All Blacks v Wallabies at Eden Park.
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@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks v Wallabies at Eden Park.:
"I'll give BB benefit of the doubt due to illness but my fear of him not taking control in this type of game came to fruition. I understand the argument that he didm't get much ball to use but that could also mean that he didn't impose himself and demand it (as DC would have done in the past."
Comical post. I reckon he should have charged into the rucks and mauls (maybe lineouts and scrums too) to get his hands on the ball. Just watching that first half I'm at a loss as to what he was supposed to have done to take control. Oh yeah, he should have demanded more ball and run to the line. Or something...
RS, I'm sure you understand the game better than that.
As a 10 it is part of your job description to take control because you are in a prime position to influence. I haven't watched the game again and maybe you are correct regarding the lack of opportunities to take control that he had. It may even be the way the ABs now play that they aren't putting that traditional 'generalship' on the 10. I just know that usually if you are in an arm wrestle game the 10 should be looking to demand the ball whenever available and start directing the way things are going. Cruden's execution may have been poor at times but he immediately started looking to put the ball into spaces and change things up.
I just expect to see more game direction from a 10.
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@Crucial said in All Blacks v Wallabies at Eden Park.:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks v Wallabies at Eden Park.:
"I'll give BB benefit of the doubt due to illness but my fear of him not taking control in this type of game came to fruition. I understand the argument that he didm't get much ball to use but that could also mean that he didn't impose himself and demand it (as DC would have done in the past."
Comical post. I reckon he should have charged into the rucks and mauls (maybe lineouts and scrums too) to get his hands on the ball. Just watching that first half I'm at a loss as to what he was supposed to have done to take control. Oh yeah, he should have demanded more ball and run to the line. Or something...
RS, I'm sure you understand the game better than that.
As a 10 it is part of your job description to take control because you are in a prime position to influence. I haven't watched the game again and maybe you are correct regarding the lack of opportunities to take control that he had. It may even be the way the ABs now play that they aren't putting that traditional 'generalship' on the 10. I just know that usually if you are in an arm wrestle game the 10 should be looking to demand the ball whenever available and start directing the way things are going. Cruden's execution may have been poor at times but he immediately started looking to put the ball into spaces and change things up.
I just expect to see more game direction from a 10.
Again, could you please explain when and how he was supposed to have done this. They had fark all ball when he was on the park and the game opened up a shit load more after he was gone. I can't see what Carter would have done differently (other than kick goals of course) unless his very presence would have magically given the abs more possession.
This criticism is absolutely ridiculous. The abs were attacking pretty well when they had the pill. The issues were in defence and in tight. How Barrett was supposed to be the man to take control and fix that is beyond me.
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@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks v Wallabies at Eden Park.:
@Crucial said in All Blacks v Wallabies at Eden Park.:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks v Wallabies at Eden Park.:
"I'll give BB benefit of the doubt due to illness but my fear of him not taking control in this type of game came to fruition. I understand the argument that he didm't get much ball to use but that could also mean that he didn't impose himself and demand it (as DC would have done in the past."
Comical post. I reckon he should have charged into the rucks and mauls (maybe lineouts and scrums too) to get his hands on the ball. Just watching that first half I'm at a loss as to what he was supposed to have done to take control. Oh yeah, he should have demanded more ball and run to the line. Or something...
RS, I'm sure you understand the game better than that.
As a 10 it is part of your job description to take control because you are in a prime position to influence. I haven't watched the game again and maybe you are correct regarding the lack of opportunities to take control that he had. It may even be the way the ABs now play that they aren't putting that traditional 'generalship' on the 10. I just know that usually if you are in an arm wrestle game the 10 should be looking to demand the ball whenever available and start directing the way things are going. Cruden's execution may have been poor at times but he immediately started looking to put the ball into spaces and change things up.
I just expect to see more game direction from a 10.
Again, could you please explain when and how he was supposed to have done this. They had fark all ball when he was on the park and the game opened up a shit load more after he was gone. I can't see what Carter would have done differently (other than kick goals of course) unless his very presence would have magically given the abs more possession.
