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@gibbon-rib said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@antipodean said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@gibbon-rib said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
Ok, so in that case there was a sign asking you to tell the staff. Sometimes there is a form they ask you to fill in. I've had to fill in forms for an x-ray where it asked if I was pregnant. (I wasn't).
Do you think I should have been offended by that form? Should I have refused to fill in that question?
Why would I care what you did?
Same reason you seem to care a lot what this bloke did?
But I don't. That should be obvious. What I'm motivated enough to comment on is that an organisation that relies on goodwill for donations insisted a person for whom the question clearly doesn't apply answer it or they'd turn him away. All in the interests of satisfying a tiny percentage of people who probably don't give blood anyway.
If I'd returned the form and told them that I refuse to answer some questions on principle because I don't think they're applicable, the staff would have rolled their eyes and thought I was being incredibly obtuse and an absolute dick.
Edit: and in case you're thinking they'd still give me the x-ray anyway, yes they probably would, but providing a medical service isn't the same as accepting a donation. I'm sure they're processing hundreds of donations a day in the blood centre, they probably wouldn't have time or patience for dealing with outrage seekers who refuse to answer some questions because they're offended by a form
I don't recall seeing public appeals for more people to have unnecessary medical procedures, I do know the Red Cross routinely asks for donations when stocks are low.
Yup, but they've still got to follow process like collecting details of donor's medical status etc.
There's no requirement to insist upon a process that makes no sense and is counterproductive.
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You guys really are jumping at shadows. Do you see trans activist conspiracies in everything?
Maybe the staff would have happily ticked the box on the form for this guy if he'd asked politely (maybe he did, maybe he didn't, we have no idea). Maybe he just asked a busy nurse who was trying to help someone else "Do I have to complete the question about being pregnant" and she just said "Just answer them all please." Who knows? This guy was clearly offended by it for whatever reason, we don't know how it went down in the clinic.
But then when it gets weird is after he leaves - presumably he contacts a newspaper, and they've got outrage-junkies desperate for a hit so they run with it, put in a few vague lines suggesting that it is somehow connected to a woke agenda (the word "inclusiveness" seems to be an excellent trigger). Next thing you know, people are imagining that the SBTS are so terrified of these trans-activity boogeymen and boogeywomen and boogeynonbinaries that they're turning donors away because they're terrified that someone will report them to the Trans Gestapo because they ticked a box on behalf of an old dude.
@antipodean said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@gibbon-rib said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@antipodean said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@gibbon-rib said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
Ok, so in that case there was a sign asking you to tell the staff. Sometimes there is a form they ask you to fill in. I've had to fill in forms for an x-ray where it asked if I was pregnant. (I wasn't).
Do you think I should have been offended by that form? Should I have refused to fill in that question?
Why would I care what you did?
Same reason you seem to care a lot what this bloke did?
But I don't. That should be obvious. What I'm motivated enough to comment on is that an organisation that relies on goodwill for donations insisted a person for whom the question clearly doesn't apply answer it or they'd turn him away. All in the interests of satisfying a tiny percentage of people who probably don't give blood anyway.
If I'd returned the form and told them that I refuse to answer some questions on principle because I don't think they're applicable, the staff would have rolled their eyes and thought I was being incredibly obtuse and an absolute dick.
Edit: and in case you're thinking they'd still give me the x-ray anyway, yes they probably would, but providing a medical service isn't the same as accepting a donation. I'm sure they're processing hundreds of donations a day in the blood centre, they probably wouldn't have time or patience for dealing with outrage seekers who refuse to answer some questions because they're offended by a form
I don't recall seeing public appeals for more people to have unnecessary medical procedures, I do know the Red Cross routinely asks for donations when stocks are low.
Yup, but they've still got to follow process like collecting details of donor's medical status etc.
There's no requirement to insist upon a process that makes no sense and is counterproductive.
Processes don't come more simple and sensible and productive than "ask the donors to complete a form".
