Black Caps v England Test series
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@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@chris-b said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@cyclops Nicholls' retention doesn't seem too surprising - I'd have been a lot more surprised if he'd been dropped.
If Worker is injured, I'm not sure who the next cab off the rank would be - Nelson's Greg Hay?!!
Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career Records | ESPNcricinfo
Find Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career records and stats on ESPNcricinfo. Check batting most runs career stats of Plunket Shield, 2017/18.
Very few stellar performances in this lot - the top 8 are mainly very familiar names and unlikely contenders. A bit further down are Worker and Cleaver, with decent averages.
And a bit further down from them is Jeet averaging 19. Let's hope the pitches have been dogs!
Overall, a pretty predictable team once Santner is removed. Astle over Ish is probably the only selection that took longer than a minute and it's perhaps not surprising given that Ish chucks a roughie into the mix pretty frequently, so he's going to struggle to build pressure in tests.
As always I think it's the case of having a spinner for the sake of having a spinner.
Lucky there's genuine class amongst quite a number of the other players....
What is your theory based on? Who would you play instead of a spinner in this team?
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@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@chris-b said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@cyclops Nicholls' retention doesn't seem too surprising - I'd have been a lot more surprised if he'd been dropped.
If Worker is injured, I'm not sure who the next cab off the rank would be - Nelson's Greg Hay?!!
Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career Records | ESPNcricinfo
Find Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career records and stats on ESPNcricinfo. Check batting most runs career stats of Plunket Shield, 2017/18.
Very few stellar performances in this lot - the top 8 are mainly very familiar names and unlikely contenders. A bit further down are Worker and Cleaver, with decent averages.
And a bit further down from them is Jeet averaging 19. Let's hope the pitches have been dogs!
Overall, a pretty predictable team once Santner is removed. Astle over Ish is probably the only selection that took longer than a minute and it's perhaps not surprising given that Ish chucks a roughie into the mix pretty frequently, so he's going to struggle to build pressure in tests.
As always I think it's the case of having a spinner for the sake of having a spinner.
Lucky there's genuine class amongst quite a number of the other players....
What is your theory based on? Who would you play instead of a spinner in this team?
Just pointing out we haven't had a truly decent one since Vettori
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@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@chris-b said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@cyclops Nicholls' retention doesn't seem too surprising - I'd have been a lot more surprised if he'd been dropped.
If Worker is injured, I'm not sure who the next cab off the rank would be - Nelson's Greg Hay?!!
Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career Records | ESPNcricinfo
Find Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career records and stats on ESPNcricinfo. Check batting most runs career stats of Plunket Shield, 2017/18.
Very few stellar performances in this lot - the top 8 are mainly very familiar names and unlikely contenders. A bit further down are Worker and Cleaver, with decent averages.
And a bit further down from them is Jeet averaging 19. Let's hope the pitches have been dogs!
Overall, a pretty predictable team once Santner is removed. Astle over Ish is probably the only selection that took longer than a minute and it's perhaps not surprising given that Ish chucks a roughie into the mix pretty frequently, so he's going to struggle to build pressure in tests.
As always I think it's the case of having a spinner for the sake of having a spinner.
Lucky there's genuine class amongst quite a number of the other players....
What is your theory based on? Who would you play instead of a spinner in this team?
Just pointing out we haven't had a truly decent one since Vettori
What's your suggested solution to get around this?
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@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@chris-b said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@cyclops Nicholls' retention doesn't seem too surprising - I'd have been a lot more surprised if he'd been dropped.
If Worker is injured, I'm not sure who the next cab off the rank would be - Nelson's Greg Hay?!!
Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career Records | ESPNcricinfo
Find Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career records and stats on ESPNcricinfo. Check batting most runs career stats of Plunket Shield, 2017/18.
Very few stellar performances in this lot - the top 8 are mainly very familiar names and unlikely contenders. A bit further down are Worker and Cleaver, with decent averages.
And a bit further down from them is Jeet averaging 19. Let's hope the pitches have been dogs!
Overall, a pretty predictable team once Santner is removed. Astle over Ish is probably the only selection that took longer than a minute and it's perhaps not surprising given that Ish chucks a roughie into the mix pretty frequently, so he's going to struggle to build pressure in tests.
As always I think it's the case of having a spinner for the sake of having a spinner.
I think they've picked Matt Henry to give the prospect of a four (in fact five) -pronged seam attack if the pitch warrants it.
Sometimes you have to play a spinner regardless of whether he's a world-beater.
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@chris-b said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@chris-b said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@cyclops Nicholls' retention doesn't seem too surprising - I'd have been a lot more surprised if he'd been dropped.
If Worker is injured, I'm not sure who the next cab off the rank would be - Nelson's Greg Hay?!!
Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career Records | ESPNcricinfo
Find Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career records and stats on ESPNcricinfo. Check batting most runs career stats of Plunket Shield, 2017/18.
Very few stellar performances in this lot - the top 8 are mainly very familiar names and unlikely contenders. A bit further down are Worker and Cleaver, with decent averages.
And a bit further down from them is Jeet averaging 19. Let's hope the pitches have been dogs!
Overall, a pretty predictable team once Santner is removed. Astle over Ish is probably the only selection that took longer than a minute and it's perhaps not surprising given that Ish chucks a roughie into the mix pretty frequently, so he's going to struggle to build pressure in tests.
As always I think it's the case of having a spinner for the sake of having a spinner.
I think they've picked Matt Henry to give the prospect of a four (in fact five) -pronged seam attack if the pitch warrants it.
Sometimes you have to play a spinner regardless of whether he's a world-beater.
Yeah, personally would have preferred Ferguson as he at least offers something a bit different, but I also rate Henry so happy to see him there if required.
I'm not totally convinced with Astle over Sodhi. Astle also tends to throw in quite a few four balls as well. Personally I'd prefer we put some effort into developing Sodhi at test level but it's probably a pretty 50/50 call at this stage.
Real bugger for Santner, just as he finds some form and more importantly confidence with the bat at the top level he gets injured. I felt this series was a great opportunity for him to try and nail the number 6 spot.
Edit - overall still a really strong team by our standards. Should be a cracking couple of matches. Thinking about taking the boy to one of the days at Eden Park as he's starting to get into his cricket now
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@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@chris-b said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@cyclops Nicholls' retention doesn't seem too surprising - I'd have been a lot more surprised if he'd been dropped.
If Worker is injured, I'm not sure who the next cab off the rank would be - Nelson's Greg Hay?!!
Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career Records | ESPNcricinfo
Find Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career records and stats on ESPNcricinfo. Check batting most runs career stats of Plunket Shield, 2017/18.
Very few stellar performances in this lot - the top 8 are mainly very familiar names and unlikely contenders. A bit further down are Worker and Cleaver, with decent averages.
And a bit further down from them is Jeet averaging 19. Let's hope the pitches have been dogs!
Overall, a pretty predictable team once Santner is removed. Astle over Ish is probably the only selection that took longer than a minute and it's perhaps not surprising given that Ish chucks a roughie into the mix pretty frequently, so he's going to struggle to build pressure in tests.
As always I think it's the case of having a spinner for the sake of having a spinner.
Lucky there's genuine class amongst quite a number of the other players....
What is your theory based on? Who would you play instead of a spinner in this team?
Just pointing out we haven't had a truly decent one since Vettori
What's your suggested solution to get around this?
a) get Kane to bowl
Or.....
b) not pick one
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@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@chris-b said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@cyclops Nicholls' retention doesn't seem too surprising - I'd have been a lot more surprised if he'd been dropped.
If Worker is injured, I'm not sure who the next cab off the rank would be - Nelson's Greg Hay?!!
Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career Records | ESPNcricinfo
Find Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career records and stats on ESPNcricinfo. Check batting most runs career stats of Plunket Shield, 2017/18.
Very few stellar performances in this lot - the top 8 are mainly very familiar names and unlikely contenders. A bit further down are Worker and Cleaver, with decent averages.
And a bit further down from them is Jeet averaging 19. Let's hope the pitches have been dogs!
Overall, a pretty predictable team once Santner is removed. Astle over Ish is probably the only selection that took longer than a minute and it's perhaps not surprising given that Ish chucks a roughie into the mix pretty frequently, so he's going to struggle to build pressure in tests.
As always I think it's the case of having a spinner for the sake of having a spinner.
Lucky there's genuine class amongst quite a number of the other players....
What is your theory based on? Who would you play instead of a spinner in this team?
Just pointing out we haven't had a truly decent one since Vettori
What's your suggested solution to get around this?
a) get Kane to bowl
Or.....
b) not pick one
That's only half the 'solution', unless you're suggesting we play with only 10 men?
Who, or what role, fills the spot?
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@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@chris-b said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@cyclops Nicholls' retention doesn't seem too surprising - I'd have been a lot more surprised if he'd been dropped.
If Worker is injured, I'm not sure who the next cab off the rank would be - Nelson's Greg Hay?!!
Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career Records | ESPNcricinfo
Find Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career records and stats on ESPNcricinfo. Check batting most runs career stats of Plunket Shield, 2017/18.
Very few stellar performances in this lot - the top 8 are mainly very familiar names and unlikely contenders. A bit further down are Worker and Cleaver, with decent averages.
And a bit further down from them is Jeet averaging 19. Let's hope the pitches have been dogs!
Overall, a pretty predictable team once Santner is removed. Astle over Ish is probably the only selection that took longer than a minute and it's perhaps not surprising given that Ish chucks a roughie into the mix pretty frequently, so he's going to struggle to build pressure in tests.
