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<p>To start with this is tragic beyond believe but it exposes multiple issues.......</p>
<p>They caught the guy now.....21 year old white kid shot 9 black people at a Bible study support group..........head spins.........</p>
<p> </p>
<p><a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://edition.cnn.com/2015/06/18/us/charleston-south-carolina-shooting/index.html'>http://edition.cnn.com/2015/06/18/us/charleston-south-carolina-shooting/index.html</a></p>
<p> </p>
<p>Do you start by mopping up guns? Or is that really the least of the problems?</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Quote</p>
<p>The gunman allegedly told the victims before the shooting, "You rape our women and you're taking over our country. And you have to go," said Sylvia Johnson, a cousin of the church's slain pastor. She cited survivors of the shooting and was quoted by CNN affiliate WIS.</p>
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<p>Because data is interesting, I looked the <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country'>number of guns per capita by country</a> and cross referenced that with their respective <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate'>firearm homicide rate</a> and <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate'>general homicide rate</a>. For good measure I restricted it to countries that had a firearm ownership rate of more than 10 per 100 residents. I then excluded countries that were not classified in the Very High category of the <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Human_Development_Index'>Human Development Index</a>.<br><br>
Note: the red square is the USA.<br><br>
Firearm homicides against ownership:<br><img src="https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-CGppZBLKWi4/UM7LgAfFPkI/AAAAAAAAA1A/wb1_-nPLGNM/s830/FCUSA1.png" alt="FCUSA1.png"><br><br>
Homicides against ownership. This shows that the USA does not have just a firearm homicide problem when measure against other countries, but a homicide problem generally:<br><img src="https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-27WP1I984w4/UM7Lgd0qilI/AAAAAAAAA1E/8RNvH5PdSyw/s830/FCUSA2.png" alt="FCUSA2.png"><br><br>
Homicides compared to firearm homicides:<br><img src="https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-0LBh85nnulo/UM7LgeUkxwI/AAAAAAAAA1I/AHkVdrfmkcw/s833/FCUSA3.png" alt="FCUSA3.png"><br><br>
Firearm homicide rate measured against HDI result:<br><img src="https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-QR1VKDxRpQ0/UM7Lg8FSnhI/AAAAAAAAA1M/RijBTJc3xEk/s833/FCUSA4.png" alt="FCUSA4.png"><br><br>
In each case we can see that the USA is an outlier. It's categorically not just a simple causative effect of gun ownership. There's something about their problem resolution. <br><br>
It would be interesting to measure socio-economic factors like unemployment rates, education attainment level, population age, etc. including illicit drug usage.</p> -
<p>The shooter wore a sweater in one of his previous social media photographs that displayed the old South African and Rhodesian flags.......fucken ouch!</p>
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<p><a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/suspected-charleston-church-shooter-gun-birthday-article-1.2262393'>http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/suspected-charleston-church-shooter-gun-birthday-article-1.2262393</a></p>
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<p><a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://time.com/3926593/charleston-killer-flags/'>http://time.com/3926593/charleston-killer-flags/</a></p>
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<p>Never gets old. Onya Jim.</p>
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<p><a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/govbeat/wp/2015/06/12/gun-killings-fell-by-40-percent-after-connecticut-passed-this-law/'>http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/govbeat/wp/2015/06/12/gun-killings-fell-by-40-percent-after-connecticut-passed-this-law/</a></p>
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<p>In summary: Gun shootings in Connecticut fall 40% after introducing background checks.</p> -
<p>Awesome link Siam!...... not just incredibly funny.....also incredibly accurate! Absolute ripper!</p>
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<p>Meantime......both sides of the political spectrum are having a field day with this sad murder of nine people.</p>
<p>No way how you try and bull-shit your way out of this.........bottom-line is that this is a blatant racial hate-crime......but off-course that cuts too close to the bone.</p>
<p>So I specifically had a look at how Fox would try and spin it........and yip.....about 30 seconds into their first reports they went for the drugs angle! This dude apparently were caught some months ago with opiates.....so it must be the drugs that made him do it! </p>
<p>Forget about the fact that his dad bought him a .45 for his 21-st birthday....co-incidence. And the victims happens to be all black....awkward at most. I see they have since adjusted the narrative just a tad......</p>
<p>A bit over two years ago I popped opiates like candy......not once did it occur to me to shoot someone.......let alone nine people.......</p>
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<p>Actually you have multiple layers in this event.......racism, guns, horribly stupid parents, drugs, inequality and even religion........where do you even start....</p>
