Super Rugby News
-
@rotated I agree somewhat that it will surprise me if they manage to get rid of any teams - there's certainly no-one I've seen with their hand up saying pick me.
In terms of Tew's proposed contraction - that got rejected by the NZR board - as far as the Mako$ are concerned the proof is in the pudding. Over the past three seasons we've been probably the second best provincial team - at worst third behind Taranaki. 15-20 players have Super rugby contracts and numerous All Blacks have strong links to Nelson-Marlborough.
Compare that to the contribution Nelson Bays made to national rugby in the 30 years prior to the Mako$ - you could pretty much count on one hand the number of Nelson Bays players - or even people had spurious links to Nelson - who made any impression whatsoever at national level. Trevor Morris, Terry Mitchell, Will Dempster, Allan Prince, Todd Blackadder .... Almost zero contribution in 30 years - somewhere there's a database where you can search born or went to school - there's still virtually zero contribution in 30 years. Whereas now there's heaps of AB linkages - the Franks bros, Squire, Crockett, Romano, Crotty, Hames...
Plus the Mako$ seem to have recovered from the early financial hiccup. I believe the NZR loan has been repaid and we've been model citizens in living within our means, attracting good crowds, hosting RWC games, providing a base for the Crusaders when the earthquake struck, etc, etc.
Edit: And providing Tony Johnson to do fantastic and righteous commentary!
-
@Chris-B.
Yay, postman Willie made the fern, nice one Chris 😊Good points you made. We lived up the road from one time AB Gary (?) Sims which in the 80s in Richmond was the equivalent of living next to SBW. "ooh an ex All Black lives there" 😊
-
So what three teams will be cut?
-
@jegga have to say the Kings, Cheetahs and Force are favorites...right or wrong
-
I'm hoping to hear them announce that Aus will lose 1 team and SA to lose 2.
I'm expecting to hear that no teams will be dropped and it will go to a 3 conference model with Jaguars joining our conference and the Sunwolves joining Aus. Which will be fucking horrendous.
-
“SANZAAR has announced that the Super Rugby tournament has been restructured and will kick-off in 2018 with a three conference, 15-team format: five teams from New Zealand, four from Australia, four from South Africa, one from Japan; and one from Argentina.
This restructuring by SANZAAR represents a crucial step in its strategic planning process that has included a comprehensive assessment of the economic and sporting environment under which its tournaments (Super Rugby and The Rugby Championship) are currently operating.
This assessment highlighted a need to adjust and strengthen Super Rugby in the short-term to ensure a robust and sustainable tournament meets the requirements of all stakeholders in terms of high performance pathways, game development, commercial revenue and fan engagement.
The change sees an overall reduction of three teams from the current 18-team format, two from South Africa and one from Australia. The Sunwolves will move into the Australian Conference. The teams from Australia and South Africa that will compete in Super Rugby will be confirmed in due course by the respective National Unions.
New Zealand Conference
Blues, Chiefs, Crusaders, Highlanders, HurricanesAustralian Conference
Four Australian teams (TBC), SunwolvesSouth Africa Conference
Four South Africa teams (TBC), JaguaresSANZAAR Chairman, Brent Impey stated, “The decision to revert to a 15-team format reflects a consensus view of the mandated SANZAAR Executive Committee that met in London recently. It was not the determination of any one Union or stakeholder and follows a thorough assessment and review of the tournament over the last nine months.”
“SANZAAR is delighted that its major broadcast partners have after due consideration agreed to the restructured format within the existing broadcast agreements. Our broadcast partners are an important stakeholder and their vision for Super Rugby moving forward is the same as ours.”
“This decision has not been an easy one and we recognise the difficulty associated with reducing the number of teams in Australia and South Africa. Naturally we understand that there will be some very disappointed franchises but the tournament’s long-term future and the economic reality of the business at present is something that had to be addressed.”
“The decision to retain the Sunwolves is linked directly to SANZAAR’s strategic plan for the future. The potential for growth of the sport in Asia off the back of the establishment of the Sunwolves and the impending RWC in 2019 is significant. It remains an obvious focus for the organisation and a Japanese Super Rugby franchise is key to that strategy.”
