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Exodus 2018

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Exodus 2018
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  • antipodeanA Offline
    antipodeanA Offline
    antipodean
    replied to MajorRage on last edited by
    #342

    @majorrage said in Exodus 2018:

    They are only prepared to make plans with clubs which they feel have "sound coaching structures and support systems"? Really? It's coming across as very we own the players and we'll only let them go to clubs which we feel follow our model and way of thinking.

    It reads to me as the NZR saying if players want to be a hope of coming back, then they're best served by going to clubs that have structures in place to maximise that possibility. Otherwise they can go play anywhere and take their chances.

    I find it consistently amazing that New Zealand leads the world in so many aspects of rugby, but clearly comes dead last in its media driven analysis and reporting.

    MajorRageM 1 Reply Last reply
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  • mariner4lifeM Online
    mariner4lifeM Online
    mariner4life
    wrote on last edited by
    #343

    We are the best, and have been basically forever, but most especially over the last 8 years. If we can't be arrogant now, when are we allowed to be?

    This is a plan that has a bit of merit. I'm not actually sure it's as workable as the NZR think it will be, but it's certainly thinking.

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  • MajorRageM Offline
    MajorRageM Offline
    MajorRage
    wrote on last edited by
    #344

    Reality is that players who leave rarely come back and players are leaving earlier and earlier. I'm not saying the y are arrogant for trying to do something about this - not at all.

    We have a right to be arrogant about certain things but you can't be when trying to cut deals with bigger, richer unions than us.

    Talking about approved lists, limited playing time etc ... thst is what I'm talking about. Can you imagine Saracens etc thoughts to the approach?

    Maybe some clubs would be keen - I dunno ... but I highly doubt it. When you can afford to buy the players outright, why cut a restrictive deal?

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  • MajorRageM Offline
    MajorRageM Offline
    MajorRage
    replied to antipodean on last edited by
    #345

    @antipodean said in Exodus 2018:

    @majorrage said in Exodus 2018:

    It reads to me as the NZR saying if players want to be a hope of coming back, then they're best served by going to clubs that have structures in place to maximise that possibility. Otherwise they can go play anywhere and take their chances.

    It's arrogant to assume players want to come back. Fuck all do.

    I find it consistently amazing that New Zealand leads the world in so many aspects of rugby, but clearly comes dead last in its media driven analysis and reporting.

    I can certainly agree with that, but I think Paul has a point here

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  • taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugby
    wrote on last edited by
    #346

    @majorrage do most not come back as it is rarely successful for one to come back and become an AB?

    MajorRageM 1 Reply Last reply
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  • MilkM Offline
    MilkM Offline
    Milk
    wrote on last edited by Milk
    #347

    That article seems like a massive overreaction. The overseas exodus is one of the biggest threats to NZR, and this is something they're looking at to try and mitigate it. Overseas clubs may or not go for it, but it's worth trying. Frankly anything is worth is a try, except doing nothing and hoping for the best.

    We won't learn anything from these clubs? We're not learning from them now anyway. We get nothing from them except a player drain.

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  • MajorRageM Offline
    MajorRageM Offline
    MajorRage
    replied to taniwharugby on last edited by
    #348

    @taniwharugby I don't know enough players to answer that honestly. I would guess the coin is the more likely reason, as well as life out of the spot light

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  • taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugby
    wrote on last edited by
    #349

    @majorrage well the coin was probably the biggest factor in leaving, and you are right, probably big in them staying put too...but I expect some when weighing up the chances of returning and making it back to the ABs see it as a much harder path than staying one, especially when initially they will only be on a M10/Super contract until (if) they get back in ABs...

    Havent been on much in the past week, but assume its been mentioned Thomas Waldron is coming back to NZ and will be looking at and for a M10 and possibly super rugby contract.

    Chris B.C 1 Reply Last reply
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  • D Offline
    D Offline
    Derm McCrum
    wrote on last edited by
    #350

    I have been arguing for some bit of time for there to be greater collaboration between like-minded unions around player development, coaching, etc and match income sharing.

    I think this idea from NZRU is a good one and the kind of clubs that would best fit would be those run by unions in Ireland, Wales, Scotland and Italy.

    If a clear pathway of exit and return was mapped out for some, not all, players then it might have a chance. It’s not clear as to whether they’d want it to be capped players only (so they couldn’t be captured) and/or what age group they’re considering. A 2 or 3 year contract at 23/24 might prove attractive and not require a massive salary that PRO14 clubs could not afford. Could it work the other way too where some younger NH players move south?

    Does it have to be confined to NZ? Would it work in Oz too?

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  • taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugby
    wrote on last edited by
    #351

    Daniel Braid, as a capped AB played for the Reds, and at the time was in the form of his life, but ineligible for ABs. However, not sure it would greatly benefit Aus if we did had a number of players over there, at least many of the ones that head over there now could end up Wallabies, whereas a team in Europe we have ties to would have less impact overall.

