2023 (expanded) World Cup in South Africa

Disgusted of TW

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="jegga" data-cid="554539" data-time="1453890916">
<div>
Anyone have any theories why Argentina has progressed and Italy are still fairly rubbish after 16 years in the 6n? They don't really do much for the theory that playing top teams on a regular basis helps lift a team, they aren't short of cash either or shy about poaching players .
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</blockquote>
 
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Rowan" data-cid="554562" data-time="1453895439">
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Italy has actually come a long way since the amateur age. Remember that as recently as 1999 they conceded a ton against the All Blacks and lost to Tonga at the World Cup. During much of their involvement in FIRA competition during the 20th century they generally played second fiddle to Romania, and sometimes third to the USSR. In fact, they never actually won the competition until their final year of involvement!! Now they are consistent, at least, and averaging about a win a year in the 6 Nations, having defeating all the other teams bar England. It took France a couple of decades to get up to speed after joining the 5 Nations, let's not forget. Argentina, on the other hand, has been a respectable force since the 1960s, & began to really threaten the heirarchy in the 80s (beat the Boks in SA disguised as the Jaguars, drew with NZ and very nearly snatched victory in the dying moments, thrashed the Wallabies in Aussie, beat France and all the Celtic teams). So I don't think we can really compare the two.
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</blockquote>
 
Agreed that it's not a like with like comparison. First, maybe a minor point, but arguably Argentina had more rugby DNA than Italy (the offspring of rugby playing British immigrants were heavily represented in early teams). Of course, Argentina's forwards were pretty handy already prior to the RWC era. I'm not sure why the national focus seems to have been on forwards, but as a result Argentina produced decent gnarly/nasty packs for a long time, with the occasional outstanding halfback (e.g. Porta, Dominguez) able to capitalise on the bajada platform. Not pretty, but effective. What they lacked in my view was world class backs, but the sevens programme really seems to have raised skill levels across both sevens and fifteens. Undoubtedly the exposure of the top players to European club rugby from 95 onwards made a difference, and the exposure of the latest generation to the RC has helped consolidate all of those elements into a much more formidable team than Italy.

mooshld

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Rowan" data-cid="554517" data-time="1453886972">
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& Japan beat South Africa
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How is that relevant.
 
Think of the worst team in the last world cup. You are advocating having 4 more teams worse then them. For whose benefit is that? At that level most of the players are amateur would their unions even be able to afford the cost of sending them to another country for a month.

mooshld

Ireland have more and better stadiums then NZ did. <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_stadiums_in_Ireland_by_capacity'>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_stadiums_in_Ireland_by_capacity</a> They have 25 stadiums with a capacity over 20K how many do they need? 10 tops?
 
Geographical size is irrelevant. Its not like the fans won't fit.
 
Only 2 major ciities, except for Cork and Limerick and Galway.
 
The weather will suck, well guess what, its rugby not beach volleyball, who cares what the weather is like.

Derm McCrum

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Rowan" data-cid="554558" data-time="1453894640">
That's a very haughty attitude to take. Are we not entitled to express opinions here then? 
it's your dismissive attitude which comes across as silly. It's a perfectly fair comment I made; the point being, where would you draw the line with small nation tournaments? Ireland is geographically tiny and the weather conditions are not conducive to the open, expansive brand of rugby most of us would like to see - and which we did see in South Africa in 1995. As mentioned, there are only two major cities and a limited number of stadiums - almost none of which would be rugby purpose stadiums. .</blockquote>
 
You don't see the irony (hypocrisy) in castigating others for being haughty and dismissive, whilst assessing other contending countries bids with comments like, it's tiny, only two cities, too dreary, etc, etc. 
It might be useful if you actually had some facts or personal experience to support your assertions.

