NPC - news, injuries etc
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@Crucial we are not talking about someone who’s already been selected by respective province, but more in and around a player who is in a Dev squad or not entirely happy who much be in their 2nd year of a contract and wants out..or would be just continue with the status quo and watch deteriorate further..
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@shark said in Mitre 10 Cup - news, injuries etc:
@Steven-Harris said in Mitre 10 Cup - news, injuries etc:
Some news i picked up a couple of days back ,
To be honest I find this really disappointing and it displays everything that is wrong with NZ rugby..no disrespect to the union in question
Ta$man were negotiating with both Sevu Reece & Mark Telea before the Covid19 went down, this from a very good source..
As we know, both Harbour & Waikato are in financial strife as are a few unions will be once we come out of Covid19 lockdown
Given that Ta$man has a very good crop of outside backs , I find it amazing , not to mention they seem to be doing a great job developing players within their region bar the odd one or 2 that have come into the region..I truly am staggered if that was going to be their intention.I know chatting to the Northland CEO Cam Bell last week, he mentioned off the record ,it would be great in a perfect world that if all the unions would work together to see the holistic picture that having a more even competitive competition that re engages the rugby public would be a great way kickstart the game
his suggestions was a draft , where the lower ranked teams could pick up a player from a bigger centre or in fact any other union who was surplus to requirements, but there are some unions that would rather have all the cards stacked in their favour and win a title playing in front of nobody.
NZ rugby needs a competitive competition from Mitre 10 cup level In my opinion that will bring crowds back that are engaging and tribal.
How good has it been viewing many of the old Air NZ NPC games..?
My personal favourite being the 2001 Northland v Auckland game at Eden Park,Auckland with team laden with All Blacks, Northland with some hero’s of their own and guy by the name of Rupeni Caucaunibuca.The NZRFU has increased the number of staff incrementally in the last 7 years by 80%..seems crazy when the lower levels of your game has been totally ignored..I have always said, I have never been overly concerned about All Black Rugby or Super Rugby, but when the house of cards eventually falls over, it will be the lower level that suffers the most..
So it’s quite an irony talking to a good friend who coaches in the North Harbour comp, that already he has had calls from Super Rugby players that hanging out to play club rugby no matter what the directive from the establishment is saying .Who are the sides who have players of such high quality they'd make a difference to a Northland or Southland, that aren't getting games?
It's not that they are sitting on benches, more that they are stacking places 1-15.
I agree with the concept of trying for a more even comp but can't see how it would work in NZ. Plus, tribalism either comes from brand loyalty (kind of there with Super franchises) or from home town support (the guys you watched grow up/played with at school etc). I can't see how shuffling everyone around helps that at all and just creates more mercenaries.
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@Crucial, so your happy with that status quo at the minute..?
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@Steven-Harris dont think they are one in the same.
Status Quo might not be working, but I also dont think a draft system is workable either, it'd be change for changes sake while knowing the result will be a failure.
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I disagree that anyone is "stacking" their side. Maybe, maybe, if the Reece & Telea thing was substantiated, it could be said that Ta$man were looking to 'stack' their side. BUT to mitigate against that theory, they'd know that ordinarily they'd have bugger all access to the likes of a Sevu Reece, and given the likelihood of also losing David Havili'i and/or Will Jordan to representative honours, why wouldn't they want to sign the likes of a Mark Telea to fill a hole? If a union is sucessful in developing talent, be it from age-grade levels and up, or by giving a young talent a chance in their academy and 'finishing the product', and they then lose guys to the ABs for the bulk of the season, why should their going out to sign a guy be regarded as 'stacking', or as is inferred, predatory?
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@taniwharugby
We can either sit back and watch the ship sink..or we can try something..in you Union for example ,have 165 secondary school kids playing at schools out of Northland,many of these kids end up staying in the unions that they went to school at and end up in a wider training squad or not holding a permanent position River Reihana and Simon Parker for example both Northland boys who don’t hold down permanent places in the Waikato team..these are the sort of kids that would jump at the chance to play for their union of berth.. -
@Steven-Harris said in Mitre 10 Cup - news, injuries etc:
@Crucial, so your happy with that status quo at the minute..?
No, not really. I support a province that regularly goes through periods of having promising players ripped from it which helps in keeping you down and creating a spiral where those that stay eventually get offered an opportunity elsewhere.
I'd love to see a more competitive NPC comp. Currently the Salary cap is the mechanism that the NZRU use to try and achieve this. It doesn't seem to work that well when you look at some teams. Without casting aspersions they are either using loopholes or being very creative in order to stack. Those regs are the first place to look for a solution.
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@Steven-Harris see I think that is a little bit different again.
