Coronavirus - Australia
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@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - Australia:
hi all
late to the party, but why exactly did Novax get kicked out? is it for the apparent mis-truths on his forms? or the fact he isn't jabbed? or the fact he's a bit of a weird fluffybunny? or a combination of the 3
i just want to know who to direct my derision at.
You can heap derision on everyone involved. That's the best thing about it.
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@crucial said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@kiwiwomble said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@mariner4life pretty sure the official reason was the form stuff
Seemed to get in a tangle that could only be 'fixed' by Minister's perogative.
- Officials told Tennis Oz that contracting Covid was NOT a valid condition for exemption
- They went ahead and got a second opinion then told Novax that he could come
- At the border they said he didn't have valid exemption, he argued that he did according to the advice provided by Tennis Oz and Victoria.
- First judge said that he arrived in good faith based on info provided and that 'experts' deemed he wasn't a risk so could stay.
- The Minister stepped in and said he couldn't.
- He appealed.
- Next set of judges said Minister has the right by law to order him out.
- The end.
Still staggers me that people believe that crossing a sovereign border is a right.
From my reading, the judge wasn't actually ruling on this, he was only ruling on the procedure, and the border dept stuffed up the timing of his punting.
As I've mentioned previously the judge seems pretty suss in this, I'm pretty sure other visitors to Oz don't get a judge saying they should be provided with facilities to do their work while they're not even officially approved to be in the country.
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@nepia said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@crucial said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@kiwiwomble said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@mariner4life pretty sure the official reason was the form stuff
Seemed to get in a tangle that could only be 'fixed' by Minister's perogative.
- Officials told Tennis Oz that contracting Covid was NOT a valid condition for exemption
- They went ahead and got a second opinion then told Novax that he could come
- At the border they said he didn't have valid exemption, he argued that he did according to the advice provided by Tennis Oz and Victoria.
- First judge said that he arrived in good faith based on info provided and that 'experts' deemed he wasn't a risk so could stay.
- The Minister stepped in and said he couldn't.
- He appealed.
- Next set of judges said Minister has the right by law to order him out.
- The end.
Still staggers me that people believe that crossing a sovereign border is a right.
From my reading, the judge wasn't actually ruling on this, he was only ruling on the procedure, and the border dept stuffed up the timing of his punting.
Correct. He was denied procedural fairness by inept public servants.
As I've mentioned previously the judge seems pretty suss in this, I'm pretty sure other visitors to Oz don't get a judge saying they should be provided with facilities to do their work while they're not even officially approved to be in the country.
As to the second judgement, they only looked at whether the minister could make that determination lawfully, not the worth of it.
As it stands, he made a false declaration and that should've been sufficient to tell him to fuck off.
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Frankly, it's now pointless arguing over whether or not the authorities response to covid is right or wrong.
There is a lot to be gained by looking back at what people went through and position that with what the current situation is.
For my whole life, the phrase "lest we forget" was a cornerstone to life in NZ and Aus.
Surely it's still a relevant phrase to gauge how freedoms come about.
This doco is a reminder (and a lesson for those not nearby) of what some people in Melbourne went through. (If you don't agree with the commentary, you must acknowledge the video footage)
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From The Telegraph:
The Australian Lawyers’ Alliance issued a statement that the deporting of Djokovic reflected less the toughness of the nation’s border laws than their arbitrariness. Greg Barnes SC, the group’s spokesman, said: “One of the most dangerous aspects of the Djokovic matter is the preparedness of the federal government to deem someone a risk to public order simply on the basis of what it perceives that person’s views might be. This is Orwellian and it is deeply troubling in a society supposedly committed to freedom of speech and freedom of thought”.
“Orwellian” is right. For almost two years now, Australia has coined some of the cruellest policies ever concocted in the name of public health. Families have been separated indefinitely across the oceans, expatriates have been threatened with prison if they dared return to their own country, while Melbourne’s 262 days of lockdown were symbolised by the sight of a homeless woman on a park bench surrounded by eight police officers. The complication is that while these excesses provoke horror in the outside world, they are endorsed by most here. Mark McGowan, premier of Western Australia, has kept his borders slammed shut even to neighbouring states for 22 months and is feted as a hero.
