The Silver Fern

@pakman said in All Blacks 2024:

@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2024:

@KiwiMurph particularly as it is often instinctive, that said, Christie seems to have great instincts on defence and seems to be able to read that aspect of the game, whether he can do that going forward is another matter.

I think the Blues 2022 (year immediately after he made the AB's) he was very good, seemed both sides of his game had improved, but regressed on attack.

If we’re up by 3 against Boks with 20 to go, and have the choice between TJP, Christie and Hotham to replace starting half, I know where I’d go.

And if we are down by a couple, with time running out, in a big game eg. A RWC final?

@Winger said in All Blacks 2024:

@MN5 said in All Blacks 2024:

@Winger said in All Blacks 2024:

@chchfanatic said in All Blacks 2024:

@Winger the idiot brigade out again. Give it a rest. It’s getting boring.

Where did the Crusaders finish up this year?

There's obvious bias. Even most (but obviosuly not all) Crusaders should be able to see this

That could be asking the impossible

Robertsons a fool really. All he had to do is not make any dubious Crusaders selections and everyone would have been on his side as the man.

So Ardie over Scott as captain
RR in preference to Bell
Plummer in preference to Havili
And not Blackadder

Thats it. He could have then brought them all in if and only if they proved themsleves in SRP 2025

Some of the tantrums and throwing toys out of the cot on here over the last month or so has been pretty impressive but it is getting a bit unhinged now.

I for one am glad Robertson isn’t selecting the fringe squad players with the purpose of keeping some internet forum fans happy.

Scott Barrett over Ardie was always going to be the safe bet. IMO their individual performances in the first couple of games and Ardie signing for MP and planning to the another sabbatical proves this decision was probably a good one.

RR is a journeyman who is only just Super rugby standard. If Sami T didn’t hurt himself, Bell would have been nowhere near the team.

People getting their knickers in a twist over Havili being the 5th choice midfielder is also hilarious. We are scraping the barrel there so going back to Havili is understandable. Lam having only played a handful of games at 12 was never going to be a serious option. Hopefully next year he is.
I probably would have selected Plummer in the place of Perofeta (who has done fuck all even at super or test level) and had Love in the original squad to cover 15 in place of Narawa. Like they have now.

Blackadder has been covered. Multiple previous coaching groups have rated him (and Frizzel) over Akira and Sotutu. Neither of then really offered what we are missing in their test appearances anyway. If they had, they would be there. That’s just the way it is. Get over it. Like midfield there isn’t much proven talent left behind. Unless you want to give Grace another shot, but the meltdown and screams of bias would be deafening.

Now on the squad selection overall.
Really happy to see Christie given the boot. Don’t really have a view on Hotham. The Blues dropping Funaki for Christie when he came back probably killed his chances. Fakatava has dropped right away from where he was.
They are just keeping Roigard’s spot warm anyway.

Still concerned about our lock selections. Especially with Barrett out of the first games.
Really don’t understand why they aren’t bringing an extra guy in full time. Whoever it is.

Also don’t really get the Cane selection. He doesn’t add anything that we don’t already have multiple layers of in the other 6.5s.
Going to be very interesting to see how the selection of the loosies evolves over to RC.
Really hoping Finau can gain some confidence.

Clearly it is going to take longer than 3 weeks to clean the shit stains from the last 6 years off this AB team.
Hopefully they learn some lessons and go about fixing the problem areas asap.

Christie should be nowhere near the ABs. Absolute handbrake.

It would also have been great to see Ioane getting the ball out wide in space with an 11 on his back. He is completely wasted at 13.

@Machpants said in All Blacks vs England I:

@Tim said in All Blacks vs England I:

This was very nice work:

https://v.redd.it/8r2c9zml01bd1

Not the videoing, filming a widescreen TV in portrait, fucking idiot.

He didn't get the penalty for that either, I don't think? Or am I misremembering?

Nah, they didn’t call it. I was wondering if the radio link between the touchy and the ref was playing up because it looks like the touchy was trying to say something but play went on.

@nzzp said in All Blacks vs England I:

Finau missing by the look of it - confirms the eye test a bit

Worth noting he was only on for 60mins. So would have finished higher on various stats if he kept the same rate up.
Only his second or third test so we shouldn’t expect Kaino mkII straight away.

Aaahhhhhahahaa man those Irish tears taste good. Don’t care what happens from here. That is like winning the whole thing.

@Kirwan said in All Blacks 2023:

And this sort of crap is why you don't pick a coach before the end of another's tenure.

