Murray (Garryowen/Munster) 
Stuart Olding (Belfast Harlequins/Ulster) 
Jared Payne (Ulster) 
Eoin Reddan (Old Crescent/Leinster) 
Jonathan Sexton (St Marys/Leinster) 
Andrew Trimble (Ballymena/Ulster) 
Roux selected as one of five Connacht players getting the nod after their whirlwind season. Roux moved from SA to Leinster on a one-year deal. He then got a two-year extension. In his second season, he was loaned out to Connacht for a few months to get some games. Then the loan was extended until end of season and end of his Leinster contract. Leinster didn't want to renew but Connacht offered him another two-year contract. He qualified on residency last year but wasn't considered. Now Schmidt has decided to give him the nod - maybe just to put a cap on his head. 
Finlay Bealham born in Australia went to Ireland at 19 to see if he could get pro contract after failing to make Brumbies academy. His mother's family is from Ireland and he started to play for local club, then got a chance with Ireland U20s, went to Ulster and then moved to Connacht. Capped in the Six Nations this year. 
Sean Reidy is a Kiwi who qualifies through Irish grandmother in Kerry. Played for Counties Manakau, then offered a one year contract with Ulster in 2014. It was renewed for a further two years.

Derm McCrum

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="cgrant" data-cid="582695" data-time="1464178271">Is McCloskey injured ?</blockquote>
 
No. Just not selected.

jegga

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Pot Hale" data-cid="582384" data-time="1464139098">
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Yes. Although I'd be fairly sure that none of those players would describe their nationality as Irish per se. Northern Irish or British more likely. ;)
 
I put the list together especially for Jegga. :)
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</blockquote>
 
 
Cheers, looks like those "tacit agreements"are working well, speaking of which I see Jake Heenan has somewhat unsurprisingly declared himself available for Ireland.

Billy Tell

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="jegga" data-cid="582984" data-time="1464244597">
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Cheers, looks like those "tacit agreements"are working well, speaking of which I see Jake Heenan has somewhat unsurprisingly declared himself available for Ireland.
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There has to be more to this than meets the eye I reckon: NZU20 captain leaves without even trying his hand at Super Rugby, and 3 years later declares for Ireland?
 
I find it strange...
 
He seems decent enough, but injured 95% of the time.

Derm McCrum

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="jegga" data-cid="582984" data-time="1464244597">
Cheers, looks like those "tacit agreements"are working well, speaking of which I see Jake Heenan has somewhat unsurprisingly declared himself available for Ireland.</blockquote>
Tacit agreements? Like the ones with Ben Te'o and Gerhard van den Heever? 
Didn't see Heenan's declaration. He's three years at the end of June and he's signed on for another two years with Connacht with the promise of Champions Cup in the offing. No one has been beating down his door to join them, though. 
"I guess I have to make up own mind whether I'll stay here or go home and try for the All Blacks, or try for England but international rugby is definitely on the agenda," he said a couple of years ago. 
After two years in the Auckland development squad, Heenan found himself not wanted for the Blues so he looked further afield. "I was 21 when I moved here. There were no good offers on the table for me back home. This was the best offer for me," he says.

Derm McCrum

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Billy Tell" data-cid="582484" data-time="1464148172">
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Ireland squad will have 2 main issues: no top-class openside flanker and potentially a bit of a "meh" back 3, although I see your squad doesn't include Dave Kearney...
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Err...... don't look now.....

Billy Tell

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Pot Hale" data-cid="583060" data-time="1464286443">
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Err...... don't look now.....
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What's your take. Schimidt has gone for his 2 hotsteppers (Earls and Fitzgerald) and his 2 fairly uninspiring dependables (DK & Trimble).
 
Would you have taken a punt on one of the speedier boys (Healy, Gilroy, your Nigerian lad etc)?
 
I suppose there's no McFadden, so that's something...

Derm McCrum

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Billy Tell" data-cid="583061" data-time="1464287151">
<div>
What's your take. Schimidt has gone for his 2 hotsteppers (Earls and Fitzgerald) and his 2 fairly uninspiring dependables (DK & Trimble).
 
Would you have taken a punt on one of the speedier boys (Healy, Gilroy, your Nigerian lad etc)?
 
I suppose there's no McFadden, so that's something...
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I think it may depend on who is going to be in Coetzee's squad and who they're likely to face in opening test. I suspect Earls and Fitzy who have touring experience in SA to stand to them. 
 
I wouldn't have gone with Gilroy - too much spinning going on for my liking. Healy and Adeolokun have been on fire, with Healy the more accomplished of the two in terms of stepping and sheer acceleration. Both of them are good finishers though - would have been nice to see Healy heading off.
This clip features Adeolokun scoring two, Bealham going over and Dillane's power on the run in a thumping win over Munster. Think Healy is in there too.

