When should Foster go?
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@akan004 said in When should Foster go?:
@taniwharugby said in When should Foster go?:
think the point is he was kicking for the 5m lineout, that is the difficult part, but given how far out he was kicking from, he shouldnt have been going for that lower % play...irony is, if he had gone for say 10-15m out, he woulda put it into the 5m....
I know he has said that he is happy to take the risk and go for extra metres and if it doesn't come off then he can live with it. That's fine if we are in the lead or at least are in the game, however this was a crucial time in the game where we were well behind and needed to score. It was definitely not the time to take a risk. This team lacks rugby IQ and Mounga displayed that perfectly with that kick.
The point about rugby IQ is well made. There were things which were working, and some which weren't (including the bitch slapping) and the situation was crying out for a wise head to say, 'This is what they're/we're doing and this is what we need to do about it'.
At the moment doesn't seem to be Cane. Certainly in the backs Smith might be expected to have a say. My hunch is that ALB could be quite good, too.
Someone (Cane?) needed to be saying, 'Colesy/other pull your head in'.
On dealing with the rush defence, a VERY important point is that any response will involve mistakes. The rush is designed to deliver knock ons and penalties as the boundries are pushed to pierce it.
Most important is not to try and beat the rush within 40m of own line. The risk reward just isn't worth it. So, unless there is a huge hole, if we're 25m out from our own line we need to be looking to kick into oppo half. When there we CAN try some razzle dazzle.
One thing which seems important in unlocking the rush is some footwork. Running straight at teams like Pumas isn't productive and can be the opposite. But a bit of footwork and doubt sets in and some space results. For me, in Puma 2 ALB has to be at 12. And him being next to 10 might help with play selection, too.
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@canefan Cane SHOULD have plenty of support in Coles (I know, I know) Whitelock, Tuipulotu, Ardie, Smith, BB, ALB, Goodhue, Moody, even TJP (I know again) so there is no excuse there.
Fozzie has been criticized for his conservative approach and I do wonder if this has been a ploy that he thought would see him through to 2021 when he can start afresh with his new ideas/plans etc, this has obviously backfired.
With limited games, limited opposition, he has kinda followed through with Hansens stuff (as it is obvious he has) and no noticable difference in things from Hansen...so th eoptimist in me thinks this is how he has played his hand in 2020.
How he responds now though will be interesting, change it up for the final match, or stick with the same old and then start 2021 with a new approach (asummptions being made of course he has new ideas)
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@Hooroo said in When should Foster go?:
@Machpants said in When should Foster go?:
@Victor-Meldrew said in When should Foster go?:
He may have inherited a whole load of problems but he knew they were there when he took on the job. Key question for me is if he's the man to sort out the problems.
Give him until the end of the season to show if he's up to it.
Cool, one more game and he's gone
Even though we all know he needs to go, we should also probably know that he won't be sacked or stand down as Covid will be bandied about as an excuse in unsettled times and all that.
Before any tests were played, and as the test calendar started to take shape for the year. I thought to myself, this will be Fozzie 's best year. Will get off to a covid assisted good start that will paper over the cracks.
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@canefan said in When should Foster go?:
@pakman after the failure of 2007, it was decided that McCaw did not have enough supporting help and they developed their senior player group didn't they? Don't see Cane with much support out there
BB is notably doing a lot of talking out on the field, so there is one.
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@Kirwan said in When should Foster go?:
@canefan said in When should Foster go?:
@pakman after the failure of 2007, it was decided that McCaw did not have enough supporting help and they developed their senior player group didn't they? Don't see Cane with much support out there
BB is notably doing a lot of talking out on the field, so there is one.
SW is not a natural talker. And he was overtaken by Cane. I hope he hasn't got the pip
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@nostrildamus said in When should Foster go?:
@DMX said in When should Foster go?:
what kind of message are you sending to the next coaches.
That they need to win matches? That being selected to be head coach should be based on merit, and retained based on performance?
2 losses and your fired? I think any new coach will say first year I need to build , even Henry had that.
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Cane is still learning the art of referee management as well.
Gardner was well due for a 'you can't be serious' look the other night and you can see Cane desperately deciding whether to keep his mouth shut or not.
That penalty against JB was one of the most ludicrous things I have seen when viewed in isolation. Gardner was shit scared of the game flaring up so wasn't judging stuff fairly at that point. If anything he should have given Sanchez a dressing down for acting like a poofballer.
A smart captain would have said something like 'if that is how you are ruling then I assume that chargedowns are removed from this game then?' -
@canefan he does alot of talking for the Crusaders??
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@taniwharugby said in When should Foster go?:
@canefan he does alot of talking for the Crusaders??
Even when injured and was waterboy he was still talking. I don't know what canefan is talking about but he is incorrect.
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@Rapido said in When should Foster go?:
@Hooroo said in When should Foster go?:
@Machpants said in When should Foster go?:
@Victor-Meldrew said in When should Foster go?:
He may have inherited a whole load of problems but he knew they were there when he took on the job. Key question for me is if he's the man to sort out the problems.
Give him until the end of the season to show if he's up to it.
Cool, one more game and he's gone
Even though we all know he needs to go, we should also probably know that he won't be sacked or stand down as Covid will be bandied about as an excuse in unsettled times and all that.
Before any tests were played, and as the test calendar started to take shape for the year. I thought to myself, this will be Fozzie 's best year. Will get off to a covid assisted good start that will paper over the cracks.
I'm actually astonished at how bad we are going. Aussie will be kicking themselves they didn't win the Bled
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@Hooroo said in When should Foster go?:
@taniwharugby said in When should Foster go?:
@canefan he does alot of talking for the Crusaders??
Even when injured and was waterboy he was still talking. I don't know what canefan is talking about but he is incorrect.