I'm sure they've always had people refusing to answer some questions for a whole bunch of reasons. Fat lady says "Are you asking if I'm pregnant because I'm fat?" The town mayor says "Do I look like someone who injects drugs?" Vicar's wife says "How dare you ask if I've had unprotected anal recently"
Some are easy to answer, and others would be harder. Maybe the staff are allowed to use discretion, if they have the time and someone asks nicely. Quite likely someone decided that the most sensible and productive way to deal with them all is just to ask all volunteers to complete all the questions on the form.
Doesn't seem worth it to spend loads of time and energy on trying to placate the tiny percentage who are so desperate to be offended that they'll find a way no matter what.
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@gibbon-rib said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
You guys really are jumping at shadows. Do you see trans activist conspiracies in everything?
Maybe the staff would have happily ticked the box on the form for this guy if he'd asked politely (maybe he did, maybe he didn't, we have no idea). Maybe he just asked a busy nurse who was trying to help someone else "Do I have to complete the question about being pregnant" and she just said "Just answer them all please." Who knows? This guy was clearly offended by it for whatever reason, we don't know how it went down in the clinic.
But then when it gets weird is after he leaves - presumably he contacts a newspaper, and they've got outrage-junkies desperate for a hit so they run with it, put in a few vague lines suggesting that it is somehow connected to a woke agenda (the word "inclusiveness" seems to be an excellent trigger). Next thing you know, people are imagining that the SBTS are so terrified of these trans-activity boogeymen and boogeywomen and boogeynonbinaries that they're turning donors away because they're terrified that someone will report them to the Trans Gestapo because they ticked a box on behalf of an old dude.
@antipodean said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@gibbon-rib said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@antipodean said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@gibbon-rib said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
Ok, so in that case there was a sign asking you to tell the staff. Sometimes there is a form they ask you to fill in. I've had to fill in forms for an x-ray where it asked if I was pregnant. (I wasn't).
Do you think I should have been offended by that form? Should I have refused to fill in that question?
Why would I care what you did?
Same reason you seem to care a lot what this bloke did?
But I don't. That should be obvious. What I'm motivated enough to comment on is that an organisation that relies on goodwill for donations insisted a person for whom the question clearly doesn't apply answer it or they'd turn him away. All in the interests of satisfying a tiny percentage of people who probably don't give blood anyway.
If I'd returned the form and told them that I refuse to answer some questions on principle because I don't think they're applicable, the staff would have rolled their eyes and thought I was being incredibly obtuse and an absolute dick.
Edit: and in case you're thinking they'd still give me the x-ray anyway, yes they probably would, but providing a medical service isn't the same as accepting a donation. I'm sure they're processing hundreds of donations a day in the blood centre, they probably wouldn't have time or patience for dealing with outrage seekers who refuse to answer some questions because they're offended by a form
I don't recall seeing public appeals for more people to have unnecessary medical procedures, I do know the Red Cross routinely asks for donations when stocks are low.
Yup, but they've still got to follow process like collecting details of donor's medical status etc.
There's no requirement to insist upon a process that makes no sense and is counterproductive.
Processes don't come more simple and sensible and productive than "ask the donors to complete a form".
I'm sure they've always had people refusing to answer some questions for a whole bunch of reasons. Fat lady says "Are you asking if I'm pregnant because I'm fat?" The town mayor says "Do I look like someone who injects drugs?" Vicar's wife says "How dare you ask if I've had unprotected anal recently"
Some are easy to answer, and others would be harder. Maybe the staff are allowed to use discretion, if they have the time and someone asks nicely. Quite likely someone decided that the most sensible and productive way to deal with them all is just to ask all volunteers to complete all the questions on the form.
Doesn't seem worth it to spend loads of time and energy on trying to placate the tiny percentage who are so desperate to be offended that they'll find a way no matter what.
It's amazing the lengths you'll go to to create your own narrative rather than dealing with what was actually contained in the article. You've contradicted yourself and introduced enough red herrings to feed a small African nation.
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Mate, I've contradicted myself exactly zero times, and I've gone off the article as it was written (and the various replies).
