• Categories
Collapse

The Silver Fern

Exodus 2017

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Sports Talk
788 Posts 74 Posters 151.8k Views
Exodus 2017
    • Oldest to Newest
    • Newest to Oldest
    • Most Votes
Reply
  • Reply as topic
Log in to reply
This topic has been deleted. Only users with topic management privileges can see it.
  • taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugby
    replied to Rapido on last edited by
    #611

    @Rapido or maybe he could see the writing on the wall last season?

    RapidoR 1 Reply Last reply
    0
  • RapidoR Offline
    RapidoR Offline
    Rapido
    replied to taniwharugby on last edited by
    #612

    @taniwharugby
    Yeah. Probably. I don't think you get as far as he has a professional if you are a sulker or a quitter.

    My guess is this was already on the cards, and therefore Laumape and Goodhue going passed him was made an easier decision for the selectors.

    1 Reply Last reply
    1
  • RapidoR Offline
    RapidoR Offline
    Rapido
    replied to Billy Tell on last edited by Rapido
    #613

    @Billy-Tell said in Exodus 2017:

    @Stargazer said in Exodus 2017:

    Still waiting for the official announcement ....

    ... but according to the rumours, he'll only join Toulon in October. So he may play Mitre 10 Cup if he's not named in the AB squad for the Rugby Championship.

    According to Midi Olympique, it will all become official on Tuesday (27 June). They say he has signed a two-year contract.

    ...when he's not named...

    The player I am fully expecting to head overseas is Brad Shields, barring a miraculous call-up. Too good a player to earn a Super salary with no AB expectations.

    Shields might be the Luke Braid of his mini-generation.

    Thing is with Shields. There's not much youth coming through in the 6 & 8 positions who are better than him or who look particularly promising. Only really Akira Ioane.

    Then there is Dixon, Squire, Shields and Fifita who are all about the same mid-20s age.

    I could see him getting an opportunity, but it's not nailed on. Maybe 20% chance.

    antipodeanA Chris B.C 2 Replies Last reply
    0
  • antipodeanA Offline
    antipodeanA Offline
    antipodean
    replied to Rapido on last edited by
    #614

    @Rapido I'm sure he'd get a call up if he removed the toasters from his hands.

    D 1 Reply Last reply
    6
  • UncoU Offline
    UncoU Offline
    Unco
    replied to Billy Tell on last edited by
    #615

    @Billy-Tell said in Exodus 2017:

    @akan004 said in Exodus 2017:

    This year has been arguably the worst ever in terms of losing quality players still in their prime. Luatua, Faumaina, TKB, Lowe, Cruden and Fekitoa. FFS, that's some serious talent gone. Faumaina and Cruden in particular will be massive losses that won't be easy to replace.

    Inevitable really. Lions tour over, players who have either been established ABs, but no longer/not first choice, and already have silverware, or else fringe or else never going to make it.

    Faumuina and Cruden are really the only major losses, but NZ being NZ, we will find perfectly fine replacements.

    For their experience, sure, but I think Luatua and TKB are huge losses too. Luatua's finally come into his own and has been huge this year. While TKB is the form Super halfback and gives us a ton of depth there. Once he goes, there's a huge drop down to the fourth pick (which I guess is Weber or shudder Pulu).

    Not sure why people still bring Shields up in the ABs conversation. Feels like people have been talking him up as a future AB since he was in the U20s and it's not going to happen.

    1 Reply Last reply
    2
  • Chris B.C Offline
    Chris B.C Offline
    Chris B.
    replied to Rapido on last edited by
    #616

    @Rapido I think that's why Hansen was annoyed at losing Luatua. More than any of them, he probably had the physical attributes to replace Kaino (who is talking of hanging around for another RWC, but I'm pretty doubtful - he's well past 34 - won't be surprised if we get an announcement from him in the next few months. Even Read is not far from 32. Vito is gone and Messam looks to be on recent evidence.

    At the moment, Squire is at the head of the queue, but he's very injury prone - has been even at NPC level. Then apparently Ioane and Fifita, Dixon has dropped back in the running from last year. A wildcard is Luke Whitelock, who is playing much better rugby than when he made the ABs several years ago. Most of his web stats list him as 104kg, but I find that hard to believe. He could probably do with adding a couple more kgs to his frame for international rugby, but he wouldn't be the worst. I'd have him ahead of Shields and Jordan Taufua, who needs some platform shoes to make him a lineout option.

    That Luke Jacobson looks a good prospect with the U20s. The little I saw of him was impressive.