Obvious he shouldn't be floating around the current setup, and no need to be at the games either. Start getting organised and stop moaning to your mates about ole meany Foster.

Rubbish. Can you imagine the shit storm that would be surrounding the question of who will coach next year after a record loss on the eve of the rwc followed by our first ever pool loss? Razor break dancing in the middle of the dressing room before the game would be a minuscule distraction compared to that circus.

Foster already used the distraction card when his original contract got extended early. The following two years have been a disaster.

Not being at trainings and in the sheds is 100% reasonable. Not being allowed in the stadium Far from the players to watch would be pretty ridiculous and petty. Are our management and players really that mentally fragile that it would cause issues? Maybe they are.

@Steve said in All Blacks 2023:

@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2023:

@frugby but BB is kicking poorly (the worldy on the weekend being the exception)

for me its straight forward, to get the ball to our weapons at 11,13,14 it needs to go through a second Boss which is normally the 15, 9 > 10 > 12 > 13 > 11/14 just doesnt work against the rush defence....but when we go through BB either of 9 or 10....he kicks it. I would like to see the 15 actually inject himself and either draw a defender before unleashing other....or if he times it right breaking the line

I feel Jordan is more likely to do that than BB

The fact of the matter is his form at Super level has also fallen off a cliff.
Some peoples contention is that Beaudy is only copping flak because of Fozzies poor game plan.

But his super rugby highlight reel only consists of stuff in a Hurricanes shirt.

He has done the square root of fuck all for The Blues and has been so uncommanding at both 10 and 15 that he has essentially been job sharing with Stephen Perofeta from week to week.

He is a shot fighter.

Agree with this. What if Foster’s master game plan is “Beaudy, go out there and do your thing”.

Attempt enough up and unders and cross kicks and eventually you will get “proof” of how awesome it is.

It was the same at the Blues last couple of years.
Is it a coincidence that Foster and Mcdonald had the same game plan? Or was it the common denominator of BB being given free reign to try his trick shots and it not being a winning formula?

I don’t think there is a lack of skill in NZ. There is definitely a lack of brains deciding when to use those skills though.
So often hard earned pressure on the opposition is released by trying to score off a miracle play as soon as we get a turnover.

Is Zarn injured?

@Crucial said in Foster:

@Rancid-Schnitzel said in Foster:

@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:

@geeky said in Foster:

@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:

@geeky said in Foster:

@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:

@Machpants said in Foster:

@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:

@number9 said in Foster:

The Team was lost prior to Schmidt and Ryan. Now the backs are attacking with purpose, our set piece is looking a lot better.

Once again you're arguing a Head Coach (good or bad) doesn't have much impact on team performance. Which, given the way some on here fetishize Roberston as an AB Head Coach, is a bit illogical - if not weird.

Just because one head coach has fuck all impact now new assistants have been forced on him, does not mean all head coaches do nothing.

I'm not saying I totally agree, but it's not weird. Foster is an ineffective head coach, and his team shit as an abs team ever had been. But now he's been forced to move away from his choices as assistants, the abs are improving.

Sorry, but it's incredibly weird thinking to say a head coach has no impact on results and in the same breath argue a new Head Coach will improve things.

Peter De Villiers as Boks coach (2008-2011) - it was well known that he couldn't coach for shit & the assistants did essentially all the coaching for him. Foster appears much the same.

De Villiers started out OK and the Boks faded badly in 2010-11. So if you are saying his assistants did all the work, you're arguing De Villiers wasn't to blame for those latter poor results either, and his assistants should have carried the can.

Which is a bonkers argument when you look at it.

Not really. Even the players admitted that the assistants Gary Gold and Dick Muir were ultimately responsible for the success of that era & said De Villiers was pretty useless as a coach.

Every different to Foster then when you consider the high praise he gets from players like Ritchie, Ardie and Sam Whitelock.

Tbf, Mark "never made the playoffs despite having absolute power" Hammett seemed to have plenty of love from the players he didn't send packing.

I've no doubt that perhaps one-on-one Foster has plenty of wisdom to impart. He was a decent player himself and rose through the coaching ranks very quickly. Clearly he has something of value. Unfortunately it's patently obvious that he's not a very good head coach. The evidence obviously being the Chiefs and ABs. If I can give him credit for something it's having at least been humble enough to accept the changes that clearly needed to be made. While they came very belatedly and allowed him to save his job, many would probably have gone the full bottom lip and had a tanty. Maybe he does that in private but I for one feel a hell of alot better with Schmidt and Ryan holding his hand. It's a pretty ridiculous situation but probably the best outcome before handing over to Razor for fresh start (hopefully 🤞) after the RWC.

