Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022
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@hydro11 said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
@donsteppa said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
Hubris.
That was a dire level of effort and performance from the Black Caps. Thrashed by the ninth ranked team in our own backyard.
The Black Caps played that game in a world where they just have to turn up, and the lowly ranked opposition will roll over for World Champs. Luke "batting coach?" Ronchi may have been in the sun too long when he was talking about winning the game as late as last night; his charges went on to lose two wickets in about the time it took us to clear the bag check this morning.
Bowlers.
The Bangladeshi pace trio worked away constantly, with Ebadot by far the fastest bowler on display. They looked consistently dangerous. At times we looked like an early morning selection at Patrick's Pies. Ravindra bowled 20+ unmemorable overs.Changes?:
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Mitchell in for Ravindra. Little point in having a under-performing batsman and bowler at #7, regardless of pace v spin. Ravindra can find some form back in domestic cricket.
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It is very tempting to leave out Southee for just one game. For Henry or Patel, or whoever. Perhaps a short sharp reminder is needed about consistency. Or... it might just be that he's evolving into the proverbial Clouderson as his career reaches the end, and that is the best he has from now on? Am not entirely sure...
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Any random domestic keeper for Blundell may not produce a worse performance on current form - it reads like there is at least one good alternative out there on current form. There's no heir apparent in sport if you don't perform, and Blundell has done little of note to deserve that tag since the MCG.
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Taylor is very lucky Williamson is injured. Sentimentality is great, but if we want to retain that giant mace, we're a long way behind already.
Curiosity
How has Kyle Jamieson gone from a $2.86 million IPL contract last February, to eventually not getting a start for RCB, and reverting back past the mean with bat and ball for the Black Caps? Dunno, but Jurgensen, Ronchi, and/or the mental skills team have a bit of work to do.
Paint by numbers?
Gary Stead and Tom Latham. Their selections, tactics, and on-field nous are increasingly by rote; predictable and pedestrian. Latham is such a contrast with a former captain now up in the commentary box. Yes, we miss Williamson in many ways, but the contrast was still much bigger than expected.
But clearly you are overreacting based on one game?
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Don't blame the Black Caps preparation at all, it's an undeserved get out of jail card. They came into this series after playing two tests in India, both teams had to go through the same MIQ system, and the two day warmup game that the Bangladeshi's got saw only 20-odd overs bowled on day one thanks to rain. And which team was playing at home again? At a ground where we've beaten England and Pakistan in the first test of a series?
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The "hEnrY's piE cArT" retort; by that standard, see also on current form: Tim Southee, Kyle Jamieson, Rachin Ravindra.
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This is not entirely out of the blue. Ajaz's 10-for heroics in India were brilliant. But they conveniently glossed over (a) how nonthreatening the bowling was at the other end from all concerned, and (b) the "we're in India so we need spinners" mindless selection of Will Sommerville over Neil Wagner, especially by the time of the second Test. The bowling at Bay Oval was primarily a continuation of that, especially from Southee and Jamieson. Boult has had plenty of prep time in the Mount lately.
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The pitch and/or the heat. Were pretty much consistent for the full five days, but it didn't seem to affect Bangladesh anywhere near as much...
Bay Oval
Put some shade sails out the back somewhere, for goodness sake.
tl;dr: Black Caps levels of hubris = high.
This is reactionary. Jamieson averaged 30 in India; Southee averaged less than 30. Your genius idea is to replace those players with someone who averages 45 after one poor performance. Shocking, horrible idea.
Maybe we need to go back to being crap for a while so fans can stop acting so entitled?
Shocking performance by the BC, the lack of fight by the tail .Mot prepared to dig in not once but twice.
The stupid tactics of bowling to off side fields on a dead pitch with variable bounce instead of bowling at the stumps to use the variable bounce.
To keep bowling in the areas and kissing the pitch was dumb they should have hit the pitch harder on the dead pitch to use the wkt just going through the motions.
Just a very dissapointing limp arse performance .
Like the 2nd test V India soft that’s what concerns me no intent. -
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That result and the BC performance has certainly given some life to this test series.
It makes for a fascinating 2nd test in ChCh.Can Bangladesh dominate again or will the BC lift,and play a much smarter tactical game with a lot more application and intensity.