Just spouting uninformed shit as usual mate, I mean come on its the fern!
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@DMX said in When should Foster go?:
@nostrildamus said in When should Foster go?:
@DMX said in When should Foster go?:
what kind of message are you sending to the next coaches.
That they need to win matches? That being selected to be head coach should be based on merit, and retained based on performance?
2 losses and your fired? I think any new coach will say first year I need to build , even Henry had that.
Two losses and a draw (as good as a loss - someone even mentioned that we "lost" the Lions series - we drew). So just two wins from 5 might be a better way to put it. With players that know how to win. Throw in his history of failure with the Chiefs, the lack of enthusiasm from both him and the players, a lack of obvious game plan (although @bones post above might contain one, as he said it isn't working - yet anyway). I guess the way they are playing doesn't inspire confidence in the leadership / management.
As a Blues supporter, I have been through this from corporate structure (management personnel) to the appointment of coaches. It can be turned around quite quickly with the right people.
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@canefan said in When should Foster go?:
@pakman after the failure of 2007, it was decided that McCaw did not have enough supporting help and they developed their senior player group didn't they? Don't see Cane with much support out there
Whitelock is vocal before LOs form
Patty T was instructing the forwards in the change sheds during half time
Barrett and Smith are doing a lot of communicating on field.
Add Cane to that and I think there is leadership support out there.
But when there is a new captain there’s an adjustment that all players need to make to try and find a balance between support and allowing Cane to find his feet.
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@DMX said in When should Foster go?:
@nostrildamus said in When should Foster go?:
@DMX said in When should Foster go?:
what kind of message are you sending to the next coaches.
That they need to win matches? That being selected to be head coach should be based on merit, and retained based on performance?
2 losses and your fired? I think any new coach will say first year I need to build , even Henry had that.
I don’t think you get any grace period when you are the “continuity” pick do you? Isn’t that the point?
If he wants credit from the last 8 years then there should be no need for a transition period of shit performances.
If instead there were problems he had identified over the last few years and is now trying to fix them, then what the fuck has he been doing the last few years as an assistant? I don’t buy that he would have been trying to fix things but was getting overruled by Hansen. Hansen endorsed him ages ago.
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@pukunui said in When should Foster go?:
If he wants credit from the last 8 years then there should be no need for a transition period of shit performances.
If instead there were problems he had identified over the last few years and is now trying to fix them, then what the fuck has he been doing the last few years as an assistant? I don’t buy that he would have been trying to fix things but was getting overruled by Hansen. Hansen endorsed him ages ago.Theory One: Foster, Hansen & co were focussed on papering over the cracks/slowing the slide to get us over the line in RWC2019 and knew there were major challenges after that
Theory Two: Foster is an outstanding No. 2 who makes a good-ish coach look great, but a crap No. 1. (See this in business a lot)
Theory Three: Foster's just crap.
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@DMX 2 losses and a draw out of 5 is not a great AB record.
Against a weakened Wallabies with a new coach and Argentina playing away from home it is atrocious.
Plus throw in a lost RWC, loss to Ireland... etc.. etc.. while he was in the coaching setup.They paid big bucks to get the team performing. You won't get two years as a corporate exec with a record like this. And the ABs are a nation-sized business.
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@Snowy said in When should Foster go?:
@DMX said in When should Foster go?:
@nostrildamus said in When should Foster go?:
@DMX said in When should Foster go?:
what kind of message are you sending to the next coaches.
That they need to win matches? That being selected to be head coach should be based on merit, and retained based on performance?
2 losses and your fired? I think any new coach will say first year I need to build , even Henry had that.
Two losses and a draw (as good as a loss - someone even mentioned that we "lost" the Lions series - we drew). So just two wins from 5 might be a better way to put it. With players that know how to win. Throw in his history of failure with the Chiefs, the lack of enthusiasm from both him and the players, a lack of obvious game plan (although @bones post above might contain one, as he said it isn't working - yet anyway). I guess the way they are playing doesn't inspire confidence in the leadership / management.
As a Blues supporter, I have been through this from corporate structure (management personnel) to the appointment of coaches. It can be turned around quite quickly with the right people.
True 2.5 losses not great ( though you could argue Ozzie loss a dead rubber ) but NZR already chose him so I don't think you can fire him after a year based on his qualifications when they were good enough when they hired him. Fozzie wouldn't have been my choice either but think it reflects even worse on NZR to fire him a year in. 3rd loss might change the calculus though.
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@nostrildamus said in When should Foster go?:
@DMX 2 losses and a draw out of 5 is not a great AB record.
Against a weakened Wallabies with a new coach and Argentina playing away from home it is atrocious.
Plus throw in a lost RWC, loss to Ireland... etc.. etc.. while he was in the coaching setup.They paid big bucks to get the team performing. You won't get two years as a corporate exec with a record like this. And the ABs are a nation-sized business.
So the Argies should never be able to play well enough to be beat ABs?
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@nostrildamus said in When should Foster go?:
@DMX 2 losses and a draw out of 5 is not a great AB record.
Against a weakened Wallabies with a new coach and Argentina playing away from home it is atrocious.
Plus throw in a lost RWC, loss to Ireland... etc.. etc.. while he was in the coaching setup.They paid big bucks to get the team performing. You won't get two years as a corporate exec with a record like this. And the ABs are a nation-sized business.
Not true. Plenty of execs survive periods of falling share prices, shareholder revolts, massive profit downgrades, poor performance and even allegations of mismanagement!
I think most believed this was going to be a rollercoaster and the results certainly reflect that. Difficult first outing and then bounce back with a 20 point win the following week. Then another massive win followed by a loss.
Now another loss and all of a sudden we have IMO the most important test of the year for a bunch of reasons coming up.
Bring it on.