This criticism is absolutely ridiculous. The abs were attacking pretty well when they had the pill. The issues were in defence and in tight. How Barrett was supposed to be the man to take control and fix that is beyond me.
Which part of this did you not understand?
"I haven't watched the game again and maybe you are correct regarding the lack of opportunities to take control that he had."
When I get the chance I'll have another watch and get back to you.
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OK. I'm just going to leave it at 'he was not on his game', guessing it was due to the ear infection.
I just watched through the first 20 minutes and no wonder his touch count was down. He barely ever put himself at first receiver, was either positioned on the short side or someone else was coming into the line. On turnover ball he wasn't getting his hands on it as he seemed to have been dropping back to fullback when the Convicts had the ball. Most of the time he wasn't anywhere near the vicinity of the ruck.
On ALBs try he was skip passed and I don't know if it was a called move but he certainly called Dagg across to first receiver and held back out of the line. TJP either faked dumbness or didn't know the call as he looked first to Dagg's wing to see it empty.
None of this backs up my call that he didn't 'take control' but he also didn't get involved as much as he could have when we did have the ball so maybe it was a tactical ploy, maybe he just wasn't feeling up to it. It wasn't because he lack any chance to get involved. -
Just want to add my tuppence worth on the DHP thing. I'm not sure why a few people are saying there was no way Savea was going to catch Speight.
It may have been unlikely, but far from impossible IMO. Savea is hardly slow, and as Coles showed it wouldn't have been the only time in the game someone well in front was run down on the way to the try line, would it?
And if Speight was on such a sure thing there was absolutely no reason for DHP to get involved at all. If he'd just stopped and cheered Speight on the try would have stood
Anyway it's academic now. The ref called it as he saw it and it was stupid to give him a reason to look.
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Just to add if BB had an ear infection he shouldn't have been kicking.
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I love it when the Aussies lose, they just look to deflect away from how shit they really are. Its the ref, its the AB's that have changed the laws, its the NZR run world rugby, its the media, its the aliens that are invading, the grass was too green, the ball had too many dimples on it than normal. Cheika is a F******* clown the paper got it right. And by the way how can you respect a team or a coach when they react like this.
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But on Sunday, Hansen softened his stance and extended an olive branch to Cheika for the good of rugby in Australasia.
"For a long time the relationship with Australia has probably been a little frosty and maybe we need to sit down and have a beer together and sort it out," Hansen told Australian reporters, describing the Wallabies as a "formidable opponent" and important ally.
"But I think some of it comes down to the fact that the Bledisloe Cup means so much to both teams and when one team's having a dominant period like we're at the moment, the other team really gets frustrated.
Steve Hanson says Cheika needs to be 'bigger' than what the media is betraying him as.
"It's how you deal with those frustrations and how you handle yourself when you're winning, I guess, is important.
"This week we've tried to play a pretty straight bat and not tried to aggravate anyone. Our media didn't help with the clown thing but that's the media. It's not us.
"But at the same time you've got to look at your own history and your own backyard and there's been plenty of people who've had a crack at (former All Blacks captain Richie) McCaw and so forth."
Hansen said he had empathy for Cheika.
"I lost 10 tests in a row with Wales and it was tough. Of course you get hurt by it," he said.
"It's how you deal with the adversity that's important." -
Interesting to see the same cabbal of NZ journos are out in force today on Twitter pumping Cheika's tires big time.
It is the same group that were saying NZ fans were myopic after saying Hansen or Jones should have got coach of the year over Cheika.
Not sure what he has over them, I can only imagine their reaction if Andrew McFadden had been carrying on like this with the Warriors - they would have brutalised him.
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@Donsteppa Funny , I never heard Kaefer complaining about Scotland game at the World Cup!
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@Samurai-Jack said in All Blacks v Wallabies at Eden Park.:
Wow! Cheika is having a meltdown! He has basically lost the plot ...
I've come to the conclusion that he never had the plot to begin with ...
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The Herald cartoon was low class and unfunny, and the disallowed try could have gone either way, but Cheika needs to shut up. His team didn't lose by less than 7. They got pumped by the AB's in the second half because the AB's are fitter and the reserves are a cut above.