I for one am looking forward to the response from both teams.
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@sparky said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
Didn't see that result coming if I am honest. Every respect to Bangladesh on a superb performance and a sensational result.
Time for the BCs to lick their wounds in private, then bounce back at Christchurch.
No one disagreed before the game that the team we put wasn't the best one available. Apart from Wags and Conway the others failed to turn up. Time for them to salvage some pride and give the Bangles a smashing in game 2
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Fucking great start to 2022 lol
The Bangles are a team that has enough quality to beat anyone on their day if the opposition is off their game, hence them racking up more and more wins in the shorter forms. But to do it over 5 days, away from home, is a superb effort - hats off to them, they've come to play this time around and we haven't responded to the challenge. All credit to them, their fans should cherish this result.
I said earlier in the thread that we miss Kane's captaincy in games like this, and it has highlighted the lack of influence Stead has over the team. We are very much the Kane Williamson show, and if he's missing we go down a few notches in intensity and professionalism.
If we win the toss in the 2nd test and put them in on a green pitch we'll probably roll them cheaply and set up a big win. If we lose the toss that'll be a good test of whether we can respond to the challenge.
Good stuff Bangladesh, I doubt any of your fans will read this forum but you should be damn proud of that effort.
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@no-quarter said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
Fucking great start to 2022 lol
The Bangles are a team that has enough quality to beat anyone of their day if the opposition is off their game, hence them racking up more and more wins in the shorter forms. But to do it over 5 days, away from home, is a superb effort - hats off to them, they've come to play this time around and we haven't responded to the challenge. All credit to them, their fans should cherish this result.
I said earlier in the thread that we miss Kane's captaincy in games like this, and it has highlighted the lack of influence Stead has over the team. We are very much the Kane Williamson show, and if he's missing we go down a few notches in intensity and professionalism.
If we win the toss in the 2nd test and put them in on a green pitch we'll probably roll them cheaply and set up a big win. If we lose the toss that'll be a good test of whether we can respond to the challenge.
Good stuff Bangladesh, I doubt any of your fans will read this forum but you should be damn proud of that effort.
Easily the best moment in their cricketing history.
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I remember going to the one vs the Windies in 1995. Curtly brought the house down when he walked past the bank and waved at everyone while the Windies were batting ( let’s face it he had a lot of time to put his feet up )
But that was a very good Windies team and we were a bit shit in many cases. Defeat was expected. This loss today is much, much worse.
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@nzzp said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
@mn5 they missed that game against Pakistan where we couldn't chase 110 or so in Hamilton. That was gutting.
The south Africa game shouldn't be in the list, quality quality bowling that did the same to Australia a year or two later I think
Yep, Australia briefly were threatening 26 all out from memory.
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@donsteppa said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
@nzzp said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
@mn5 they missed that game against Pakistan where we couldn't chase 110 or so in Hamilton. That was gutting.
The south Africa game shouldn't be in the list, quality quality bowling that did the same to Australia a year or two later I think
Yep, Australia briefly were threatening 26 all out from memory.
This one: 9/21 at one stage
Result
Australia vs South Africa, 1st Test
Australia tour of South AfricaAUS 284 & 47
SA 96 & 236/2
South Africa won by 8 wicketsClick here to view more @espncricinfo :
South Africa beat Australia, South Africa won by 8 wickets, 1st Test, at Newlands, Cape Town
SA 96 & 236/2 vs AUS 284 & 47 - South Africa won by 8 wickets in Cape Town, Australia tour of South Africa 2011, November 09 - 11, 2011. Check out results, scorecard and detailed analysis of SA vs AUS 1st Test, 2011
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@canefan said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
@sparky said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
Didn't see that result coming if I am honest. Every respect to Bangladesh on a superb performance and a sensational result.
Time for the BCs to lick their wounds in private, then bounce back at Christchurch.
No one disagreed before the game that the team we put wasn't the best one available. Apart from Wags and Conway the others failed to turn up. Time for them to salvage some pride and give the Bangles a smashing in game 2
A couple of thoughts:
Despite the poor performance I think the only realistic possible change is Mitchell for Ravindra.