-

jegga

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Pot Hale" data-cid="583047" data-time="1464262387">
<div>
Tacit agreements? Like the ones with Ben Te'o and Gerhard van den Heever? 
Didn't see Heenan's declaration. He's three years at the end of June and he's signed on for another two years with Connacht with the promise of Champions Cup in the offing. No one has been beating down his door to join them, though. 
"I guess I have to make up own mind whether I'll stay here or go home and try for the All Blacks, or try for England but international rugby is definitely on the agenda," he said a couple of years ago. 
After two years in the Auckland development squad, Heenan found himself not wanted for the Blues so he looked further afield. "I was 21 when I moved here. There were no good offers on the table for me back home. This was the best offer for me," he says.
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"Tacit agreements" was the phrase that Irish troll that showed up a while back used to describe Irelands poaching.
 
Re Heenan <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.sportsjoe.ie/rugby/watch-jake-heenan-declares-intention-to-make-ireland-debut-against-new-zealand/78148'>http://www.sportsjoe.ie/rugby/watch-jake-heenan-declares-intention-to-make-ireland-debut-against-new-zealand/78148</a>
 
 
"I've every intention of playing international rugby. For me, it's about coming back in good shape, having a good pre-season and putting the performances in and hopefully put my hand up for November.
"I have every belief that I'm good enough and that I'm able to put in the performances needed to play [for Ireland].
"I have every opportunity, at Connacht, to do it because of the games we're playing. I just have to look after myself, work hard, do my thing and hopefully get the nod."

Derm McCrum

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="jegga" data-cid="583165" data-time="1464326398">
<div>
"Tacit agreements" was the phrase that Irish troll that showed up a while back used to describe Irelands poaching.
 
Re Heenan <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.sportsjoe.ie/rugby/watch-jake-heenan-declares-intention-to-make-ireland-debut-against-new-zealand/78148'>http://www.sportsjoe.ie/rugby/watch-jake-heenan-declares-intention-to-make-ireland-debut-against-new-zealand/78148</a>
 
 
"I've every intention of playing international rugby. For me, it's about coming back in good shape, having a good pre-season and putting the performances in and hopefully put my hand up for November.
"I have every belief that I'm good enough and that I'm able to put in the performances needed to play [for Ireland].
"I have every opportunity, at Connacht, to do it because of the games we're playing. I just have to look after myself, work hard, do my thing and hopefully get the nod."
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</blockquote>
 
Well, I'm not sure what that means since some of these NIQ players only get a one- or two-year contract. And even if they get three years, there's no guarantee that the player will stay or be good enough. 
 
Ben Te'o was Leinster's 'project' pick two years ago, but he decided not to wait another year at Leinster, and signed for English club, Worcester Warriors to 'further his career' and eh - so he could play for England - Jones has now selected him. Van den Heever wasn't good enough and was released by Munster and he's headed for Japan. Poolman at Connacht is in his fourth year and not in any squad selections. Bleyendaal at Munster seems to be heading in a similar direction, with all his injuries, but maybe he'll improve next season, and surpass Keatley at 10- which shouldn't be difficult, or partner Saili in midfield, since Irish player, Johnny Holland, is showing a lot of promise at fly-half, along with Carty and Ronaldson at Connacht.
 
The only current players that I see getting regular game-time are Payne (first-choice), Stander (first choice) and Strauss (bench behind Cronin). White was a filler-in and hasn't been picked for the SA tour - age is against him anyway. Stander should be a regular mainstay, at least until O'Mahony recovers and competes for the 6 spot again, or possibly Henderson is preferred in that spot. Although Stander could shift to 8 to take over Heaslip's mantle, at some point. The objective of the foreign restrictions on numbers/position (4) and the project player (1) rules is to make sure there are a minimum of two test quality qualified players in every position playing for the provinces. If Connacht are given full provincial status going forward - and I think they should be - then these rules will apply to them as well, and will cut numbers in their squad. Or the IRFU could even make it three non-Irish Eligible and 1 NIQ per club with a view to having three qualified players in every position across the island - this could possibly work with the proposed new changes to a conference structure for the PRO12 being talked about for the start of the 2018 season.
 
There are plenty of head-scratching queries as to why Roux has been selected at all (after four years/loaned out) instead of Irish-born players such as Mick Kearney, Ross Malony, Dave Foley, or Roux's team-mate, Andrew Browne. Pretty galling for those players.
 
Regarding Heenan, he has a curious way of going about his business. Initially he said he could play for NZ, England or Ireland and he'd wait and see and consider what his options looked like (decent of him to let us know). Then he follows this up a year later with a statement that he expects to get a call from Schmidt when his three years are up telling him that he wants to select him and Heenan could then consider that option! Given the more humble statement you've quoted, I presume at some point, someone gave him an almighty boot up the arse, (Irish equivalent of 'no dickheads' policy) and said how about playing some rugby instead of shouting the odds into the wind. Injuries didn't help his cause either in the period. He's got O'Brien, van der Flier, Henry, O'Donnell and Murphy ahead of him in the queue.
 