    Wasn't there talk of SARU doing something similar or even buying a team like Saracens?

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  • Chris B.C Offline
    Chris B.C Offline
    Chris B.
    replied to taniwharugby on last edited by
    #352

    @taniwharugby said in Exodus 2018:

    Havent been on much in the past week, but assume its been mentioned Thomas Waldron is coming back to NZ and will be looking at and for a M10 and possibly super rugby contract.

    Thomas is already nearly 35 - pretty doubtful he'd be worth a punt as an injury replacement in this year's Super rugby - and next year he'll be 36. Might be good as an old head in a M10 Cup team.

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  • TimT Away
    TimT Away
    Tim
    wrote on last edited by
    #353

    Highlanders forward Elliot Dixon eyes up overseas move pending All Blacks selection

    canefanC boobooB 2 Replies Last reply
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  • canefanC Online
    canefanC Online
    canefan
    replied to Tim on last edited by
    #354

    @tim He's been on the outer for a while now

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  • antipodeanA Offline
    antipodeanA Offline
    antipodean
    wrote on last edited by
    #355

    Didn't his form fall off a cliff!

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  • boobooB Offline
    boobooB Offline
    booboo
    replied to Tim on last edited by
    #356

    @tim said in Exodus 2018:

    Highlanders forward Elliot Dixon eyes up overseas move pending All Blacks selection

    Never as good as some rated him. A good back up but shouldn't ever have been in line for a first team spot.

    A wrong choice by the Zoo.

    Never like to see a player go thereby reducing the strength of Super Rugby, but goodbye and good luck.

    BovidaeB 1 Reply Last reply
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  • BovidaeB Offline
    BovidaeB Offline
    Bovidae
    replied to booboo on last edited by
    #357

    @booboo

    Dixon's form in 2015 deserved AB selection but he wasn't the same player in 2016 when he finally got his chance.

    He probably won't even start for the Highlanders so adios.

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  • D Offline
    D Offline
    DaGrubster
    wrote on last edited by
    #358

    it feels like we have reached a point where the exodus has just moved into another gear. I think we have done a great job of keeping talent in NZ over the last 20 years but wonder how long we will be able to do so?

    The NZR and our partners are in an arms race we cant win basically and the whole SH is suffering and our competitons are diminishing which affects revenues which speeds up the process of players leaving. Catch 22

    I dont think there is an answer either unless we get a sheikh who wants to invest in NZ rugby! I am not sure we can stop this. In fact, I know we won't be able to. People, of all walks of life, chase the money, always have, always will.

    How long will this take? when will NZ's best be playing in France. A Kieran Reid or a Richie McCaw moving to France in his prime could force a policy change from the NZR and then we are not in kansas anymore toto.

    I hate the idea where rugby follows football and all the best players are in Europe and euro club rugby becomes the highest quality in the game, more than the world cup.

    Sorry to be so depressing but it is depressing.

    taniwharugbyT SnowyS Chris B.C 3 Replies Last reply
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  • taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugby
    replied to DaGrubster on last edited by
    #359

    @dagrubster TBH, I don't even know if money will stop some players leaving, travel is a huge factor for SH rugby (Super & TRC) with numerous trips away for weeks at a time, can't imagine that is easy on a player with a young family...sure he and his partner know what they are getting into blah blah blah...doesn't make it any easier

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  • SnowyS Offline
    SnowyS Offline
    Snowy
    replied to DaGrubster on last edited by
    #360

    @dagrubster said in Exodus 2018:

    I dont think there is an answer either unless we get a sheikh who wants to invest in NZ rugby!

    Good post. Emirates All Blacks? It worked for Team NZ, or did AIB already get that spot? A seriously wealthy private benefactor would be great. The Larry Ellison Oracle All Blacks is a bit repugnant to me, Elon Musk maybe...

    One of the most successful sporting teams in history should be able to attract enough sponsorship cash to keep players on equivalent money to a French club. Below that we have a problem, the "super" teams can't compete with NH cash.

    NepiaN 1 Reply Last reply
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  • NepiaN Online
    NepiaN Online
    Nepia
    replied to Snowy on last edited by
    #361

    @snowy said in Exodus 2018:

    @dagrubster said in Exodus 2018:

    I dont think there is an answer either unless we get a sheikh who wants to invest in NZ rugby!

    Good post. Emirates All Blacks? It worked for Team NZ, or did AIB already get that spot? A seriously wealthy private benefactor would be great. The Larry Ellison Oracle All Blacks is a bit repugnant to me, Elon Musk maybe...

    One of the most successful sporting teams in history should be able to attract enough sponsorship cash to keep players on equivalent money to a French club. Below that we have a problem, the "super" teams can't compete with NH cash.

    A Saffa owning the ABs ....

    SnowyS 1 Reply Last reply
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