jegga

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Rowan" data-cid="554558" data-time="1453894640">"So you don't know how the SA bid was better than NZs then? Probably best you stop claiming it then." 
That's a very haughty attitude to take. Are we not entitled to express opinions here then? It's a long time ago since the 2011 tournament was awarded to NZ, and I don't recall the finer details, I'm afraid, but I distinctly recall the South Africa bid appeared superior to me. What I do know are the comments I expressed above, which you failed to address in your response. "The Samoa comment is silly, it makes your argument look even weaker." 
No, it's your dismissive attitude which comes across as silly. It's a perfectly fair comment I made; the point being, where would you draw the line with small nation tournaments? Ireland is geographically tiny and the weather conditions are not conducive to the open, expansive brand of rugby most of us would like to see - and which we did see in South Africa in 1995. As mentioned, there are only two major cities and a limited number of stadiums - almost none of which would be rugby purpose stadiums. South Africa, meanwile, not only has among the best rugby purpose stadiums on the planet, it also has a vast array of football stadiums, many of which were upgraded for the 2010 FIFA World Cup. It also has a population of 50 million, and geographical dimensions which are about perfect for a World Cup tournament - which loads to do for the travelling fan.</blockquote>
 
It's not haughty at all to ask you substantiate a claim, you couldn't which suggests you have no idea how and why the SA bid was better.thd irb certainly didn't think their bid was better and that's what counted. I'm interested in why you say South Africa's size is an advantage, I disagree that a larger country is better for the touring fan. 
The Samoa comment was childish and a number of other posters have pointed out to what silly thing it was to say. Samoa are completely incapable of holding a rwc while Ireland are. You seem to have a chip on your shoulder about Ireland bidding , no idea why .

jegga

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Rowan" data-cid="554559" data-time="1453894904">
So you wouldn't hold it America either then? You know, they have that massive gun control problem . . . 
Actually, South Africa already holds an annual international 7s tournament without everybody getting mugged, and crime wasn't a problem for the FIFA World Cup there either. 
Can you elaborate on your comment about the SA union's behavior? You men their sluggish approach to transition or something?</blockquote>
 
Once again another couple of silly childish comparisons, South Africa is known for a horrific crime rate . One sevens tournament over a weekend is not the same as a rwc. But as you seem to like drifting away from the point because you might have to substantiate your otherworldly claims , in comparison to SA Ireland is the safer option for fans to visit. Are you going to argue otherwise? 
I'd prefer they didn't try and " transition " the team at all and let the best springbok team take the field regardless of the colour of their skin. 
Personally it doesn't bother me who gets it but if you're going to make claims about who should get it and why you should be able to back them up with facts . Calling someone haughty for saying you shouldn't be claiming something you can't prove is true is very childish .

rotated

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Unco" data-cid="554389" data-time="1453833109">
<div>
Should've really worked on your maths there ;)
 
2x12 = 24
3x8 = 24
4x6 = 24
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</blockquote>
 
You are of course missing 1 group of 24!
 
None of those options work as the protract an already unnecessarily long tournament, if you go about jamming an additional midweek fixture into the current schedule - that is fine - but expect injuries to make the quarterfinals onwards more of a crapshoot.
 
I would rather we hold off until we can expand to 32 - hopefully - at some point giving us an additional knockout round just like the FIFA World Cup.

Smudge

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="jegga" data-cid="554471" data-time="1453868669">
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I just read this thread, his posts reminded me of someone formerly of Levin.
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Gooo, gooo, gaaa gaaaa, gee aren't you clever?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
(I hope jegga understands that, otherwise I'm going to look like a tool. Well, more of one than usual).

jegga

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Smudge" data-cid="554604" data-time="1453926629">[font='courier new', courier, monospace]Gooo, gooo, gaaa gaaaa, gee aren't you clever?[/font] 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
(I hope jegga understands that, otherwise I'm going to look like a tool. Well, more of one than usual).</blockquote>
 
No idea what you're talking about at all. 
Not interested in the RQ business started by the usual suspects.

