The Silver Fern

I agree that WJ suits wing better. He is a weapon there. Opposite to the narrative on here, I think his distribution skills are good as he has consistently shown (try assist stats?) but the lack of a tactical kicking game and decision-making in a tight arm wrestle is a concern.

@Bones said in All Blacks v France:

@Old-Samurai-Jack said in All Blacks v France:

He sets up other players well, is definitely not selfish (don't know where that is coming from)

Right, so the multiple instances of him ignoring support and/or taking the limp option then turning the ball over is great team play? Keep drinking the coolade man. What's good about him not looking to link when he breaks, or overrunning the ball carrier, kicking the ball away randomly or throwing a shit 20/80 pass when he's eventually caught? Yeah very unselfish.

Needs a comma.
I'd like to see his assist stats compared to other players. He seems to be a good link player. I am not sure you have a healthy perspective about this particular player....

@Bones said in All Blacks v France:

@nzzp said in All Blacks v France:

Y'all should also apologise to @Bones; he's been consistent with his observations of Will Jordan - elite in some facets, but missing some bits that make great Test fullbacks. That's not a hit on Will, just that he's a better wing where the things he isn't as good at don't get exposed so much.

Yeah look, Will can do some amazing stuff and fuck it's pretty to watch him in space. Just what annoys me is he still plays like that guy growing up who was bigger and better than everyone and so just grabbed the ball and did it on his own. It's not stuff that can't be worked on and I certainly would've hoped to see vast improvement this season - but there's nothing.

How is it that he's still consistently choosing selfish options, constantly overrunning players with the ball, etc? He doesn't value possession and just readily hands it back to the opposition.

If I could see even a tiny bit of improvement across his many seasons then I would be more comfortable, but he just doesn't appear to have any application or desire to improve - or he's not being taught well.

Whilst I agree his best position is wing, some of the things you have attacked Will on are just plain silly. He sets up other players well, is definitely not selfish (don't know where that is coming from), and his defensive positioning is very good (could be more physical in the tackle of course).
His best position is wing I think because he doesn't have the kicking game or maybe even the decision nous for fullback I think (neither does Jordie on the decision front....). On the wing he can roam and not have the same responsibilities that limits a fullback from getting in the game.

@Dodge said in All Blacks v France:

this is the game of the weekend as far as i'm concerned. Hoping France turn up and the noise is insane. Will be nice to see the second best 9 (and best player ever) in the world again,

Wot? SA vs Poms?

Scots backs more effective than the Boks. The Scots made quite a few opportunities then failed to finish.
Boks pretty much nailed most opportunities. Just another day at the office for them I felt.

Awesome for Wobs. They have got some really talented players in that squad, so it was just a matter of time until something clicked.

@Bones said in All Blacks vs Ireland:

@Old-Samurai-Jack said in All Blacks vs Ireland:

@Bones said in All Blacks vs Ireland:

@Old-Samurai-Jack said in All Blacks vs Ireland:

@Jet said in All Blacks vs Ireland:

Giving it the big one , because you've executed a 50/22 while 10 points down tells you all you need to know about that mob.

That kick though was a thing of beauty. Jordan did nothing wrong, the idea was good but bugger me, what a response!

Oh come on, how many meek turnovers does this guy get away with under the guise of doing nothing wrong? It was a shit kick when we were hot on attack. Selfish play.

Mate, a few minutes to play, put the opposition in their own 22 for a lineout. Whatever this kid has done to your family, let it go.

They were under pressure, we were running hot, he did his usual schizo and only cared about him so did his cute, aimless dink ahead. Brainless play. Repro has it covered.

@Bones said in All Blacks vs Ireland:

@Old-Samurai-Jack said in All Blacks vs Ireland:

@Jet said in All Blacks vs Ireland:

Giving it the big one , because you've executed a 50/22 while 10 points down tells you all you need to know about that mob.

That kick though was a thing of beauty. Jordan did nothing wrong, the idea was good but bugger me, what a response!

Oh come on, how many meek turnovers does this guy get away with under the guise of doing nothing wrong? It was a shit kick when we were hot on attack. Selfish play.

Mate, a few minutes to play, put the opposition in their own 22 for a lineout. Whatever this kid has done to your family, let it go.

@Jet said in All Blacks vs Ireland:

Giving it the big one , because you've executed a 50/22 while 10 points down tells you all you need to know about that mob.

That kick though was a thing of beauty. Jordan did nothing wrong, the idea was good but bugger me, what a response!

Those three Kiwi-Irish are pretty good, aren't they? Fuckers!
How good? They grounded out a win without going full retard. You could see the headless chook appear at times (it is going to take time to get fully rid of it) but generally a very pragmatic win. Exits good, close-in defense good,... Beyond stoked.

I've got a good feeling about this one.