Edit: Just read this article about Tom McCartney and his arrival into Connacht as one of Lam's picks. He'll be 3 years resident next year. His views on why he came and stayed are interesting. <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/connacht-rugby/from-building-sites-to-pro-12-final-connachts-tom-mccartney-quietly-building-his-reputation-34750598.html'>http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/connacht-rugby/from-building-sites-to-pro-12-final-connachts-tom-mccartney-quietly-building-his-reputation-34750598.html</a>

profitius

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Pot Hale" data-cid="583385" data-time="1464360571">
<div>
 
There are plenty of head-scratching queries as to why Roux has been selected at all (after four years/loaned out) instead of Irish-born players such as Mick Kearney, Ross Malony, Dave Foley, or Roux's team-mate, Andrew Browne. Pretty galling for those players.
 
</div>
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This is another of Schmidts ridiculous selections. Quinn Roux is currently Connacht's 4th choice second row. He was with Leinster (signed by Schmidt) but they let him go to Connacht and signed Mick Kearney from Connacht. Mick Kearney is playing regularly for Leinster at the moment but hasn't made the Ireland squad. 
 
 
You would think the 17st McCloskey would be useful against the Boks of all teams. He had a good debut against England but has been dropped since.

Derm McCrum

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="profitius" data-cid="583394" data-time="1464377110">
This is another of Schmidts ridiculous selections. Quinn Roux is currently Connacht's 4th choice second row. He was with Leinster (signed by Schmidt) but they let him go to Connacht and signed Mick Kearney from Connacht. Mick Kearney is playing regularly for Leinster at the moment but hasn't made the Ireland squad. 
You would think the 17st McCloskey would be useful against the Boks of all teams. He had a good debut against England but has been dropped since.</blockquote>
I actually don't have a problem that the more versatile Olding has been brought in McCloskey's stead. He plays 15 as well and is a better bench option at 23. If Schmidt is looking to develop and widen the squad, this is one of his better selections, assuming he gives him game time. 
Roux's selection is just baffling given his status in Connacht. 
And Matt Healy instead of either D Kearney or Trimble would have been a good bolter selection.

NZRUGBYQUIZZES

Ireland have always mined the diaspora for talent, possibly always will.
 
Can't see them going too well in South Africa, they are a side on the slide after both BOD and POC retired.

Derm McCrum

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="NZ Rugby Quizzes" data-cid="583470" data-time="1464414714">
Ireland have always mined the diaspora for talent, possibly always will. 
Can't see them going too well in South Africa, they are a side on the slide after both BOD and POC retired.</blockquote>
 
A bit premature maybe if that's your reference point.

pooler fan

A few Connacht players proved a point in yesterday's final. Healey was superb.

Derm McCrum

Boks squad for the Irish incoming tour named: 
 
Forwards: Pieter-Steph du Toit, Eben Etzebeth, Siya Kolisi, Frans Malherbe, Bongi Mbonambi, Sikhumbuzo Notshe, Scarra Ntubeni, Jaco Kriel, Julian Redelinghuys, Warren Whiteley, Trevor Nyakane, Adriaan Strauss, Lood de Jager, Steven Kitshoff, Francois Louw, Tendai Mtawarira, Duane Vermeulen

Backs: Garth April, Patrick Lambie, Lwazi Mvovo, JP Pietersen, Wille le Roux, Ruan Combrinck, Faf de Klerk, Elton Jantjies, Lionel Mapoe, Jesse Kriel, Rudy Paige, Jan Serfontein, Damian de Allende, Nic Groom

Derm McCrum

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="pooler fan" data-cid="583773" data-time="1464512050">A few Connacht players proved a point in yesterday's final. Healy was superb.</blockquote> And Matt Healy may get his rewards. Luke Fitzgerald picked up yet another knee injury and is ruled out of the tour - unfortunate for him - his last tour in SA didn't last too long either with the Lions. Schmidt said: "Due to Luke picking up the knee injury one of those Connacht players is likely to be in the frame to be his replacement." â€‹They are full-back Tiernan O'Halloran, 14 Nidi Adeolokun and 11 Matt Healy. Munster's Simon Zebo is also in the running as he appears to have recovered sufficiently from an injury lay-off. "One of the advantages with Matt is that he's a left-footed left winger and like for like with Luke. He's certainly a guy who's in contention." Schmidt explained that Tommy Oâ€™Donnell was not selected as he is getting married this summer. And he explained Rouxâ€™s 124 kilogram frame might prove an essential weapon against the Springboks. Roux failed to make the Connacht squad for the Pro 12 semi and final as Pat Lam preferred Aly Muldowney, Ultan Dillane and Andrew Browne. â€œQuinn has been in and out with Connacht. One of the things with the four other secondrows we have is they all tend to play on the loosehead side of the scrum. Quinn is the sole tighthead side of the scrum player that is fully fit and available. And he has shown potential. He is a very strong scrummager and very strong in the lineout. If you go to South Africa you have got to be very, very good in your set piece."

Derm McCrum

Latest injury update today before irish squad gets on plane is that Sexton is out, with likely Madigan to replace him. 
One or both of the Kearney brothers may also be out. 
Press conference later this morning.

antipodean

Calls for aligned seasons must be getting louder to help prevent touring sides not be beset by injury.

The Silver Fern

Transformer Boks v Irish Projects - Ireland&#39;s SA Tour 2016 - Series Decider

Transformer Boks v Irish Projects - Ireland's SA Tour 2016 - Series Decider