Unco

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="booboo" data-cid="554555" data-time="1453894344">
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I take issue with "still". I recall them being the strongest of the Home Unions. Admittedly it was the 80s ... 
It's about structure, style, management, governance, development.
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</blockquote>
It's been over 26 years booboo, it's time to let the 80s go.
 
Agreed on the second bit though. I was trying to think of all the different factors last night but I think you got the most important ones.
 
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Rowan" data-cid="554568" data-time="1453896842">
<div>
"Oh and Rowan, I think your proposed structure for a 24 team tournament sucks. Adding four teams would extend the tournament by a whooping one week, that's hardly protracted."
 
It would actually be about a week shorter. 4-team groups entail three similtaneous rounds, so can be played in just over a week with one midweek round. Let's say, a Saturday-Wednesday-Sunday schedule, for example. Then a week for each of the knock-out rounds gives us a 5-week tournament. A 20-team tournament requires 6 weeks to complete, including 3 weeks for the group stages because the four rounds cannot be played simultaneously due to uneven numbers. The controversy surrounding unequal scheduling is one of the reasons World Rugby is looking at expansion.
 
The group stages produce few surprises (a few notable exceptions, of course) and many one-sided encounters. In a 20-team tournament this goes on for about 3 weeks, half the tournament, and becomes a little tedious. In a 24-team tournament the group stages would be done and dusted in just over a week, and the rest of the tournament would entail sudden-death encounters between more evenly matched teams.
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</blockquote>
 
I meant adding four teams to the current structure would only add one week.
 
Also, your structure sucks even harder now that you've gone into it. 3 games in 9 days?! What the fuck's the point of even adding 4 new teams if you're going to send them back home a week and half later? On top of that, you'd be getting rid of some fantastic games like Georgia vs Tonga and Romania vs Canada by splitting those teams up into different pools. May as well just say fuck it, get rid of the minnows entirely and start at the sudden-death stage at that point.
 
Oh and I agree with everyone else that comparing Ireland to Samoa or Fiji of all countries is laughable.

taniwharugby

it's like there are 2 threads going on in here....

jegga

Is the weather in Ireland really any different to England? The last rwc produced some fantastic running rugby , I can't see why Ireland wouldn't be the same .

Rowan

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="jegga" data-cid="554550" data-time="1453893223">
<div>
Who are likely to be the next four teams? I don't think we need to introduce worse teams.
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Russia, Spain or Portugal, Zimbabwe or Kenya, possibly Hong Kong if they make it easy for Asia 2.

Rowan

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="mooshld" data-cid="554581" data-time="1453900853">
<div>
Ireland have more and better stadiums then NZ did. <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_stadiums_in_Ireland_by_capacity'>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_stadiums_in_Ireland_by_capacity</a> They have 25 stadiums with a capacity over 20K how many do they need? 10 tops?
 
Geographical size is irrelevant. Its not like the fans won't fit.
 
Only 2 major ciities, except for Cork and Limerick and Galway.
 
The weather will suck, well guess what, its rugby not beach volleyball, who cares what the weather is like. 
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Doesn't really compare to this:

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			<a  class="" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soccer_City" title="Soccer City">Soccer City</a>
		
			94,736
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johannesburg' title="Johannesburg">Johannesburg</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauteng' title="Gauteng">Gauteng</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Africa_national_football_team' title="South Africa national football team">South Africa national football team</a>,&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaizer_Chiefs_F.C.' title="Kaizer Chiefs F.C.">Kaizer Chiefs</a>
	
			2
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellis_Park_Stadium' title="Ellis Park Stadium">Ellis Park Stadium</a>
		
			62,567
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johannesburg' title="Johannesburg">Johannesburg</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauteng' title="Gauteng">Gauteng</a>
		
			<a  class="" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lions_(Super_rugby_franchise)" title="Lions (Super rugby franchise)">Lions</a>,&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Lions' title="Golden Lions">Golden Lions</a>
	