I've speculated on a few things, because the article was very light on detail, but I've been pretty clear about where I've done that, and I reckon ive been pretty reasonable. Zero red herrings.
There's plenty of genuinely ludicrous shit going on in the world that we could be talking about, without needing to invent things
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@gibbon-rib said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
Mate, I've contradicted myself exactly zero times, and I've gone off the article as it was written (and the various replies).
https://www.forum.thesilverfern.com/post/731124 says otherwise. You also implied the form hadn't changed when it was clearly explained it had and the reason for its change, quoted from the director of the Scottish National Blood Transfusion Service.
I've speculated on a few things, because the article was very light on detail, but I've been pretty clear about where I've done that, and I reckon ive been pretty reasonable. Zero red herrings.
You've invented a narrative as sympathetic as possible to your point of view. At no point did you entertain the equal probability that a long term donor simply said he wasn't prepared to answer a question that obviously didn't apply and some officious staff responded that if he didn't, he couldn't give blood.
Now ask yourself who is the loser in this scenario.
There's plenty of genuinely ludicrous shit going on in the world that we could be talking about, without needing to invent things
But tellingly you aren't...
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Well, this has been one of the more bizarre discussions I've had for quite a while. Still, it's been fun, and I've learned something. The Parable Of The Generic Medical Form And The Attention Seeking Moron will stay with me for some time.
I will follow Castogrand's advice and move on
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I'm struggling to see what's worth getting so upset about.
I think we all agree the guys is over reacting and going to the media is more than a touch absurd.
We just disagree with how the Scots NHS dealt with it.
You think they've been fantastic and shouldn't deal with this stuff, I think they should blow it off and move on and get what they desperately need.
Thats kind of it really.
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@MajorRage said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
ticked it for him
Would that not be a huge no no that could result in them getting their arses kicked?
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@Bones said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@MajorRage said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
ticked it for him
Would that not be a huge no no that could result in them getting their arses kicked?
Well he made it clear that he can't answer the question .. therefore some assistance was required.
I always thought taxes were paid for assistance,
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This post is deleted!
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@MajorRage said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
I always thought taxes were paid for assistance,
Sure but medical forms usually need someone to also sign the form if they're filling it in for you don't they?
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@antipodean Trying not to respond with something inflammatory!
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@Bones said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@MajorRage said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
I always thought taxes were paid for assistance,
Sure but medical forms usually need someone to also sign the form if they're filling it in for you don't they?
Dunno mate honestly.
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@MajorRage said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@Bones said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@MajorRage said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
I always thought taxes were paid for assistance,
Sure but medical forms usually need someone to also sign the form if they're filling it in for you don't they?
Dunno mate honestly.
Well you could ask your butler who fills them out for you?
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@Tim said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@antipodean Trying not to respond with something inflammatory!
How about unelectable?
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@gibbon-rib said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@Victor-Meldrew said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@gibbon-rib said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@Victor-Meldrew said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
@gibbon-rib said in F off with the damn PC Brigade:
If I'd returned the form and told them that I refuse to answer some questions on principle because I don't think they're applicable, the staff would have rolled their eyes and thought I was being incredibly obtuse and an absolute dick.
So much for "inclusiveness" by hospital staff then, eh?
Eh?
If the hospital staff rolled their eyes and thought you a complete dick because you took exception to obviously dumb questions, they are the ones with the problem - not you.
Checking if someone is pregnant before an x-ray is a bloody important question. If I saw that on a form I wouldn't think it was dumb, I'd just know that it was intended for other people. And then I'd tick "No" and be completely unoffended by it.
It's been happening for decades. Why are people now suddenly getting outraged about it? Do they need to make different versions of every form, so that men or post-menopausal women, or the infertile, don't get offended? That really would be ludicrous.
I thought you blokes were generally against absurd outrage over trivial things
They really just need to put 'n/a' as an option. But that might imply men can't get pregnant, which goes against what the Trans activists believe so might not be "inclusive" enough.
Nobody wins when organisations try to pander to extremists.
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He could have died.
F off with the damn PC Brigade