Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror
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@nta said in Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror:
@junior said in Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror:
People always talk about the simplicity of the plan, but I am staggered at how many things had to go right not just for one plane to hit the tower, but for two planes and then a third into a fucking pentagon! Think about all the things that had to go right not just on the day with 19 hi-jackers but also in the years leading up to it with everyone else involved and the flying lessons etc.
Aided to a minor degree by the dick-swinging going on in America's 18 security agencies.
It is frightening how badly their agencies seem to work together
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@canefan said in Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror:
@nta said in Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror:
@junior said in Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror:
People always talk about the simplicity of the plan, but I am staggered at how many things had to go right not just for one plane to hit the tower, but for two planes and then a third into a fucking pentagon! Think about all the things that had to go right not just on the day with 19 hi-jackers but also in the years leading up to it with everyone else involved and the flying lessons etc.
Aided to a minor degree by the dick-swinging going on in America's 18 security agencies.
It is frightening how badly their agencies seem to work together
The problem with political appointments is that the people you appoint may be political. The USA hasn’t operated a meritocracy for a very long time.
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@jc said in Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror:
@canefan said in Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror:
@nta said in Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror:
@junior said in Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror:
People always talk about the simplicity of the plan, but I am staggered at how many things had to go right not just for one plane to hit the tower, but for two planes and then a third into a fucking pentagon! Think about all the things that had to go right not just on the day with 19 hi-jackers but also in the years leading up to it with everyone else involved and the flying lessons etc.
Aided to a minor degree by the dick-swinging going on in America's 18 security agencies.
It is frightening how badly their agencies seem to work together
The problem with political appointments is that the people you appoint may be political. The USA hasn’t operated a meritocracy for a very long time.
Too busy point scoring to work for the greater good? They just don't seem to trust one another with intel, or don't think to pass on intel. Crazy
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Finished it. Man the frustration I felt at the sheer waste of it all.
You look back and think it would have been better if they'd simply sent in some highly covert specialists to clean house. Instead they just made things worse with almost every action. The US general at the end saying that there was all least some progress in Afghanistan... Borderline delusional. I don't think even he meant it.
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@jc said in Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror:
@canefan said in Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror:
@nta said in Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror:
@junior said in Turning Point 9/11 and the War on Terror:
People always talk about the simplicity of the plan, but I am staggered at how many things had to go right not just for one plane to hit the tower, but for two planes and then a third into a fucking pentagon! Think about all the things that had to go right not just on the day with 19 hi-jackers but also in the years leading up to it with everyone else involved and the flying lessons etc.
Aided to a minor degree by the dick-swinging going on in America's 18 security agencies.
It is frightening how badly their agencies seem to work together
The problem with political appointments is that the people you appoint may be political. The USA hasn’t operated a meritocracy for a very long time.
Most (not all) of their departments of state are headed by presidential appointments who either resign or get fired by a new president. While that seems weird to us, it does avoid the political issue of previous appointees not properly implementing the president's policies (or at least removes that as an excuse). It also sort of makes sense in that the president is the Head of the Civil Service, and they bring their team with them.
Presidents still normally attempt to find competence and experience on their side of the aisle, particularly in the law and order positions (eg FBI, CIA, NSA, armed forces, Attorney-General). The civil service that actually does the work is also permanent public servants like here - in theory the president can fire almost any of them, but in practice they haven't got time for that on a large scale. Not that it happened then, but a modern issue is also the furlough due to scraps over the budget. Furlough = unpaid leave while the civil service waits for Congress to approve a budget. Not surprisingly, that causes talent holes as quality public servants can't be bothered with that, and move on.
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I finally made good on my intent to explore some of the human interest angles of 9/11. I recently finished The Only Plane in the Sky: An Oral History of 9/11 by Garrett M. Graff. As with most things 9/11, it's a tough read, but even tougher to put the book down.
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