			3
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Odi_Stadium' title="Odi Stadium">Odi Stadium</a>
		
			60,000
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mabopane' title="Mabopane">Mabopane</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauteng' title="Gauteng">Gauteng</a>
		
			<a  class="" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garankuwa_United" title="Garankuwa United">Garankuwa United</a>
	
			4
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phakisa_Freeway' title="Phakisa Freeway">Phakisa Freeway</a>
		
			60,000
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welkom' title="Welkom">Welkom</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_State_(province)' title="Free State (province)">Free State</a>
		
			Motor Racing
	
			5
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mmabatho_Stadium' title="Mmabatho Stadium">Mmabatho Stadium</a>
		
			59,000
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahikeng' title="Mahikeng">Mahikeng</a>
		
			<a  class="" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_West" title="North West">North West</a>
		
			training ground for&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North-West_University' title="North-West University">North-West University</a>
	
			6
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cape_Town_Stadium' title="Cape Town Stadium">Cape Town Stadium</a>
		
			55,000
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cape_Town' title="Cape Town">Cape Town</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Cape' title="Western Cape">Western Cape</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ajax_Cape_Town_F.C.' title="Ajax Cape Town F.C.">Ajax Cape Town</a>
	
			7
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moses_Mabhida_Stadium' title="Moses Mabhida Stadium">Moses Mabhida Stadium</a>
		
			54,000
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durban' title="Durban">Durban</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KwaZulu-Natal' title="KwaZulu-Natal">KwaZulu-Natal</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AmaZulu_F.C.' title="AmaZulu F.C.">Amazulu</a>
	
			8
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kings_Park_Stadium' title="Kings Park Stadium">Kings Park Stadium</a>
		
			52,000
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durban' title="Durban">Durban</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KwaZulu-Natal' title="KwaZulu-Natal">KwaZulu-Natal</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharks_(rugby_union)' title="Sharks (rugby union)">Sharks</a>,&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natal_Sharks' title="Natal Sharks">Natal Sharks</a>
	
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			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loftus_Versfeld_Stadium' title="Loftus Versfeld Stadium">Loftus Versfeld Stadium</a>
		
			51,762
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pretoria' title="Pretoria">Pretoria</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauteng' title="Gauteng">Gauteng</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bulls_(rugby_union)' title="Bulls (rugby union)">Bulls</a>,&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Bulls' title="Blue Bulls">Blue Bulls</a>
	
			10
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newlands_Stadium' title="Newlands Stadium">Newlands Stadium</a>
		
			51,100
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cape_Town' title="Cape Town">Cape Town</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Cape' title="Western Cape">Western Cape</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Africa_national_rugby_union_team' title="South Africa national rugby union team">South Africa national rugby union team</a>,&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stormers' title="Stormers">Stormers</a>,&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Province_(rugby_team)' title="Western Province (rugby team)">Western Province</a>
	
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			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nelson_Mandela_Bay_Stadium' title="Nelson Mandela Bay Stadium">Nelson Mandela Bay Stadium</a>
		
			48,459
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Elizabeth' title="Port Elizabeth">Port Elizabeth</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Cape' title="Eastern Cape">Eastern Cape</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Kings' title="Southern Kings">Southern Kings</a>,&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Province_Kings' title="Eastern Province Kings">Eastern Province Kings</a>
	
			12
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Bafokeng_Stadium' title="Royal Bafokeng Stadium">Royal Bafokeng Stadium</a>
		
			42,000
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rustenburg' title="Rustenburg">Rustenburg</a>
		
			<a  class="" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_West" title="North West">North West</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Platinum_Stars_F.C.' title="Platinum Stars F.C.">Platinum Stars</a>
	
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			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Mokaba_Stadium' title="Peter Mokaba Stadium">Peter Mokaba Stadium</a>
		