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well, i managed to stay away from the vast majority of the news the last few weeks. Got most of it through messenger.
Seems cases are really fucking high, but hospitalisations, and especially ICU numbers are really low? Seems like the vaccine, and the vaccination rates are doing their part?
Qld is very open. International borders to follow in the very near future i believe
Tassie was pretty quiet. Quite a few tourists, but nothing packed. And it seems the locals are staying home (for instance while the first couple of days of the test were sold out, only around 9,000 or so actually showed up). Still need a test to get in i think.
Here in Cairns the close/casual contact rules smashed workforces after all teh young people caught it between Christmas and NY. Seems to be a heavy flu for a couple of days and that's it.
Interesting times but are we actually nearing the end? Suggestions that it may be peaking in NSW and Vic and even SA?
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@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - Australia:
Seems cases are really fucking high, but hospitalisations, and especially ICU numbers are really low? Seems like the vaccine, and the vaccination rates are doing their part?
That's what I'm thinking. The problem is even a low percentage of cases going to hospital is a problem - where healthcare workers are isolating, it's a bigger problem.
I've seen anecdotal evidence that hospitals are getting smashed and other stories that the hospitals have plenty of beds but limited staff.
And of course there are silly fluffybunnies turning up to ER with very mild symptoms, who could probably fuck off ayway.
We then get into the "how severe is your Covid in terms of your ability to continue being an ICU nurse?"
That's the key bit - the pointy end is still dangerous for those that get there, on respirators etc, if there aren't enough staff to keep things ticking along.
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@bovidae said in Coronavirus - Australia:
Tiley should resign for starters. I expect that Djokovic will also now sue TA.
I don't think he'll sue. What were costs, a few hundred K? Compared to the public reaction of him being more of a tool? End of the day, he and his agent had a massive role to play in this, I reckon he'll want to sweep it under the carpet
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@nta said in Coronavirus - Australia:
The problem is even a low percentage of cases going to hospital is a problem - where healthcare workers are isolating, it's a bigger problem.
Yeah before let's say 1000 infected from delta, 75 go to hospital, 10 in ICU and 1 dies....moronic infects 5000 people, 75 got to hospital, 10 in ICU 1 dies...problem is those extra 4000 people feeling a bit shit, off work, self isolating or whatever, that's where the problem is...
My numbers are made up.
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From what I can tell from those working in the field
The biggest toll is on ambos as terrified people ring ambulances for.mild symptoms because they've been convinced covid=death. So the ambos are just getting smashed.
And considering the ramping levels at zero covid I can only imagine what a clusterfuck that has been.
Also people testing positive and immediately social-media posting their every whereabouts for the last week imploring people to get tested.
People are idiots. Although people have been gaslit in to this
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@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - Australia:
From what I can tell from those working in the field
The biggest toll is on ambos as terrified people ring ambulances for.mild symptoms because they've been convinced covid=death. So the ambos are just getting smashed.
And considering the ramping levels at zero covid I can only imagine what a clusterfuck that has been.
Also people testing positive and immediately social-media posting their every whereabouts for the last week imploring people to get tested.
People are idiots. Although people have been gaslit in to this
Pretty much this though isn't it?
To get people onboard they had to oversell it and now it feels like people took that and made the 'safety for others' part of their belief system. I actually study this kind of shit (when I'm actually doing what they pay me for for) and find it really fascinating and scary at the same time. Unwinding it will be a bit of fun.
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@voodoo said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@bovidae said in Coronavirus - Australia:
Tiley should resign for starters. I expect that Djokovic will also now sue TA.
I don't think he'll sue. What were costs, a few hundred K? Compared to the public reaction of him being more of a tool? End of the day, he and his agent had a massive role to play in this, I reckon he'll want to sweep it under the carpet
And I think AO tried very hard to sneak him through. He loves the tournament
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@canefan said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@gt12 omicron and its apparent ability to spread rapidly will make contact tracing increasingly untenable. Just tell symptomatic people to stay home
yeah this is basically where we are at
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It will be interesting to see if there are any political ramifications for how the States have handled this given they are now practically on the same page.
