All Blacks vs Springboks II
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@broughie said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@williethewaiter I hardly knew that Jacobson was on the park. What position was he playing?
Unfortunately that game produced more questions than answers as to our best combinations, still don’t know our best front row, back row, midfield or wings.
Was even shocked when I saw Rettalick looking around at first receiver while Brad Weber is battling for his life against half a dozen Boks! -
@dmx Boks had been able to turnover ball at the breakdown all game, but especially at the end of the game. Pin the Boks back into their territory and trust your defence, a defence which had shown it could force mistakes from the Boks.
Worst case scenario you give away a penalty around the 22m line which would likely result in a lineout between halfway and AB 22m. Instead of giving away a penalty on half way and having a lineout inside 22m to defend.
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@stodders said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@dmx Boks had been able to turnover ball at the breakdown all game, but especially at the end of the game. Pin the Boks back into their territory and trust your defence, a defence which had shown it could force mistakes from the Boks.
Worst case scenario you give away a penalty around the 22m line which would likely result in a lineout between halfway and AB 22m. Instead of giving away a penalty on half way and having a lineout inside 22m to defend.
Preaching to the converted.
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@dmx I think front row and midfield are probably the most problematic. Back row you have plenty of v good options. Just need to find the right balance.
ABs need an option in midfield that can bend the line. Or a wing that can be brought in off set piece to bend it 😊. ALB and Havili are too similar IMO. Both are play making centres. And outside Barrett or Mo'unga, there needs to be an option who can truck the ball up when required. Does NZ have anyone who fits that bill right now? A sledgehammer to complement the rapier 😬
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Rewatch 36 to 66.
ABs lineout better than Boks's in period!!!! Only miss Aumua throwing directly to Kitshoff and not to Patty T. BBBR jumping forced Bok miss at 36. Akira pressure another at 48. Akira took several in meantime (and beautiful one for Savea try).
Scrum slightly moving forward except first of H2, following Jordie (non-) forward pass. Bok TH twisted, which ref ruled Moody infringement. Wrong side for camera. Props looked bemused.
Ref's inconsisitency on tackle release directly caused the result. Not just BB at 38 (Faf never released), but also at 54:30 followng a period of AB pressure, when Etzebeth held on to Jordie and Marx given penalty. Huge swing.
Even worse, in next minute Kitshoff was about to be turned over 5m out from AB line and ABs penalised for... 'no clear release'!!! Led to penalty dead in front and 3.
At 50 Steyn 50/22 MASSIVE. Good LO/maul/momentum. Poor short side defence and Boks over. Also huge Steyn kick gain at 58.
Perhaps most damning, though, from 46 to 48 ABs hot on attack. Several recyclings but pattern of ball to BB and then Havili not aligned for backline move. BBBR couple of time gets pass with nowhere to go.
BUT NO OTHER TIGHTIES TO BE SEEN. FFS LJ and BB trying to bind and defend counter ruck???
Also at 66 RM gets ball but Bok fish hook cuts him off from rest of backline. Shepherded into pod of e.g. Marx/Kwagga/a lock.
Our backline alignment/interplay with forwards was non-existent?! And Boks had done homework.
Forwards always in wrong place and unavailable for cleanout. Was there no plan?
TBC...
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That was a great test match and hats off to the Boks who were good value for their victory. For the ABs, I thought Weber had a great first half. Backs were generally pretty good TBH, maybe Havili could have done a bit more. But it wasn't in the backs that the game was lost.
I said it already, and I'll say it again, when you have Aumua and Tuipulotu as replacements, you are in lineout trouble. The former just can't be depended on to throw, and the latter is just not a jumping lock. Probably cost us the game. The starting props were also kept on 5 minutes too long. Really missed Whitelock.
I don't like having a go at the match officials, and fair play to Carling for having the guts to whistle penalties at the end, but there bad calls both ways. The worst for mine though was Mpimpi being a good few metres offside on the kick chase, not spotted by anyone.
I don't think you can be too hard or disappointed in the ABs, the Boks are our major foe for a reason - they are also bloody good at rugby!
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@yeetyaah said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
I think other than selection blunders our glaring issue is tight 5. Our props are all kinda average-shit and our locking stocks aren't looking great without Whitelock. Retallick hasn't been as good since he left.
There are plenty of promising up and coming props, but if they are to be ready for 2023, they need to be in the first squad named next year.
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@chris said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
Fainganuku
I like his size and he is a good player but are they playing him that second five on a regular basis.? Havilli has played as best he can but are we advertising the position? 2nd five at least 110kg. I sure when Havilli plays for the Crusaders he will be locked into 2 five now so when will Fainganuku get a chance. Provincial rugby is not enough.
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@victor-meldrew agree. We have 2 older locks that might not be around by World Cup time so Foster missed an opportunity to use Vaia. Foster might land on his feet by having PT leave. There will be no reason to pick him.
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@canefan Cane coming back is like Retallick coming back. They are both getting older and should he just walk into the number 6? Let’s see how he goes first. He has had some many injuries and it’s taken a toll. I would rather focus on what we have that reminisce about the old glory days.
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@mikethesnow hard to implement a plan B when your forwards are getting owned
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@stodders said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@bones he certainly seemed to get swept up in the drama. Refs are only human, and I think this was his first Bok/AB game, no? Makes you appreciate how good Nigel Owens was to maintain his poise in the heat of these types of games.
Nah, these refs work their way up - but did anyone else see how nervous he looked before kickoff? He got so tired after the 30th minute that he stopped being able to see the most basic infringements. That suited the bokke way more than us - but to be fair the AR's were just as bad... what the fuck was the thinking on Mapimpi and the penalties before and after halftime? They are worse than shockers.
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@victor-meldrew , biggest problem with Patrick Tuipulotu he floats in and out of games his strength is his ball carrying , but is not a viable jumping option at lineout time had one or 2 carries and got a good turnover but apart from that despite having 40 minutes to impose himself was a disappointment.,really poor read in defence when caught in no mans land when the South African winger scored .
Have always thought Super Rugby is his ceiling , he’s had 40 appearances in the black jersey over 7 years and never imposed himself as high quality international lock .
Retallick whilst still quality looks a shadow of the player who was injured pre RWC ,still works himself to standstill but for some reason looks down on physicality.It’s a shame Scott Barrett got injured ,because he’s a worker, runs himself to standstill ,just discipline at times is an issue .I was hoping they would give Tupou Vaa’i a spot on the bench because he does offer genuine impact .
Outside Whitelock , Retallick,Barret and Vaa’i that’s our best locking options .
It’s quite thin when you think about it . -
@bones true, but he also called some that benefited NZ, like the Steyn tackle where he appeared to strip the ball in the tackle, but was then pinged for not rolling away.
I struggle to see how so many teams (not just the Boks) can be offside either on the kick-chase or wide out on defence, yet nobody ever seems to penalise them. A sure fire way to create space for attacking rugby is to stop defenders from taking up space illegally.
Ironically, it was the ABs who were pinged twice (I think) for being offside as they advanced too early.