For them there is an incentive to move back, whereas some kid from Southland Boys High being drafted to play for North Harbour where he has no family or friends for $15k or whatever the min payment is. or someone from Kaitaia College being drafted to Otago.
There just isnt the money to make a draft workable in NZ.
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@shark can’t say I am huge fan of the NRL, but what they do have is competitive competition that has a salary cap and fan engagement..what we have is provincial comp that basically been turned into a feeder comp, and vehicle that gets utilised by All Black coaches when they sit fit..
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@Steven-Harris The NRL model would never work here and can't be compared, because we have relatively small regions / unions like Southland and Northland which are probably unwilling and/or unable to spend up to the salary cap. NRL teams and probably the likes of Auckland and Canterbury are at the other end of the scale as they're having to battle to stay under the cap.
A salary cap would only work if it was the most a small union could spend. And that's probably not an option as it's breach the FTA or something.
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@Steven-Harris said in Mitre 10 Cup - news, injuries etc:
@shark can’t say I am huge fan of the NRL, but what they do have is competitive competition that has a salary cap and fan engagement..what we have is provincial comp that basically been turned into a feeder comp, and vehicle that gets utilised by All Black coaches when they sit fit..
NRL falls into the franchise type tribalism bracket. Although many fans may attach themselves to their 'local' team, they are more like a football like setup where fans don't give a shit where the players wearing the colours are from. Personally I don't see the point in that. To me it should be (as much as possible) a representative comp.
Reading the salary cap regs there is a big advantage to some unions in NZ. The cap is based on the revenue from 2 years previous. So if your province got a good payout from the Super Franchise they were attached to, or held a test match, they get more money to play with.
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@shark ,if we carry on in this direction, it is doomed .
Even Bay of Plenty could see the writing on the wall and went off in their own direction to find another revenue stream by going to Rapid Rugby..
The NZRFU were furious , when you lose control of the little things in your game, they become bigger issues further down the track..
If you don’t try something, you will never know..,it’s just seems to be the kiwi way, put an idea up and gets shot down
I commend Bay of Plenty for buying into Rapid Rugby they could see it was another way of creating a revenue stream in the way I commend North Harbour from dropping levels of age group rugby.. -
@Steven-Harris said in Mitre 10 Cup - news, injuries etc:
Some news i picked up a couple of days back ,
To be honest I find this really disappointing and it displays everything that is wrong with NZ rugby..no disrespect to the union in question
Ta$man were negotiating with both Sevu Reece & Mark Telea before the Covid19 went down, this from a very good source..Reece was a mercenary at club level so it wouldn't surprise me.
As we know, both Harbour & Waikato are in financial strife as are a few unions will be once we come out of Covid19 lockdown
On this point I was surprised to read some of the staff numbers from the major unions in an article about receiving Govt assistance. Otago's payout was for 38 staff, more staff than Auckland (37), Waikato (24) or Wellington (21). Canterbury received the largest sum for 63 staff members. I am not sure if this is the total number of staff for each of these unions but both Waikato and Wellington seem to run a leaner operation but how does Otago justify having 38 staff members?
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@shark I don't think so as the same article says:
In Super Rugby, the Chiefs and Crusaders have been given $150,000, while $126,829 has gone the way of the Highlanders. The Hurricanes' owners – Hurricanes Investment Limited Partnership – has also received $112,473.60 for 16 staff.
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@Bovidae said in Mitre 10 Cup - news, injuries etc:
@Steven-Harris said in Mitre 10 Cup - news, injuries etc:
Some news i picked up a couple of days back ,
To be honest I find this really disappointing and it displays everything that is wrong with NZ rugby..no disrespect to the union in question
Ta$man were negotiating with both Sevu Reece & Mark Telea before the Covid19 went down, this from a very good source..Reece was a mercenary at club level so it wouldn't surprise me.
As we know, both Harbour & Waikato are in financial strife as are a few unions will be once we come out of Covid19 lockdown
On this point I was surprised to read some of the staff numbers from the major unions in an article about receiving Govt assistance. Otago's payout was for 38 staff, more staff than Auckland (37), Waikato (24) or Wellington (21). Canterbury received the largest sum for 63 staff members. I am not sure if this is the total number of staff for each of these unions but both Waikato and Wellington seem to run a leaner operation but how does Otago justify having 38 staff members?
TBF, Reece is a mercenary at every level.
Are you talking about provinces in the 2nd part or the franchises?
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@Nepia said in Mitre 10 Cup - news, injuries etc:
Are you talking about provinces in the 2nd part or the franchises?
Provinces only. It does give some details about what some of the other provinces received but not their staff numbers. I posted the SR info separately.