It's hard to read here in NSW. There's a vocal group online who hate the LNP and think Perrottet has 'blood on his hands', as if he spliced the virus in his home lab to create Omicron... but I don't think reasonable people see it that way.
There's obviously frustration about testing but I think that will subside in a few weeks when supplies hit the shelves.
I don't know. I don't feel white hot anger in the community, but we all live in our bubbles. Scomo is well behind in the polls now, and I think COVID has a bit to do with that but it's not the whole picture.
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@barbarian said in Coronavirus - Australia:
It will be interesting to see if there are any political ramifications for how the States have handled this given they are now practically on the same page.
It's hard to read here in NSW. There's a vocal group online who hate the LNP and think Perrottet has 'blood on his hands', as if he spliced the virus in his home lab to create Omicron... but I don't think reasonable people see it that way.
There's obviously frustration about testing but I think that will subside in a few weeks when supplies hit the shelves.
I don't know. I don't feel white hot anger in the community, but we all live in our bubbles. Scomo is well behind in the polls now, and I think COVID has a bit to do with that but it's not the whole picture.
for all their chat, when the shit hit the fan they all followed the same path. Which means their chat was either bluster, hugely misguided, or politically motivated bullshit.
Things seem reasonable i you stay away from social media which appears to be jam packed with people who think this is a complete disaster and we should all still be locked in our homes with closed borders (none of these people seem to be able to articulate an end point for that though), and still, if you disagree, you want granny to die.
I was indifferent on ScoMo. I thought the Feds did a great job in April 2020.
Now i think they are bumbling fools and he is a fucking idiot with dangerously misguided priorities (yes, his happy clappy bullshit is an issue). But not everything being thrown at the Feds is their fault. -
@barbarian said in Coronavirus - Australia:
Scomo is well behind in the polls now
Meaningless, really. The ALP don't look interested in governing - too much like hard work. Better to just pussyfoot around and take your pension at the end.
As for Dom - he just looks like another incompetent suit who got to this point through the same relative level of ability as the rest of them i.e. knowing the right people and appealing to enough constituents to keep the job. And where he is in Sydney, he's never losing that seat.
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@barbarian said in Coronavirus - Australia:
It will be interesting to see if there are any political ramifications for how the States have handled this given they are now practically on the same page.
It's hard to read here in NSW. There's a vocal group online who hate the LNP and think Perrottet has 'blood on his hands', as if he spliced the virus in his home lab to create Omicron... but I don't think reasonable people see it that way.
It doesn't help when you see shit like this:
Prof Nick here isn't an infectious diseases expert. He's not a cardiologist, virologist or respiratory specialist. He's not in the inner sanctum to know what medial advice the government has received and he's making idiotic claims without a shred of evidence.
There's obviously frustration about testing but I think that will subside in a few weeks when supplies hit the shelves.
I wouldn't be at all surprised to find the supply comes just as the need dissipates.
I don't know. I don't feel white hot anger in the community, but we all live in our bubbles. Scomo is well behind in the polls now, and I think COVID has a bit to do with that but it's not the whole picture.
I'd vote his government out in an instant. And then I look at Labor... Below the line is going to get a workout at the next election.
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@nta said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@barbarian said in Coronavirus - Australia:
Scomo is well behind in the polls now
Meaningless, really. The ALP don't look interested in governing - too much like hard work. Better to just pussyfoot around and take your pension at the end.
As for Dom - he just looks like another incompetent suit who got to this point through the same relative level of ability as the rest of them i.e. knowing the right people and appealing to enough constituents to keep the job. And where he is in Sydney, he's never losing that seat.
I'm pretty sure the ALP's whole election campaign is to be basically silent until the end, then come out and say "the covid response was bungled, it's 100% ScoMo's fault, make him pay" and it will probably work.