    RapidoR StargazerS No QuarterN 3 Replies Last reply
    1
  • RapidoR Offline
    RapidoR Offline
    Rapido
    replied to Chris B. on last edited by Rapido
    #617

    @Chris-B. Forgot Luke Whitelock. I like the newly re-shaped cut of his jib.

    Yeah. Taufua not a candidate, too short.

    It's a very bare cupboard, in a position we normally churn them out.

    Luatua must be either stark raving bonkers, or have the worst manager in the game, or just not up for it?

    Chris B.C 1 Reply Last reply
    2
  • mariner4lifeM Offline
    mariner4lifeM Offline
    mariner4life
    wrote on last edited by
    #618

    Luatua, Faumauina and TKB hurt. Fekitoa will hurt too. These are international standard players ready to step in if we lose anyone, and still not overly weaken us (Charlie is more than that, he's a huge part of our gameday squad). They aren't guys at the end of their careers building a well deserved nest egg, they are players in their prime.

    Surely this has got to bite at some point? We can't keep turning guys up to fill these holes, it's just not possible.

    RapidoR No QuarterN 2 Replies Last reply
    3
  • Chris B.C Offline
    Chris B.C Offline
    Chris B.
    replied to Rapido on last edited by
    #619

    @Rapido Two others I forgot about are the invisible men Mitchell Dunshea and Hugh Renton. I've got very little idea about these two, but theoretically they should be part of a younger generation coming through - but they've been sighted less frequently than a Blue Duck.

    Dunshea did look useful for the Barbarians.

    1 Reply Last reply
    0
  • StargazerS Offline
    StargazerS Offline
    Stargazer
    replied to Chris B. on last edited by
    #620

    @Chris-B. Agree with the next "generation". From this year's U20s, Luke Jacobson looks a prospect for the 6 jersey and Marino Mikaele-Tu'u is one to watch for no. 8. Still very young though; it will be interesting to see how they go in Mitre 10 Cup this year.

    1 Reply Last reply
    2
  • RapidoR Offline
    RapidoR Offline
    Rapido
    replied to mariner4life on last edited by Rapido
    #621

    @mariner4life said in Exodus 2017:

    Luatua, Faumauina and TKB hurt. Fekitoa will hurt too. These are international standard players ready to step in if we lose anyone, and still not overly weaken us (Charlie is more than that, he's a huge part of our gameday squad). They aren't guys at the end of their careers building a well deserved nest egg, they are players in their prime.

    Surely this has got to bite at some point? We can't keep turning guys up to fill these holes, it's just not possible.

    Yes, it will probably bite at some point. But it also has many advantages for the Al Blacks (if not fans of provincial or franchise rugby).

    The constant refreshing of the team, while still keeping the absolute core, means the machine just keeps on. No one ever blocks a pipe like a past it Genia for example.

    It has also played a part in reducing French rugby to its knees.

    Were it has bitten in the past:
    Hayman. It was amazing to replace him so quickly with a young keeper in O Franks, but we were razor thin theirfor a few years.

    Back up 10s to Carter when Evans and McAllister exodused.

    Could see one of the 4 you mentioned creating a similar scenario over next few years. Interesting to see which.

    I'm pleasantly surprised with Ofa T. So Charlie replacement is ok, but depth thin.

    Discussed Luatua above. This is thin.

    TKB means our current test quality depth is just 2 players. I'm thinking Nock or Enari will gallop past Pulu (but I like Webber).

    Cruden narrows depth, nz fans are nervous about depth at 10. But there are at least some promising options here.

    antipodeanA 1 Reply Last reply
    0
  • antipodeanA Offline
    antipodeanA Offline
    antipodean
    replied to Rapido on last edited by
    #622

    @Rapido said in Exodus 2017:

    Yes, it will probably bite at some point. But it also has many advantages for the Al Blacks (if not fans of provincial or franchise rugby).
    The constant refreshing of the team, while still keeping the absolute core, means the machine just keeps on. No one ever blocks a pipe like a past it Genia for example.
    It has also played a part in reducing French rugby to its knees.

    That's why I don't see it continuing.

    1 Reply Last reply
    0
  • NepiaN Offline
    NepiaN Offline
    Nepia
    replied to rotated on last edited by
    #623

    @rotated said in Exodus 2017:

    @akan004 said in Exodus 2017:

    Cruden has already been replaced.

    If that were true he wouldn't be playing in the Lions series. We've got a good player next in line but he's still our current 3rd choice.

    @Chris-B. said in Exodus 2017:

    @Rapido Two others I forgot about are the invisible men Mitchell Dunshea and Hugh Renton.