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<p>The fact is that from what we know it seems that the gun used was illegally procured. Obviously what happened was a tragedy but I haven't actually heard any solutions from anyone. If someone goes and gets a gun illegally and wants to kill black people then how can you actually stop that? From what we know the attack was quite random - there was no realistic way any intelligence could stop what happened.</p>
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<p><a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jun/19/nra-mass-shootings-south-carolina-church'>http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jun/19/nra-mass-shootings-south-carolina-church</a></p>
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<p>Mmmmmm...OK.</p>
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<p>Going to church tomorrow?</p>
<p>Wallet?...check</p>
<p>Bible?.....check</p>
<p>gun?.......check</p>
<p><span style="color:#e6e6fa;">(common sense?......piss off....you were never supposed to bring that)</span></p>
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<p>Gun problem? Simple...add more guns.</p> -
<p>hydro: There is no cure for embedded racism. Its too far gone in the USA, and I think unless they start introducing social measures - particularly around poverty - we're seeing the decline of their little military empire.</p>
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<p>So yeah, while they could solve a bunch of problems by tightening their gun laws a bit, this incident was precipitated by a shit head with bowl cut who wanted to kill black people.</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="NTA" data-cid="497318" data-time="1434835930"><p>hydro: There is no cure for embedded racism. Its too far gone in the USA, and I think unless they start introducing social measures - particularly around poverty - we're seeing the decline of their little military empire.<br>
<br>
So yeah, while they could solve a bunch of problems by tightening their gun laws a bit, this incident was precipitated by a shit head with bowl cut who wanted to kill black people.</p></blockquote>Nice. There is something not quite right about a country who can piss away trillions a year on armaments yet they can't be arsed forking out for basic decent quality healthcare and other essential needs for their population -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-time="1434835930" data-cid="497318" data-author="NTA"><p>hydro: There is no cure for embedded racism. Its too far gone in the USA, and I think unless they start introducing social measures - particularly around poverty - we're seeing the decline of their little military empire.<br> <br>So yeah, while they could solve a bunch of problems by tightening their gun laws a bit, this incident was precipitated by a shit head with bowl cut who wanted to kill black people.</p></blockquote><br>The thing is Nick, even uber-progressive, nanny state Norway produced racist psycho Anders Bering Breivik. In fact the similarities between the two are pretty striking. Take a country with 300 plus million people and god knows how many guns in circulation and you're bound to get some nut cases no matter what you do. One thing I find at least a bit heartening from this terrible, farked up incident is that he was bitching about the lack of skinheads and KKK and "nobody doing anything". If those types of groups are dying in the US then I guess things are (slowly) moving in the right direction.
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<p>Yep I don't doubt that the sheer <em>number</em> of firearms makes the ease of killing someone easier, and you're going to have X whack jobs per capita.</p>
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<p>We had our Martin Bryant thing - the wiki entry for which is fucking chilling I must say - so there will always be outliers.</p>
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<p>Which is why I'm not, for once, screaming laughter about Yanks and their idiot gun laws. This guy got his gun illegally after all.</p>
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<p>However, I'm still shaking my head when you hear about some 5yo kid shooting his grandma dead after getting into her purse and finding a Glock. Its even worse when one of their younger siblings is shot. Sheer, adult ignorance and irresponsibility.</p> -
<p>Interesting strategy.</p>
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<p><strong>At rally of young people in Turin, Francis issues his toughest condemnation to date of the weapons industry, criticising investors as well as workers</strong></p>
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<p><a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jun/22/pope-francis-says-those-in-weapons-industry-cant-call-themselves-christian?CMP=twt_gu'>http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jun/22/pope-francis-says-those-in-weapons-industry-cant-call-themselves-christian?CMP=twt_gu</a></p>
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<p>Interesting strategy.</p>
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<p>Perhaps he should concern himself with the less than Christian behaviours of those closer to home...</p> -
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="NTA" data-cid="497551" data-time="1434953479"><p>
However, I'm still shaking my head when you hear about some 5yo kid shooting his grandma dead after getting into her purse and finding a Glock. Its even worse when one of their younger siblings is shot. Sheer, adult ignorance and irresponsibility.</p></blockquote>IIRC the case you mention was the mum being shot by her 2 year old son in Walmart, she was apparently a gun person. This begs the question, how is gun safety being taught in the U.S? In both cases, the owners of the guns displayed a poor standard of safety and the results were suitably tragic. They should know better, but clearly they don't
Guns?.........or is that the least of the problems?