			41,733
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polokwane' title="Polokwane">Polokwane</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limpopo' title="Limpopo">Limpopo</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polokwane_City_F.C.' title="Polokwane City F.C.">Polokwane City</a>
	
			14
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mbombela_Stadium' title="Mbombela Stadium">Mbombela Stadium</a>
		
			40,929
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nelspruit' title="Nelspruit">Nelspruit</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mpumalanga' title="Mpumalanga">Mpumalanga</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pumas_(rugby_team)' title="Pumas (rugby team)">Pumas</a>,&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mpumalanga_Black_Aces_F.C.' title="Mpumalanga Black Aces F.C.">Mpumalanga Black Aces</a>
	
			15
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_State_Stadium' title="Free State Stadium">Free State Stadium</a>
		
			40,911
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloemfontein' title="Bloemfontein">Bloemfontein</a>
		
			<a  class="" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_State_(South_African_province)" title="Free State (South African province)">Free State</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloemfontein_Celtic_F.C.' title="Bloemfontein Celtic F.C.">Bloemfontein Celtic F.C.</a>,&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Cheetahs' title="Central Cheetahs">Central Cheetahs</a>,&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_State_Cheetahs' title="Free State Cheetahs">Free State Cheetahs</a>
	
			16
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orlando_Stadium' title="Orlando Stadium">Orlando Stadium</a>
		
			40,000
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soweto' title="Soweto">Soweto</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauteng' title="Gauteng">Gauteng</a>
		
			<a  class="" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orlando_Pirates_F.C." title="Orlando Pirates F.C.">Orlando Pirates F.C.</a>
	
			17
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johannesburg_Stadium' title="Johannesburg Stadium">Johannesburg Stadium</a>
		
			37,500
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johannesburg' title="Johannesburg">Johannesburg</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauteng' title="Gauteng">Gauteng</a>
		
			training ground for&nbsp;<a  class="" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lions_(Super_rugby_franchise)" title="Lions (Super rugby franchise)">Lions</a>&nbsp;and&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Lions' title="Golden Lions">Golden Lions</a>
	
			18
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Mopeli_Stadium' title="Charles Mopeli Stadium">Charles Mopeli Stadium</a>
		
			35,000
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phuthaditjhaba' title="Phuthaditjhaba">Phuthaditjhaba</a>
		
			<a  class="" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_State_(South_African_province)" title="Free State (South African province)">Free State</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maluti_FET_College_F.C.' title="Maluti FET College F.C.">Maluti FET College F.C.</a>
	
			19
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wanderers_Stadium' title="Wanderers Stadium">Wanderers Stadium</a>
		
			34,000
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johannesburg' title="Johannesburg">Johannesburg</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauteng' title="Gauteng">Gauteng</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Africa_national_cricket_team' title="South Africa national cricket team">Proteas</a>,&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highveld_Lions_cricket_team' title="Highveld Lions cricket team">Highveld Lions cricket team</a>,&nbsp;<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauteng_cricket_team' title="Gauteng cricket team">Gauteng cricket team</a>
	
			20
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EPRU_Stadium' title="EPRU Stadium">EPRU Stadium</a>
		
			33,852
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Elizabeth' title="Port Elizabeth">Port Elizabeth</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Cape' title="Eastern Cape">Eastern Cape</a>
		
			no current tenant
	
			21
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athlone_Stadium' title="Athlone Stadium">Athlone Stadium</a>
		
			30,000
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cape_Town' title="Cape Town">Cape Town</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Cape' title="Western Cape">Western Cape</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santos_F.C._(South_Africa)' title="Santos F.C. (South Africa)">Santos</a>
	
			&nbsp;
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rand_Stadium' title="Rand Stadium">Rand Stadium</a>
		
			30,000
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johannesburg' title="Johannesburg">Johannesburg</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauteng' title="Gauteng">Gauteng</a>
		
			training ground for&nbsp;<a  class="" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orlando_Pirates_F.C." title="Orlando Pirates F.C.">Orlando Pirates</a>
	
			&nbsp;
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olympia_Park' title="Olympia Park">Olympia Park</a>
		
			30,000
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rustenburg' title="Rustenburg">Rustenburg</a>
		
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_West_(South_African_province)' title="North West (South African province)">North West</a>
		
			no current tenant

Rowan

Cork and Limerick are small cities of around 100,000. Galway has about 75,000.
 