The flip side to your argument is that maybe he is a good head coach. He has held this team together and found solutions. Even with his mistakes (eg holding on to assistants and some players) he hasn't lost the changing room and has helped guide things through adversity.
Yep, he has stumbled onto some solutions or had his hand forced but I don't buy that he is some kind of idiot at the helm of a ship navigated and sailed by the crew.
Definitely had his failings exposed but he has also been able to work past them.

Maybe.

I just want to know how you keep that suit of armour so damn white. You even manage to get the grass stains out of the knees. Impressive!

@antipodean said in Super Rugby 2023:

@KiwiMurph quoted the ARU mouthpiece in Super Rugby 2023:

Crucially, New Zealand appears to have softened its stance towards Australia’s demand for an even split of broadcast revenue, signifying a victory for RA.

I don't understand this: You can sell your part for more than we can, so we want part of your revenue too?

Wasn’t the old version of super rugby largely funded by NZ/Aus getting a cut from the larger broadcasting deal the South Africans had? Super sport maybe? Not sure when that changed. Might be wrong.

@Machpants said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:

@kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:

@Steve said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:

@Tim said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:

Sam Cane gets by from being a nice guy from the middle of nowhere. He is an absolutely terrible rugby player. He should get the fuck out of the All Blacks.

I really like him. I think it was circa 2016 he put on the most dominant tackling display I've ever seen against Wales in Cardiff. It was frightening.

But those days are long gone and he is yesterdays man.

He should have been picked for the RWC semi final but Hansen Guardiola'd himself by trying something mental in a knockout game.

The talk about succession planning is a farce when Hansens assistant gets the head coach role and then gives the same bloke that was dropped for the semi the captains armband.

I remember at the time thinking this is a weird decision,

Just named the guy captain that you lot couldn’t fit into the team for the most important game in 4 years

Apparently the team are rebuilding. Have been since 2019, despite only a couple of retirements after the cup (read, sbw, Ben Smith). How the fuck is a team, with the same coaching ticket and virtually the same players rebuilding? And how the fuck can it take two and a half years?

Totally agree, Just another bullshit excuse.

@akan004 said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:

@pukunui said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:

Is this rock bottom yet?

Ellis Park was.

They must have found some of that dry 2019 powder to keep tunnelling deeper through the rock.

Is this rock bottom yet?

@Crucial said in Foster:

@pukunui said in Foster:

@Crucial said in Foster:

@pukunui said in Foster:

@KiwiMurph said in Foster:

@pukunui said in Foster:

@Crucial said in Foster:

@pukunui said in Foster:

It would be very interesting to find out what Plumtree and Mooar think about the whole thing.

Getting thrown under the bus and having your replacements be held up as saviours of your teflon coated ex boss can’t be the most enjoyable experience.

Proof is in the pudding surely. Players said they weren’t up to it. Head coach said they weren’t up to it. Replacements were.
I’d lay low if I was them and pretend they were victims of a refocus

And his record says Foster “isn’t up to it”.
But he survived partly by knifing his assistants. ie shifting the blame onto them.

I doubt Mooar or Plumtree thought they weren’t up to it. It would be interesting to know what their opinions of the situation are. Very unlikely we find out any time soon though. Maybe it will be in a auto biography one day.

Obviously the sample size is small but looking at the Boks game there has already been improvements in the forwards (Plumtree's area) and the backs attack (I believe was Mooar's area?) plus this

Stuff understands the player feedback on Plumtree and Mooar had been consistent for a couple of years, without action from the NZ Rugby board.

Yeah, Im not suggesting that these guys were doing a good job. Just wondering whether they are happy to cop the majority of the blame and get sacked while Foster dodges the bullets and survives.
Were they not working to Fosters plans? If so why did he keep them there for so long in the face of poor reviews from players?

Have they really copped the blame though? Foster was copping all the blame but has saved himself by finally being willing to make changes, and in doing so, got a good win.
Most will see that they were replaced by better options not as the cause.

Of course they have. You said yourself that the players and head coach said they weren’t up to it and they have been sacked for poor performance. I don’t see how else that can be interpreted.
This wasn’t just some simple upgrade to better options.

Umm, no I didn't ...

@Crucial said in Foster:

I'm not exonerating Foster for anything here, just pointing out that these guys contributed to the problems, the players called it out and the head coach supported them as long as he could without losing his own job. Not sure why they are being painted as victims here.

Umm, yeah you did.

@Crucial said in Foster:

@pukunui said in Foster:

It would be very interesting to find out what Plumtree and Mooar think about the whole thing.