Exits and stiff defense around the collision areas/up fat man's ally. These are the weaknesses of the ABs and the main things to get right against Ireland. Their smoke and mirrors chaos with dummy runners up the middle needs to be absolutely smashed back into the dark ages.

@Tim said in All Blacks vs Ireland:

Seriously hate Irish rugby and their shenanigans. Complete dickheads!

@LatsToTheMax said in All Blacks Vs England, Twickenham:

@Machpants said in All Blacks Vs England, Twickenham:

Try, and penalty against Maro, lucky it didn't connect with telea's head

A player must not attempt to kick the ball from the hands of the ball-carrier.

https://cdn4.theroar.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2024/11/Mark-Telea.jpg

That's a penalty try if he collects him there.

In the last 10 or so, he basically got away with murder at the breakdown near their line as well. A real competitor but were was Gardner with all this offending?

Holland was very good and I wish McMillan was part of the the ABs set up. His teams always seem to focus on the physicality side of the breakdown battle. His battles with Razor in SR were games within games.

F#%k I hate the Irish rugby team, they repulse my Irish DNA with their soccer antics, their rugby culture which seems to be a dramatic victim whingefest, and ........ the high priests of victimhood, O'Driscoll and Sexton used to play for them. POM currently plays but at least he is funny and can walk the talk..

@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks Vs England, Twickenham:

Good win. Sets tour up

Yeah, against all odds really. Gardner and co. decided to go full "hometown". The crowd wanted blood, the lads with a bit of lady luck would have put 15 points on them but the bitch decided to disappear for the full 80. Even so the good guys won.
Having said that, if the lads don't improve against the whingy Green siths, things might come unstuck.

@Catogrande said in All Blacks Vs England, Twickenham:

@mariner4life

If it was a full PK that was a dumb decision that late in the game.

Free kick!

(Caveat : I had had a few wines at that stage)

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks Vs England, Twickenham:

@His-Bobness said in All Blacks Vs England, Twickenham:

@Chris-B I agree. It looks like the ambition to play dazzling, fast and beautiful rugby exceeds the individual abilities of most of the players. It speaks perhaps to a lack of clarity of communication, pragmatism and honesty at the coaching level. Something isn’t working internally, I suspect.

Aside from the messy execution of an overly idealised game plan, I’m also alarmed at the players’ seeming inability to maintain discipline under pressure. This has been going on all year, and may reflect the frustration they feel at the gap between the coaches’ grandiose vision and the reality.

With that in mind, we shouldn’t overlook the distorting factor of money. The Silverlake private equity investment was in an AB brand built on fast, flowing and attacking rugby that is beautiful to watch. Those sort of investors are notoriously impatient, which leaves me thinking Robertson feels he must deliver on that in every game, and those pressures are getting to the players.

What’s needed is a greater sense of pragmatism - of building the strategy around the team, rather than the team around the strategy. I still wonder at what was behind Leon Macdonald’s early exit from the coaching set-up and whether NZ Rugby’s almost panicked early appointment of Robertson has created a culture where people are now frightened to question the boss.

Maybe what's missing is some wise old heads in the coaching set-up to provide a counterweight or sounding-board for the ambition - perhaps Robertson understands that for the team and why is sticking with the likes of Cane, BB etc

I genuinely think losing Schmidt was an opportunity lost and someone like him or Cotter in the set-up could make a big difference to executing the vision Robertson has.

It is a raw group for sure. That was mentioned many times on this forum when the coaching staff was announced. I do see an attitude and self-awareness that they have a lot learn as well, though. I see comparisons with early Henry and co in that regard which kind of proves taking over the ABs is a challenge for any kind of coach, international experience or not.

@His-Bobness said in All Blacks Vs England, Twickenham:

@Chris-B I agree. It looks like the ambition to play dazzling, fast and beautiful rugby exceeds the individual abilities of most of the players. It speaks perhaps to a lack of clarity of communication, pragmatism and honesty at the coaching level. Something isn’t working internally, I suspect.

Aside from the messy execution of an overly idealised game plan, I’m also alarmed at the players’ seeming inability to maintain discipline under pressure. This has been going on all year, and may reflect the frustration they feel at the gap between the coaches’ grandiose vision and the reality.

With that in mind, we shouldn’t overlook the distorting factor of money. The Silverlake private equity investment was in an AB brand built on fast, flowing and attacking rugby that is beautiful to watch. Those sort of investors are notoriously impatient, which leaves me thinking Robertson feels he must deliver on that in every game, and those pressures are getting to the players.

What’s needed is a greater sense of pragmatism - of building the strategy around the team, rather than the team around the strategy. I still wonder at what was behind Leon Macdonald’s early exit from the coaching set-up and whether NZ Rugby’s almost panicked early appointment of Robertson has created a culture where people are now frightened to question the boss.

That is one perspective. Mine is that BB can't drive a team and makes silly decisions.