Compare that to this:

			ity
		
			Population
	
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.worldatlas.com/af/za/wc/where-is-cape-town.html'>Cape Town</a>
		
			3,433,441
	
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.worldatlas.com/af/za/nl/where-is-durban.html'>Durban</a>
		
			3,120,282
	
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.worldatlas.com/af/za/gt/where-is-johannesburg.html'>Johannesburg</a>
		
			2,026,469
	
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.worldatlas.com/af/za/gt/where-is-soweto.html'>Soweto</a>
		
			1,695,047
	
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.worldatlas.com/af/za/gt/where-is-pretoria.html'>Pretoria</a>
		
			1,619,438
	
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.worldatlas.com/af/za/ec/where-is-port-elizabeth.html'>Port Elizabeth</a>
		
			967,677
	
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.worldatlas.com/af/za/nl/where-is-pietermaritzburg.html'>Pietermaritzburg</a>
		
			750,845
	
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.worldatlas.com/af/za/gt/where-is-benoni.html'>Benoni</a>
		
			605,344
	
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.worldatlas.com/af/za/gt/where-is-tembisa.html'>Tembisa</a>
		
			511,655
	
			<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.worldatlas.com/af/za/ec/where-is-east-london.html'>East London</a>
		
			478,676
	<div>&nbsp;</div>

<div>Rugby is not beach volleyball, no, but it's certainly more pleasing to the eye when played on the firm grounds of countries like SA and Australia than it is when played in the slush and mud of the Home Unions. Just a personal observation.</div>

Hooroo

It's not a competition to see who has the most stadiums, the point is, Ireland have more than enough to cope.

Rowan

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="mooshld" data-cid="554576" data-time="1453899762">
<div>
How is that relevant.
 
Think of the worst team in the last world cup. You are advocating having 4 more teams worse then them. For whose benefit is that? At that level most of the players are amateur would their unions even be able to afford the cost of sending them to another country for a month. 
</div>
</blockquote>
 
It's actually World Rugby's idea, not mine. I just happen to support it. Of course, nothing's been confirmed yet.

Hooroo

Your argument pretty much just comes down to "The Weather"

Rowan

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Pot Hale" data-cid="554583" data-time="1453902339">
<div>
You don't see the irony (hypocrisy) in castigating others for being haughty and dismissive, whilst assessing other contending countries bids with comments like, it's tiny, only two cities, too dreary, etc, etc. 
It might be useful if you actually had some facts or personal experience to support your assertions.
</div>
</blockquote>
 
I'm expressing my opinions. That's what forums are for. It's dismissing opinions with silly insults which is haughty. So, no, there's no hypocrisy at all. Personal experience, you say? I've actually been to Ireland. How about you?

Rowan

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="jegga" data-cid="554585" data-time="1453918038">
<div>
It's not haughty at all to ask you substantiate a claim, you couldn't which suggests you have no idea how and why the SA bid was better.thd irb certainly didn't think their bid was better and that's what counted. I'm interested in why you say South Africa's size is an advantage, I disagree that a larger country is better for the touring fan. 
The Samoa comment was childish and a number of other posters have pointed out to what silly thing it was to say. Samoa are completely incapable of holding a rwc while Ireland are. You seem to have a chip on your shoulder about Ireland bidding , no idea why .
</div>
</blockquote>
 
No, the reaction to it was childish. You seem to have a chip on your shoulder about Samoa - as well as South Africa.

The Silver Fern

2023 (expanded) World Cup in South Africa