Getting thrown under the bus and having your replacements be held up as saviours of your teflon coated ex boss can’t be the most enjoyable experience.

Proof is in the pudding surely. Players said they weren’t up to it. Head coach said they weren’t up to it. Replacements were.
I’d lay low if I was them and pretend they were victims of a refocus

@Crucial said in Foster:

@pukunui said in Foster:

@KiwiMurph said in Foster:

@pukunui said in Foster:

@Crucial said in Foster:

@pukunui said in Foster:

It would be very interesting to find out what Plumtree and Mooar think about the whole thing.

Getting thrown under the bus and having your replacements be held up as saviours of your teflon coated ex boss can’t be the most enjoyable experience.

Proof is in the pudding surely. Players said they weren’t up to it. Head coach said they weren’t up to it. Replacements were.
I’d lay low if I was them and pretend they were victims of a refocus

And his record says Foster “isn’t up to it”.
But he survived partly by knifing his assistants. ie shifting the blame onto them.

I doubt Mooar or Plumtree thought they weren’t up to it. It would be interesting to know what their opinions of the situation are. Very unlikely we find out any time soon though. Maybe it will be in a auto biography one day.

Obviously the sample size is small but looking at the Boks game there has already been improvements in the forwards (Plumtree's area) and the backs attack (I believe was Mooar's area?) plus this

Stuff understands the player feedback on Plumtree and Mooar had been consistent for a couple of years, without action from the NZ Rugby board.

Yeah, Im not suggesting that these guys were doing a good job. Just wondering whether they are happy to cop the majority of the blame and get sacked while Foster dodges the bullets and survives.
Were they not working to Fosters plans? If so why did he keep them there for so long in the face of poor reviews from players?

Have they really copped the blame though? Foster was copping all the blame but has saved himself by finally being willing to make changes, and in doing so, got a good win.
Most will see that they were replaced by better options not as the cause.

Of course they have. You said yourself that the players and head coach said they weren’t up to it and they have been sacked for poor performance. I don’t see how else that can be interpreted.
This wasn’t just some simple upgrade to better options.

@ACT-Crusader said in Foster:

Stuff understands the player feedback on Plumtree and Mooar had been consistent for a couple of years, without action from the NZ Rugby board.

@KiwiMurph that sort of info doesn’t fall off the back of a truck. So Stuff obviously has a sauce that is willingly to stitch up the assistants…

There was action from the NZR board. It’s just that the action was to extend their contracts 2 years. What a mess.

@KiwiMurph said in Foster:

@pukunui said in Foster:

@Crucial said in Foster:

@pukunui said in Foster:

It would be very interesting to find out what Plumtree and Mooar think about the whole thing.

Getting thrown under the bus and having your replacements be held up as saviours of your teflon coated ex boss can’t be the most enjoyable experience.

Proof is in the pudding surely. Players said they weren’t up to it. Head coach said they weren’t up to it. Replacements were.
I’d lay low if I was them and pretend they were victims of a refocus

And his record says Foster “isn’t up to it”.
But he survived partly by knifing his assistants. ie shifting the blame onto them.

I doubt Mooar or Plumtree thought they weren’t up to it. It would be interesting to know what their opinions of the situation are. Very unlikely we find out any time soon though. Maybe it will be in a auto biography one day.

Obviously the sample size is small but looking at the Boks game there has already been improvements in the forwards (Plumtree's area) and the backs attack (I believe was Mooar's area?) plus this

Stuff understands the player feedback on Plumtree and Mooar had been consistent for a couple of years, without action from the NZ Rugby board.

Yeah, Im not suggesting that these guys were doing a good job. Just wondering whether they are happy to cop the majority of the blame and get sacked while Foster dodges the bullets and survives.
Were they not working to Fosters plans? If so why did he keep them there for so long in the face of poor reviews from players?

@Crucial said in Foster:

@pukunui said in Foster:

It would be very interesting to find out what Plumtree and Mooar think about the whole thing.

Getting thrown under the bus and having your replacements be held up as saviours of your teflon coated ex boss can’t be the most enjoyable experience.

Proof is in the pudding surely. Players said they weren’t up to it. Head coach said they weren’t up to it. Replacements were.
I’d lay low if I was them and pretend they were victims of a refocus

And his record says Foster “isn’t up to it”.
But he survived partly by knifing his assistants. ie shifting the blame onto them.

I doubt Mooar or Plumtree thought they weren’t up to it. It would be interesting to know what their opinions of the situation are. Very unlikely we find out any time soon though. Maybe it will be in a auto biography one day.