SANZAAR CEO Andy Marinos stated, “This has been a long and complex piece of work and we make no apology for that. Super Rugby is unique in world rugby in that it is played in six countries across 15 time zones and has numerous stakeholders.”
“SANZAAR cannot continue to ignore the extensive feedback that it has received from fans, stakeholders and commercial partners around the integrity of the competition format and performances of the teams. We want to see an engaging, vibrant and competitive competition that delivers a strong high performance pathway in all markets that will have a positive flow into the international game.”
“It became clear during our strategic assessment that there are two facets to the future of our tournaments. The first is a requirement to react to existing market forces within the sporting business environment and to implement short-term change to Super Rugby. This is what we have done.”
“The second is the longer term vision, through a strategic plan, to build the brand that in the future can maximize further development of the game, commercial revenues and the ongoing sustainability of the tournaments. This work is presently ongoing and details will be released in the coming months.”
Tournament Details
120 match regular season plus seven match finals series
15 teams
Three conferences (Australia, New Zealand, South Africa)
18 rounds [16 matches per team, two bye weeks]
Each team will play eight matches within its conference (four home and four away)
Each team will play eight cross-conference matches – against four of the five teams from each of the other two conferences (four at home and four away)
Each team will play 12 of the other teams within the season (85% of opposition teams which is up from 70% in 2016).
Eight team Finals Series: Three Conference winners and; five wild card places – the next best performing teams based on competition points after the Conference winners regardless of Conference. Conference winners and fourth-placed team on competition points will host quarter-finals.“
The ARU have decided to cut a team and now the the process drags on as an evaluation phase begins to determine who will be cut. Super Rugby foundation teams – the Reds, Brumbies and Waratahs – are apparently safe with the decision to come down to the two newest teams, the Force or the Rebels. -
I can live with that.
I think 8 playoff teams in a 15 team competition is pretty daft, but otherwise seems to be the most sensible way forward.
-
It's now even harder for a NZ team to win it. The number of high intensity local derbies stays the same, but we won't get as many easy games against the foreign teams as we do now. I don't see how this has benefited NZ one bit. Should have gone back to the s12 format of each team playing each other once.
-
The lesson out all of this is that a competition needs integrity. The 18-team blowout was a complete disaster, with the poster boy being the Kings.
In the long-run, there is definitely room to expand outside of the traditional big 3, with a 2nd team from Argentina an obvious starting place (add to SA conf), a 2nd team from Asia (add to Aust), and maybe a Pacific team (add to NZ).
But not before the Jaguares and Sunwolves are regularly competitive (ie at least mid-table contenders, winning most home games).
I dunno why the Aussies and Saffas are complaining - same money with fewer players = more competitive salaries to keep players out of Europe. Extremely bad news for NPC journeymen though...
-
@akan004 said in Super Rugby News:
It's now even harder for an NZ team to win it. The number high intensity local derbies stays the same, but we won't get as many easy games against the foreign teams as we do now. I don't see how this has benefited NZ one bit. Should have gone back to the s12 format of each team playing each other once.
12 teams is a financial no-brainer. Wish people would stop going on about it. It is the best competitive option, but not financially attractive enough. It will never happen.
-
@Billy-Tell said in Super Rugby News:
@akan004 said in Super Rugby News:
It's now even harder for an NZ team to win it. The number high intensity local derbies stays the same, but we won't get as many easy games against the foreign teams as we do now. I don't see how this has benefited NZ one bit. Should have gone back to the s12 format of each team playing each other once.
12 teams is a financial no-brainer. Wish people would stop going on about it. It is the best competitive option, but not financially attractive enough. It will never happen.
I meant 15 teams with the old s12 format of every team playing each other.
-
@akan004 said in Super Rugby News:
@Billy-Tell said in Super Rugby News:
@akan004 said in Super Rugby News:
It's now even harder for an NZ team to win it. The number high intensity local derbies stays the same, but we won't get as many easy games against the foreign teams as we do now. I don't see how this has benefited NZ one bit. Should have gone back to the s12 format of each team playing each other once.
12 teams is a financial no-brainer. Wish people would stop going on about it. It is the best competitive option, but not financially attractive enough. It will never happen.
