The Silver Fern

So after a week of fun and games with Twitter burner accounts whinging about refereeing in the first test, Rassie releases his magnum opus. An hour long refereeing whinge, bitching about everything down to not straight lineouts. Absolutely the most pathetic thing I've ever seen from a Head Coach/DOR following a test match.

Seriously lads. It's Stephen Jones. You don't need to devote this much energy every time he pens an article mentioning New Zealand.

It's really not worth it.

@MN5

I'll never understand how you lads go out of your way to read and get wound up by a journo on the other side of the world writing behind a paywall. I really couldn't be bothered personally wasting the energy on Spiro, Rattue, Francis etc.

Beloved England team? He's Welsh FFS, don't blame us for him.

@mariner4life said in NH International Rugby:

Eddie lost to South Africa, Argentina, should have lost to us.

Lost a game in Australia. Lost to the Barbarians

Lost to Ireland, France and Scotland.

That's just this year. That should get you fired as a head coach, World Cup in a year be damned.

Pretty much. There's been a mountain of revisionist takes on his departure.

Ultimately performances on the pitch outside of that Oz series victory have been very poor. We've won a total of 4 games in the last two 6N (2 of those were against Italy). That's just not good enough. His record is padded by the excellent start he had and we've not looked a good team since 2019.

You can put up with Eddie's shtick whilst he's getting results, but it gets tiring when you're dealing with the mediocrity on display at the moment.

Is Borthwick the right man for the job? Time will tell, but for me, it was time for a change despite the timing.

@pakman said in England vs All Blacks:

In forwards Vunipola (M and B ) missing and would be in top 8. Launchbury, Curry (T) and Robshaw all out and they are borderline starters. That takes a lot of bulk/go forward out.

In backs Tuiglai would have been in 23, and Watson a starter.

A fair number of other lesser lights. Jonathan Joseph would be close to starter and second and third best LHs and no. 2 (and possibly no. 3) no. 8s crocked.

Tuilagi's fairly theoretical these days, given how long he's been off the scene. Wouldn't say he's a guaranteed to have been in the 23. In fact I've not seen anything to suggest he's actually still injured this week. Joseph and Watson are the main losses in the back line.

Talk of 16 players out is a little disingenuous given the players missing tend to be clustered in a few positions as you say. Definitely bare bones stuff at loosehead (Vunipola, Genge, Obano, Mullan and Marler if he counts out) and 8 (B Vunipola, Simmonds and Hughes). Still got first choice (or close to) options at lock, TH and hooker. A bit make shift on the flank.

Backs in general have a few out, but it's still not a million miles away from first choice. Players like Ashton and Slade (despite his poor game against SA) aren't the worst options to come in. Not a fan of Te'o at 12, but Eddie seems to like him.

Injuries certainly shouldn't be any kind of excuse if it goes badly wrong tomorrow

It's okay, Sexton didn't get mad. He got even....

Joking aside, well deserved win for Ireland. Always tough to beat in Dublin and we didn't have it on the day. It's certainly a lot easier to take than the 2013 Cardiff debacle

@gibbon-rib said in Wales v Australia:

@tordah this is one of the more bizarre claims I've ever seen on a rugby site. That the ref should overrule the laws of the game and treat a legal knock-back as an illegal knock-on because if infringes some unwritten ethereal "spirit of the game".

Yep, I find the fuss being made over this decision baffling. It went backwards, hence it was legal. It's that simple. You can't wish something into the law book that's not there when a decision doesn't go your way.

Personally hampered by not watching as many RC and Super Rugby games as I'd like to, so hard to comment on Smith, TJP , Genia etc throughout the full season.

Murray has been the best NH 9 for me though. Very solid all round game and seems to be the hub of most things that Ireland have done well this year. Youngs has definitely finished the year well though and looks sharper than he has for a long time.

@Victor-Meldrew said in Australia v England - 1st Test:

@Catogrande said in Australia v England - 1st Test:

Here's hoping for Underhill

Whatever happened to him? He was awesome in 2018 and then seemed to fall out of favour and seems to have had only sporadic appearances.

Multiple injuries and is playing (and not really standing out) in a bottom of the league club side.

He's the kind of player that could pull something out of the hat if selected, but he's on the tour based on credit in the bank imo.