When you've only won a few games all year, you need to look a lot closer to home than the opposition country's media (who are actually pretty rubbish on the whole). And as for the humility thing, oh FFS. Newsflash, cupcake, acting like a lollie-deprived toddler does not endear you to anyone. I've heard plenty of generous words from Read and Hansen, despite their being not a lot to praise.
I quite like Cheika's passion, and he's done good things with the team in the past. But the last few days has been an epic failure for him, and utterly unworthy of an international coach.
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Hansen said he would like the Aussies to come into the changing rooms after for a beer, said there is an open invitation but they never take it nor do they get invited into the Aussies.
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I'm no fan of the herald but I hope next time they come back they do something similar, its not as if the aussie media and union haven't done similar things many many times before and worse. Whats pretty clear is they don't seem to like it in return, do any of you remember the time the NSWRU got a ground announcer fired for calling the Tahds "sheep rooters"? Thats a ground announcer yet a couple of years earlier they were doing the same thing to us on prime time tv.
Tldr? Fuck em, they had this coming.
How do I make this my avatar?
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@Crucial said in All Blacks v Wallabies at Eden Park.:
Away from the sideshows and hopefully to generate discussion other than Cheika, I did think that the Wobs gave a taste of what we can expect from a firing opposition and showed up all of my pre-match concerns.
Imagine you are Eddie Jones and there was an England/AB test on this EOYT. You'd be following the same game plan with a better coached team and better personnel. You'd be running big munters up the guts to get over the gain line. Be looking at targeting our midfield for easy bending. Would be pulling out every scrum trick in the book (as we still sometime come across as bewildered with some of the rulings that go against us). With Farrell kicking they would be keeping pressure on a lot more than Oz did.
I'll give BB benefit of the doubt due to illness but my fear of him not taking control in this type of game came to fruition. I understand the argument that he didm't get much ball to use but that could also mean that he didn't impose himself and demand it (as DC would have done in the past).
I also find it funny how before the match everyone was bitching about Julian's selection and afterward voting for him in MOTM votes. He did exactly the thing I wanted to see him there to do. A Lomu-esque run to break the game open. I haven't seen Naholo do that.I voted for Savea as MotM but still prefer Naholo. In the game Savea made all sorts of basic fundamental errors - the missed tackle on Speight stood out. It's just that Savea turned around in the second half and did things no one else in the team could do. Problem is that Savea hasn't been consistently playing as well as he had been in that ten minute period.
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Though, as another journo here wrote yesterday: this is a far bigger story in Australia than "Wallabies lose again" and so Rugby is probably gaining profile it otherwise wouldn't.
Not many people in the msm are writing about the record here (because why should they?)
Cheika put the focus on the respect thing with his comments.
The problem with that is it perpetuates the clickbait media style.
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So is all the constant claims of the ABs being cheats not also disrespectful? IMO calling someone a cheat is worse than calling them a clown, I call my son a clown all the time.
That's not at you NTA
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The UK media have all gone down the track of 'the ABs always get favourable calls from the officials and Australia were robbed' while describing the incident with so called facts that are actually just opinions. Also quick to point out that the officials got the Coles call correct (even though that was also contentious).
The rugby press over here is quite funny though. There is a real underlying theme of making excuses before their team has even done anything. They have been incredibly pessimistic about the recent injuries to squad members (even when they haven't been to first choice players), have been busy pointing out the 'hoodoo' against South Africa (although I must admit I didn't realise they hadn't beaten them in 10 years), pumping the Saffies up big time as if they are currently a massive force and laying down a foundation of bullshit to build on when the ABs finally play them.
I guess now McCaw has gnu they need a new target and it is now the complicity of the world's reffing fraternity. -
@DMX said in All Blacks v Wallabies at Eden Park.:
@Donsteppa Funny , I never heard Kaefer complaining about Scotland game at the World Cup!
It's all good though. Next time Kafer makes an alleged mistake in the commentary box he'll never be allowed to call another game of rugby in his life...