I meant 15 teams with the old s12 format of every team playing each other.
Ah sorry, my bad.
-
@akan004 said in Super Rugby News:
It's now even harder for a NZ team to win it. The number of high intensity local derbies stays the same, but we won't get as many easy games against the foreign teams as we do now. I don't see how this has benefited NZ one bit. Should have gone back to the s12 format of each team playing each other once.
With SA dropping 2 teams I would expect the quality of their teams to go up markedly. I also expect the Jaguares to be very good most years, once they get used to the travel and rigour of the competition.
Australia dropping a team should result in a slight improvement in their teams. Unfortunately I don't hold out too much hope for the Sunwolves, but perhaps they'll get better.
The NZ conference might not necessarily be the toughest one each year now. Good.
-
As an aside, they haven't actually named which sides will be dropped.
Kings will no doubt be the first side retained. Sigh.
-
@Damo although our conference being the toughest is better for our rugby long term though
-
I've never liked the home and away and don't want a return to it. I prefer seeing NZ teams play non NZ teams so I have no issues with who to cheer for.
But, that's just me.
-
@KiwiMurph said in Super Rugby News:
@akan004 Actually the nz derbies are increasing. Currently each nz team plays 6 derbies, from next year it will be 8.
Didn't realise that. Makes it even worse. I thought the main gripe of the NZ players was that there were too many high intensity local derbies as it is. So the NZRU decides to bend over and add another couple.
-
there are gonna be plenty of nervy fellas in a few teams in Aus & SA, a few NH teams be looking on expecting to get some bargains as well.
Although...
SANZAAR Drop Nuts – Expands To Super Rugby 64 Teams In 2018
Posted on April 9, 2017 by thaicastle1 in Uncategorized // 0 CommentsAfter weeks of deliberation about who to cut from Super Rugby SANZAAR has dropped its nuts. Instead of cutting three teams from Super Rugby they have decided to add 46 new franchises in 2018.
SANZAAR president Jaco MakeMoMoney has told Thai Castle that the decision was relatively easy – “We thought long and hard and didn’t think that cutting teams would solve Super Rugby’s problems, so we were like why don’t we expand further and see if that makes the on-field product stronger.
From a New Zealand stand point four new franchises have been added which include the Marist Under-12s, Liston College 3rd XV, Wellington Phoenix and an All Blacks Over 75 year old squad.
NZ Rugby President Steve Tew said he was delighted to add the four new franchises saying that he thought they would add some real depth to New Zealand Rugby for generations to come.
Wellington Phoenix coach Chris Greenacre told Thai Castle “When we heard the news we were added to Super Rugby we were pretty flattered. It will be hard playing in two professional sports leagues at once but the boys think there soccer skills will come in handy on the rugby field. I mean all they do is kick the ball.”
The 64 team field has been split into 8 groups of 8 teams with each team playing 128 games in a 17 week span. The top first seeds from each group go to the best of 27 final series. With the remaining teams going into a survivor series were the team that loses the most games will tragically lose a limb at the discretion of SANZAAR officials.
The new teams added are:
Marist Under-12s
Liston College 3rd XV
Wellingtoin Phoenix
All Blacks Over 75s
Antarctica Frozen Peas
Dargaville Dental Assistants
Tottenham Hotspur
Bermuda Triangle Titans
Wedge Island Warriors
Compton Stealers
Donald Trump Wall Builders
Norwegian No-Shows
Kolkata Dayriders
The Beatles
Cleveland Cavaliers
London Bridge Free Ballers
French Frogleg Surprise
The Paris Croissants
The Glasgow Facepunches
The Alice Springs Drymouths
Queensland Bogans
Tokyo Toyotas
China Investor Squad
Killa Bees
Canada Chocalate Brownies
Mexican Eses
Zimbabwe Inflation
North Korea Naughty Boys
Pyongang Punishment
Pacific Ocean Oceans
Taj Mahal Revonators
The Brexits
The Barcelonas Ballsacks
The Scunthorpe Scotos
Canterbury Cum Stains
Georgia Goochs
North Pole Pole dancers
Santas Little Helpers
Colombia Narcos
American Idol Winners Selection
Ryan Seacrest Squad
The Carb-dashians
The Andrew Schultz’s
The Kelekefus
The Football Kings
Auckland Blues 2
Auckland Pooze
Dubai Oillers
-
There's going to be some busy agents around the place, lots of journeymen heading north too I suspect.