    You'd think that all Renton would need to do to make the ABs would be to get injured before the naming of the squad. It's worked well for him in Super rugby.

    Outside of Cruden, Faumauina is a big loss.

    1 Reply Last reply
    0
  • KiwiMurphK Online
    KiwiMurphK Online
    KiwiMurph
    wrote on last edited by
    #624

    With Cruden and TKB off it will be interesting to keep an eye on TTT and Otere Black tonight.

    1 Reply Last reply
    1
  • StargazerS Offline
    StargazerS Offline
    Stargazer
    wrote on last edited by Stargazer
    #625

    I don't think we need to worry about our no. 10 stocks. Behind BB (26), Cruden (28) and Sops (26), we have potential in:

    Dmac (22) and Mo'unga (23)
    Next, you have Black (22) and Hunt (22).
    U20s: Perofeta (20) and Falcon (20)
    At NZ Schools level: McClutchie (17, Hastings BHS) & probably more talent

    Edited to add their age.

    KiwiMurphK mariner4lifeM 2 Replies Last reply
    0
  • KiwiMurphK Online
    KiwiMurphK Online
    KiwiMurph
    replied to Stargazer on last edited by KiwiMurph
    #626

    @Stargazer said in Exodus 2017:

    At NZ Schools level: McClutchie (17, Hastings BHS) & probably more talent

    Yep McClutchie was very impressive when he played for NZ Barbarians Schools last year. Another one is Harry Plummer (turned 19 last week, out of St Peters College Auckland) who was the NZ Schools 10 last year. He's the top points scorer in his first season of Auckland club rugby this year in a middle of the road Grammar TEC side.

    Also - more on the topic of the thread - Auckland outside back Lolagi Visinia has headed offshore to take up a contract with FC Grenoble in France

    StargazerS 1 Reply Last reply
    0
  • mariner4lifeM Offline
    mariner4lifeM Offline
    mariner4life
    replied to Stargazer on last edited by
    #627

    @Stargazer said in Exodus 2017:

    I don't think we need to worry about our no. 10 stocks. Behind BB, Cruden and Sops, we have potential in:

    Dmac (22) and Mo'unga (23)
    Next, you have Black (22) and Hunt (22).
    U20s: Perofeta (20) and Falcon (20)
    At NZ Schools level: McClutchie (17, Hastings BHS) & probably more talent

    Edited to add their age.

    worry? No. By having a player the quality of Sopoaga not even make our test 23 we are in a better spot than basically everyone.

    But counting the rest of that list as some kind of measure of depth? A guy who hasn't looked good at 10, and miserably failed his last audition. A guy who has had a breakout season in Super rugby behind a great pack, but battled when the pack got under pressure. Then guys from the 20s, and we've over-rated guys based on that tournament more than once. None of those guys would make the Wallabies 23 as 10s FFS.

    Next year, we are an injury from one of them being in the 23.

    StargazerS 1 Reply Last reply
    2
  • taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugby
    wrote on last edited by
    #628

    I still recall the horror that took hold of NZ in 2011 when DC, our only quality 10 did his groin in...we wuz fuked!

    mariner4lifeM 1 Reply Last reply
    1
  • mariner4lifeM Offline
    mariner4lifeM Offline
    mariner4life
    replied to taniwharugby on last edited by
    #629

    @taniwharugby said in Exodus 2017:

    I still recall the horror that took hold of NZ in 2011 when DC, our only quality 10 did his groin in...we wuz fuked!

    you know, when you think about it, the fact we won a World Cup despite going through four 10s in four games, and playing the final with not only two guys who weren't in the squad at the start, but one guy who wasn't in the squad at Qtr final time, is astounding. Everyone else really picked up the slack there

    taniwharugbyT 1 Reply Last reply
    2
  • BovidaeB Offline
    BovidaeB Offline
    Bovidae
    wrote on last edited by
    #630

    The replenishment of the props will be interesting, mainly because the next tier have little or no international experience - yet.

    At TH, Charlie is leaving and Franks won't be going on forever. Ofa T is obviously considered the next in line and he will get more opportunity at TH for the Blues from next season to prove he's up to it. After that there is Laulala and JTA.

    At LH, Crockett is 34 so will need to be replaced before 2019. The next tier is Hames, Manu and Goodes.

    There should be a place available on the EOYT for one of the above.

    TimT P 2 Replies Last reply
    1

Exodus 2017
Sports Talk
  • Login

  • Don't have an account? Register

  • Login or register to search.
  • First post
    Last post
0
  • Categories
  • Login

  • Don't have an account? Register

  • Login or register to search.