Bang on with the call though. Pen every day of the week

TBF wing is one area that we can take a few injuries without too much of a drop off. Big opportunity for Cokanasiga, who'll surely come in.

Daly also needs a performance at FB. Hasn't really looked at home there yet. Far less depth there and Brown would look a good shout to come back in for the 6N unless he really nails it down. I'd actually rather see him at 13 than Slade, but Eddie's shown very little inclination on that front.

@Nogusta

Interesting move for the bloke. He's very good. Similar style of player to Jonathan Joseph and has a knack of making things happen with ball in hand

@cgrant said in 2021 British & Irish Lions tour to SA:

Navidi's absence is weird.
There are some surprise selections : Hill, Conan, Porter, Simmonds, Lawes. All of them were meh during the last 6N.
James Ryan, Navidi, H. Williams and Ritchie, just to name a few, would have been better choices IMO.

Agree. He especially was completely anonymous. Barely knew he was on the field.

This is all small fry compared to the major outrage here.

21 years or these men's awards and there has never been a single nomination for a prop. If that's not discrimination against our bigger boned brethren, I don't know what is.

0/109 nominations for props 2001-2022
Prop = 0
Hooker = 5
Lock = 10
Flanker = 25
No 8 = 10
Scrum-half = 11
Fly-half = 19
Centre = 14
Wing = 9
Fullback = 6

2 points worth noting

1. He's Welsh
2. He lives for the reaction he gets from Kiwis, it keeps his profile sky high online despite the paywall. Every time he mentions New Zealand, the bloke gets an unofficial syndication in Stuff or The NZ Herald. If everyone just stopped talking about his latest missives they'd wither behind the paywall.

@Tim

Yep, short career that could end at any time. Families to support. Easy to throw around the merc line, but I think a lot of people if they were honest would switch jobs if they were offered double or triple their salary, with a nice three year contract and the opportunity to see a bit of the world

@Bones said in Australia v England - 1st Test:

@Margin_Walker said in Australia v England - 1st Test:

For what it's worth, I'd go with something like this:

1.Genge 2.George 3.Stuart 4.Itoje 5.Chessum 6.Lawes 7.Willis 8.Vunipola
9.Care 10.Smith 11.May 12.Farrell 13.Marchant 14.Arundell 15.Steward

16.LCD 17.Vunipola 18.Heyes 19.Hill 20.Ludlum 21.JvP 22.Porter 23.Nowell

Lots of calls for Lawes at lock, but I'd be surprised if Eddie did go for it. He just doesn't play there any more. Back row is on the slow side, but it's slightly offset by having a more mobile guy like Chessum at lock.

Can Ludlam not play 8? I find it hard to believe Vunipola has anything to offer on the field.

Vunipola's actually been going very well domestically. Had a great game in a losing cause in the Prem final the other week. With Dombrandt and Simmonds injured, it's one of the easier selections really at the moment.

@Catogrande

You can get away with plenty up here, but playing a strong team in the Anglo Welsh final and winning it....

Poor form, he had to go

It's a yellow for me. You don't tend to pick up reds for open hand pushes like that. TMO and officials clearly asleep at the wheel though.

It was the hair pull that got me. Up here Creevy was (rightly imo) cited and banned for pulling Etzebeth's hair in May. It either is a red card offence, or it isn't.

Agustin Creevy suspended for one week | European Professional Club Rugby

The London Irish hooker, Agustin Creevy, has been suspended for one week following an independent Disciplinary Hearing arising from his club’s EPCR Challenge Cup quarter-final match against RC Toulon at Stade Félix Mayol.

*Law 9.27 A player must not do anything that is against the spirit of good sportsmanship

Under World Rugby’s Sanctions for Foul Play, Law 9.27 relating to hair pulling or grabbing carries the following sanction entry points – Low End: 2 weeks; Mid-range: 4 weeks; Top end: 6 to 52 weeks.*

Billy Vunipola's the first bloke on the England and Lions team sheet for me (or would have been). Has been massively important over the last two seasons and England/Saracens game-plan is often built around him. Also, isn't someone you'd sub off after 50 minutes these days.

That said, it's not the end of the world, there are always plenty of injuries in the lead up to (and during) Lions tours and Falatau is a decent enough player who is used to working with Gatland. There's still a decent back row in there somewhere.