-
@KiwiMurph said in Super Rugby News:
@akan004 Actually the nz derbies are increasing. Currently each nz team plays 6 derbies, from next year it will be 8.
I like the NZ derbies. Also means less travel for our players.
I get the appeal of round robin, but from a selfish point of view I'll take more NZ derbies. It also means the games against the other conferences have some novelty appeal, like the Chiefs vs Stormers yesterday.
-
@taniwharugby said in Super Rugby News:
@Damo although our conference being the toughest is better for our rugby long term though
Possibly in the medium term, but what is best for our long term future is the continued viability of Super Rugby. Having so many dud teams from SA and Aus was slowly killing Super Rugby.
-
@Damo Agree in the main - although (I as a dyed in the wool rugby supporter/diehard) - will watch all the SR games I can, I understand not everyone is the same, and admittedly some of the lop-sided results are not to everyone's palate and I can see why people might lose interest.
-
I used to try and watch all games involving NZ teams ,
and now from an entertainment angle , its slowly evolved into trying to watch all NZ derbies
-
Jamie Pandaram in the Tele here is naming Force, Kings, and Cheetahs as the victims.
-
The Force decision kind of makes sense - that time zone is a bit of a dead spot, and the complaint about the travel from Perth is valid.
The fucking bullshit they had with sponsors in the early years, as well as the issues with attracting talent so far away from families - also valid.
Recruiting South Africans, to the point where some people were sniggering about "Perthfontein" shows that the whole development argument is a bit of a dud.
I found Paul Cully's tweet interesting:
There will be some circling for players, but not coaches - rookies at all franchises.
-
Ffs. The biggest problem with super rugby isn't that there are a couple of shit teams. It's the stupid conference system and fucked up finals format where teams don't play the same opposition yet are put into a rankings table as if they do, then come finals time a team can have less points than others but gets a home final.
The new comp will be just as much of a joke. What is the point of over half the teams making the finals?
If you have to have conferences then keep them totally seperate and then have a knock out comp with the top 2 from each conference for the champions cup.I fully expect more shit teams to be added and formats to change in another two years.
-
@Billy-Tell said in Super Rugby News:
@KiwiMurph said in Super Rugby News:
@akan004 Actually the nz derbies are increasing. Currently each nz team plays 6 derbies, from next year it will be 8.
I like the NZ derbies. Also means less travel for our players.
I get the appeal of round robin, but from a selfish point of view I'll take more NZ derbies. It also means the games against the other conferences have some novelty appeal, like the Chiefs vs Stormers yesterday.
From what I remember, the last time we had 8 derbies a year the players didn't like them because they were the most intense matches on the calendar and as a result, led to more injuries.
Increasing the local derbies makes it a shitload harder for NZ teams to make the final six, so I'm not a fan at all. Last year, where we had four teams in the final six, will probably never happen in the new structure.
-
@pukunui said in Super Rugby News:
Ffs. The biggest problem with super rugby isn't that there are a couple of shit teams. It's the stupid conference system and fucked up finals format where teams don't play the same opposition yet are put into a rankings table as if they do, then come finals time a team can have less points than others but gets a home final.
The new comp will be just as much of a joke. What is the point of over half the teams making the finals?
If you have to have conferences then keep them totally seperate and then have a knock out comp with the top 2 from each conference for the champions cup.I fully expect more shit teams to be added and formats to change in another two years.
Give that man a cold beer!! That in a nutshell is exactly what is wrong with SR - the bloody format ie conference system is just crazy. Whatever happened to home and away FFS, something players and fans can understand.
-
The bean counters have truly lost their shit. The market is tapped out
-
@pukunui said in Super Rugby News:
Ffs. The biggest problem with super rugby isn't that there are a couple of shit teams. It's the stupid conference system and fucked up finals format where teams don't play the same opposition yet are put into a rankings table as if they do, then come finals time a team can have less points than others but gets a home final.