And realistically there's more future in Ravindra than Santner, so happy to invest a little there.
Can't see Blundell getting dropped for this test. But can see a replacement moving forward.
Team need a rocket (and tackle bags).
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@mn5 said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
@no-quarter said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
Fucking great start to 2022 lol
The Bangles are a team that has enough quality to beat anyone of their day if the opposition is off their game, hence them racking up more and more wins in the shorter forms. But to do it over 5 days, away from home, is a superb effort - hats off to them, they've come to play this time around and we haven't responded to the challenge. All credit to them, their fans should cherish this result.
I said earlier in the thread that we miss Kane's captaincy in games like this, and it has highlighted the lack of influence Stead has over the team. We are very much the Kane Williamson show, and if he's missing we go down a few notches in intensity and professionalism.
If we win the toss in the 2nd test and put them in on a green pitch we'll probably roll them cheaply and set up a big win. If we lose the toss that'll be a good test of whether we can respond to the challenge.
Good stuff Bangladesh, I doubt any of your fans will read this forum but you should be damn proud of that effort.
Easily the best moment in their cricketing history.
I remember back in the 80s when the fledgling Sri Lankan cricket test side were the easybeats of world cricket. Similarly, Bangladesh have a strong fan and player base, and it was inevitable that they would win an away test against a top tier nation sooner rather than later. Still a shame it had to be us, but a good kick up the arse isn't necessarily a bad thing. We did not become rubbish overnight, but lessons regarding preparation for every opponent should be seared into these guys from this loss
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Haven’t read the prior 360odd posts but to me this performance really highlights the impact that Williamson has on the team when he’s on the field, in a captaincy role or otherwise.
He leads from the front and the “steady the ship” slogan really shows the composure he brings to not only his game but the other players in the team, ie, those who he bats with, and whilst fielding the chat in the field and tactical changes he makes with bowlers and the field, etc. I can’t believe we would have folded or played with a lack of spine like we did the past 5 days had he been in the team.
The sooner he is back, the better.
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Fuck being a Kiwi cricket fan. Second you start to think we don't do that shit anymore, we do.
Regardless of anything else, that Wednesday morning effort was atrociously poor. We still had a pretty good chance of a draw with 5 wickets intact on a dead wicket. All we had to do was block it out and get the last 5 wickets to add another 100-120 runs and we would have been fine. Instead we rolled over like lame ducks.
We have a right to be angry, we are supposed to be better than this shit now.
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@canefan said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
I remember back in the 80s when the fledgling Sri Lankan cricket test side were the easybeats of world cricket. Similarly, Bangladesh have a strong fan and player base, and it was inevitable that they would win an away test against a top tier nation sooner rather than later.
And I think Bangles have been pretty solid in age grade for a number of years now so yeah it was only a matter of time.
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@canefan said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
@no-quarter said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
Fucking great start to 2022 lol
The Bangles are a team that has enough quality to beat anyone of their day if the opposition is off their game, hence them racking up more and more wins in the shorter forms. But to do it over 5 days, away from home, is a superb effort - hats off to them, they've come to play this time around and we haven't responded to the challenge. All credit to them, their fans should cherish this result.
I said earlier in the thread that we miss Kane's captaincy in games like this, and it has highlighted the lack of influence Stead has over the team. We are very much the Kane Williamson show, and if he's missing we go down a few notches in intensity and professionalism.
If we win the toss in the 2nd test and put them in on a green pitch we'll probably roll them cheaply and set up a big win. If we lose the toss that'll be a good test of whether we can respond to the challenge.
Good stuff Bangladesh, I doubt any of your fans will read this forum but you should be damn proud of that effort.
Easily the best moment in their cricketing history.
I remember back in the 80s when the fledgling Sri Lankan cricket test side were the easybeats of world cricket. Similarly, Bangladesh have a strong fan and player base, and it was inevitable that they would win an away test against a top tier nation sooner rather than later. Still a shame it had to be us, but a good kick up the arse isn't necessarily a bad thing. We did not become rubbish overnight, but lessons regarding preparation for every opponent should be seared into these guys from this loss
NZ vs SL Cricket Scorecard, 1st Test at Wellington, January 31 - February 04, 1991
Get cricket scorecard of 1st Test, NZ vs SL, Sri Lanka tour of New Zealand 1990/91 at Basin Reserve, Wellington dated January 31 - February 04, 1991.