The new comp will be just as much of a joke. What is the point of over half the teams making the finals?
If you have to have conferences then keep them totally seperate and then have a knock out comp with the top 2 from each conference for the champions cup.I fully expect more shit teams to be added and formats to change in another two years.
-
Beauden Barrett will front a Sanzaar judiciary on Monday night for his double yellow card effort against the Waratahs. Sanzaar's foul play review committee looked at the incidents on Sunday night and decided there was a case to answer for World Rugby's 2016 player of the year. The judicial committee for the video conference hearing will be Adam Casselden SC (Chairman), Mike Mika and De Wet Barry.
This will be a test case in the event another player also receives 2 YCs in the future.
-
@Bovidae said in Super Rugby News:
Beauden Barrett will front a Sanzaar judiciary on Monday night for his double yellow card effort against the Waratahs. Sanzaar's foul play review committee looked at the incidents on Sunday night and decided there was a case to answer for World Rugby's 2016 player of the year. The judicial committee for the video conference hearing will be Adam Casselden SC (Chairman), Mike Mika and De Wet Barry.
This will be a test case in the event another player also receives 2 YCs in the future.
Surely no case to answer. No foul play should mean no sanction. I can't even imagine a scenario where a professional foul would warrant a ban. Maybe the "Hand of Back"? Even that's pushing it.
-
@pukunui said in Super Rugby News:
Ffs. The biggest problem with super rugby isn't that there are a couple of shit teams. It's the stupid conference system and fucked up finals format where teams don't play the same opposition yet are put into a rankings table as if they do, then come finals time a team can have less points than others but gets a home final.
The new comp will be just as much of a joke. What is the point of over half the teams making the finals?
If you have to have conferences then keep them totally seperate and then have a knock out comp with the top 2 from each conference for the champions cup.I fully expect more shit teams to be added and formats to change in another two years.
It wasn't broke when it was Super 12. Why did the fisheads ( great description btw Norm Hewitt ) feel the need to fix it? I do understand expansion and adding a couple of teams but the convoluted and confusing nature of the competition means it has alienated a shitload of fans which is typified by attendances at games.
-
@Frye Barrett probably won't get any ban but you never know with the judiciary. It's not foul play but could be labelled repeated infringement. As I said, the outcome and summary of the hearing will be of interest as a precedent is set.
-
The people making the decisions at Sanzaar really do need to be taken out back and shot. Their idiotic decisions have been leeching the life out of the comp ever since the move to the Super 14. Either have a proper conference system or a proper round robin system, this in-between bullshit (and 8 teams making the finals!) is a mess.
As for BB, I think one week would be fair. If the yellow cards were for two different infringements, that'd be one thing, but the same exact infringement twice in the same game? That's just fucking dumb.
-
ARU having a presser today about the team to be cut.... But they're not going to announce WHICH team. Because they're dumb, hopeless fluffybunnies.
-
sometimes i think we are too hard on SANZAAR. They are trying to create a competition that ticks so many boxes (exposure, revenue raising, fairness, development of 4 different domestic games) but has to overcome some very significant hurdles (geography, distance, small markets, poor economies).
And it has to do well enough to compete with a Northern competition that has all the worlds biggest rugby markets in a geographical location smaller than Australia. But fuck loads more people and money.
And we as fans want everything. Lots to watch on TV, but at the times we want. We want quality (more games against NZ teams!), and we want variety (less games against NZ teams!). And we as kiwi fans are one of 5 sets of fans that the governing body has to keep happy.
Then politically, every country wants something different. We want a competition that provides the best All Blacks. Aus want a competition that is big enough domestically to grow their player base and compete with the other codes. South Africa need to use it as a change agent. The Japanese and Argentinians just want a seat at a table.
How the fuck do you make everyone happy given those agendas, and still give the broadcaster something they like enough to pay you the money you require to pay for your players? Players who will be offered shitloads to play elsewhere.
Short term this change probably helps. But is it really a long-term strategy? Will this competition ever really work? Do we know what "work" looks like (I mean for everyone, not just NZ).
-
@taniwharugby said in Super Rugby News:
@rotated there were numerous flaws with thier criteria and a convenient way of rating some of it for dropping the 2 teams, and as such the plan got rightly shafted.
IIRC Southland should have been dead certs to drop based on the criteria, that should have had them dead last, but somehow they were safe ranked about 9th, think after that it was Northland, Ta$man, Counties and maybe one other on the cusp who had varying 'criteria' that was for/against them.
Absolutely missing the point. It was decided that two teams needed to be moved from the top tier for the betterment of the NZ rugby as a whole. You can quibble on the criteria and what teams deserved a bullet (at least four did for various reasons). But once the decision was made for the benefit of the greater good to move towards a smaller top tier competition they needed to follow through.
The Rebels, Force and even Brumbies depending on how you weigh criteria all could be the team to go. Deciding none of them because there isn't an obvious candidate is not a solution.
@Chris-B. said in Super Rugby News:
@rotated I agree somewhat that it will surprise me if they manage to get rid of any teams - there's certainly no-one I've seen with their hand up saying pick me.
Every time Ta$man picked up the phone to get another cash infusion from the the NZRU in 06-08 they were pretty much begging for it. But as you say Ta$man really is a major success story and once the convoluted contracting structure got straightened out amongst other things they've been a real producer for NZ rugby. Never was a fan of Ta$man being contracted in '08 purely from a geographic perspective, but their financial performance was so egregious at the time they couldn't avoid it.
FWIW Northland and Southland were the best candidates from a redundancy, player quality and financial perspective.
Ultimately though things have worked out pretty well. The NPC is producing better talent, the Unions finances aren't as perilous and at least in the case of Northland we got a happy compromise where their fans got their wish of staying the the Mitre 10 Cup Competition and the NZRU got their wish of seeing them play Heartland-quality rugby for the next decade.
Not that any of that had to do with the main point which is, they've decided now do it even if it has to be Waratahs, Stormers and Bulls.
-
Kepu banned after multiple offences
Sekope Kepu has accepted that he should be further sanctioned by the SANZAAR Foul Play Review Committee following a hearing under SANZAAR Judicial Rule 6.1.
Kepu was issued a Warning by the Citing Commissioner during a Super Rugby Match at the weekend. That Warning was the Player's third offence after receiving Yellow Cards in Round 1 and Round 2.
The SANZAAR Judicial Rules in Section 8 of the Tournament Manual state:
6.1
A Player who has received three yellow cards or three Warnings (or any combination thereof) arising from matches in the same Super Rugby Competition shall be required to appear before the Foul Play Review Committee appointed for the Match during which he last offended.At the same time as notification of the details of his hearing pursuant to Rule 4.1, the Player shall be sent copies of the Match Officials' Reports in relation to each incident and be advised that the purpose of the hearing before the Foul Play Review Committee is to consider the circumstances in which each yellow card and/or Warning was imposed and determine whether any further penalty should be imposed on him by reason of his persistent foul play, or the matter referred to a full hearing, pursuant to Rule 7.
Kepu has been suspended from all forms of the game for one week, up to and including Friday, April 21. The Waratahs have a bye in Round 8, therefore Kepu will serve his suspension for his next scheduled match in Round 9.
Kepu was awarded a Yellow Card in Round 1, a Yellow Card in Round 2 and a Warning in Round 7.
The SANZAAR Foul Play Review Committee of Nigel Hampton QC (Chairman), Stephen Hardy and John Langford assessed the case.
In his finding, Foul Play Review Committee Chairman Nigel Hampton QC ruled the following: "The Foul Play Review Committee conducted a detailed review of all the available evidence on all 3 incidents, including video and additional evidence, as well as evidence from the player and submissions from his legal representative, Anthony Black SC."
"With respect to sanction the Foul Play Review Committee deemed that a one week sanction was appropriate due to a number of factors including the fact the Player had committed three qualifying offences in a relatively short period of time, the fact the Player was put on notice after receiving his second Yellow Card and the similarity of the offences committed by the Player in the first two Yellow Cards and the foul play aspect of the third.
"There were mitigating factors that were also considered which included the Player's excellent Judicial record spanning a long career and his early acceptance of the suspension.
"The player is therefore suspended for one week, up to and including the Waratahs next scheduled match on Friday, April 21.”
Post 1542 of 5207