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[rant] Wow what a disaster, fair play to the Bangladeshi team for exploiting our arrogance/ineptitude or whatever it was that lead to a complete lack of adherence to the recent blackcap standards and Im talking about actions in the field. The form was well below par, but the behavioural aspect was one of the most disappointing aspects of that game.
Also this shows again that the selection management of the squad was again poor, not just the prep which was also below par. Stead is a joke. I am sure I will be corrected if I am wrong, but I heard on TV commentary that Patel didn't even make this squad?, yet spin played a major part. The irony is Stead would have probably left Wagner out if he actually read the pitch correctly. Seriously are team management so arrogant they do not even consult the ground consultants these days? Admittedly if our pace/carthorse bowlers actually bowled to their ability we would have been more competitive, although I agree with those that said our batting was more of a worry.
I can't see [scribe]many/if any [/scribe] changes for Christchurch although the riot act should be read to the team about their on field effort and behaviour
Team selection will be important for Christchurch and if there has to be a knee-jerk reaction change, then it should be Blundell/Cleaver. If you're not going to play your number one keeper on a greenish pitch to Bangladesh then its only going to get harder. Stead needs to talk to the groundsmen first before making any selection and if he doesn't take on the feedback then he should be the one getting the uppercut.
Lastly can we rig a fricken toss?!
[/rant]
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@godder said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
@canefan said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
@no-quarter said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
Fucking great start to 2022 lol
The Bangles are a team that has enough quality to beat anyone of their day if the opposition is off their game, hence them racking up more and more wins in the shorter forms. But to do it over 5 days, away from home, is a superb effort - hats off to them, they've come to play this time around and we haven't responded to the challenge. All credit to them, their fans should cherish this result.
I said earlier in the thread that we miss Kane's captaincy in games like this, and it has highlighted the lack of influence Stead has over the team. We are very much the Kane Williamson show, and if he's missing we go down a few notches in intensity and professionalism.
If we win the toss in the 2nd test and put them in on a green pitch we'll probably roll them cheaply and set up a big win. If we lose the toss that'll be a good test of whether we can respond to the challenge.
Good stuff Bangladesh, I doubt any of your fans will read this forum but you should be damn proud of that effort.
Easily the best moment in their cricketing history.
I remember back in the 80s when the fledgling Sri Lankan cricket test side were the easybeats of world cricket. Similarly, Bangladesh have a strong fan and player base, and it was inevitable that they would win an away test against a top tier nation sooner rather than later. Still a shame it had to be us, but a good kick up the arse isn't necessarily a bad thing. We did not become rubbish overnight, but lessons regarding preparation for every opponent should be seared into these guys from this loss
NZ vs SL Cricket Scorecard, 1st Test at Wellington, January 31 - February 04, 1991
Get cricket scorecard of 1st Test, NZ vs SL, Sri Lanka tour of New Zealand 1990/91 at Basin Reserve, Wellington dated January 31 - February 04, 1991.
This is what I was thinking of
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@nzzp said in Black Caps v Bangladesh 2022:
The south Africa game shouldn't be in the list, quality quality bowling that did the same to Australia a year or two later I think
Although it's obviously a stain on our record the 26 at Eden Park was probably more acceptable than the loss to the Bangles.
England were coming straight on from an Ashes series where they had triumphed 3-1 after losing the first Test at the Gabba. Their confidence was sky high.
By contrast NZ really only had two class batsmen Sutcliffe and Reid and none of the team had played a game of cricket in the six weeks prior to the first test.
The England side had a host of all time greats captained by Hutton and including May, Cowdrey, Graveney in the batting line up Godfrey Evans (wk) and a bowling attack led by Statham and the blistering pace of Tyson supported by the spin of Wardle and Appleyard and the all rounder Trevor Bailey.
Then it rained - on uncovered wickets. England were only just in front when Hutton said to his bowlers stick around. If we can get a lead of 40 we won't have to bat again on this wicket.
Compared to the capitulation over the last 5 days by the #2 side in the world the amateurs of 1955 did pretty good.
Stuff