As always I think it's the case of having a spinner for the sake of having a spinner.
Lucky there's genuine class amongst quite a number of the other players....
What is your theory based on? Who would you play instead of a spinner in this team?
Just pointing out we haven't had a truly decent one since Vettori
What's your suggested solution to get around this?
a) get Kane to bowl
Or.....
b) not pick one
That's only half the 'solution', unless you're suggesting we play with only 10 men?
Who, or what role, fills the spot?
Another seamer. What's Doug Bracewell up to?
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@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@chris-b said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@cyclops Nicholls' retention doesn't seem too surprising - I'd have been a lot more surprised if he'd been dropped.
If Worker is injured, I'm not sure who the next cab off the rank would be - Nelson's Greg Hay?!!
Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career Records | ESPNcricinfo
Find Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career records and stats on ESPNcricinfo. Check batting most runs career stats of Plunket Shield, 2017/18.
Very few stellar performances in this lot - the top 8 are mainly very familiar names and unlikely contenders. A bit further down are Worker and Cleaver, with decent averages.
And a bit further down from them is Jeet averaging 19. Let's hope the pitches have been dogs!
Overall, a pretty predictable team once Santner is removed. Astle over Ish is probably the only selection that took longer than a minute and it's perhaps not surprising given that Ish chucks a roughie into the mix pretty frequently, so he's going to struggle to build pressure in tests.
As always I think it's the case of having a spinner for the sake of having a spinner.
Lucky there's genuine class amongst quite a number of the other players....
What is your theory based on? Who would you play instead of a spinner in this team?
Just pointing out we haven't had a truly decent one since Vettori
What's your suggested solution to get around this?
a) get Kane to bowl
Or.....
b) not pick one
That's only half the 'solution', unless you're suggesting we play with only 10 men?
Who, or what role, fills the spot?
Another seamer. What's Doug Bracewell up to?
Is this including if Santner was available?
Old ball overs bowled by Doug Bracewell are worse than those bowled by Santner, and basically on a par with Craig and Sodhi.
Old ball overs bowled by Matt Henry have been woeful.
Its a tough gig.
It's hard enough to find a good 3rd seamer, finding an effective 4th seamer is almost pie in the sky.
Hesson era, non-opening bowlers:
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I'm wondering if the Wagner, CdG, Santner 3/4/5 combo is NZ's best ever old ball bowling combination?
That's why I'd be disappointed that Santner is missing the next 9 months, not because he strung together some ODI batting scores.
Alright, to give it some thought .......
Maybe when Oram was playing as a 6, Vettori as spinner and O'Brien as 3rd seamer in the mid 2000s? Lost though in the ineptness of our batting?
Early 1980s with L Cairns, Boock, Coney.
Late 90s with Nash, Vetorri & N Astle.
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@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@rapido said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@mn5 said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@chris-b said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@cyclops Nicholls' retention doesn't seem too surprising - I'd have been a lot more surprised if he'd been dropped.
If Worker is injured, I'm not sure who the next cab off the rank would be - Nelson's Greg Hay?!!
Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career Records | ESPNcricinfo
Find Plunket Shield, 2017/18 batting most runs career records and stats on ESPNcricinfo. Check batting most runs career stats of Plunket Shield, 2017/18.
Very few stellar performances in this lot - the top 8 are mainly very familiar names and unlikely contenders. A bit further down are Worker and Cleaver, with decent averages.
And a bit further down from them is Jeet averaging 19. Let's hope the pitches have been dogs!
Overall, a pretty predictable team once Santner is removed. Astle over Ish is probably the only selection that took longer than a minute and it's perhaps not surprising given that Ish chucks a roughie into the mix pretty frequently, so he's going to struggle to build pressure in tests.
As always I think it's the case of having a spinner for the sake of having a spinner.
Lucky there's genuine class amongst quite a number of the other players....
What is your theory based on? Who would you play instead of a spinner in this team?
Just pointing out we haven't had a truly decent one since Vettori
What's your suggested solution to get around this?
a) get Kane to bowl
Or.....
b) not pick one
That's only half the 'solution', unless you're suggesting we play with only 10 men?
Who, or what role, fills the spot?
Another seamer. What's Doug Bracewell up to?
Is this including if Santner was available?
Old ball overs bowled by Doug Bracewell are worse than those bowled by Santner, and basically on a par with Craig and Sodhi.
Old ball overs bowled by Matt Henry have been woeful.
Its a tough gig.
It's hard enough to find a good 3rd seamer, finding an effective 4th seamer is almost pie in the sky.
Hesson era, non-opening bowlers:
I do hear ya.
I think it's just frustration as a fan cos we do have genuine class in all of our other disciplines. The drop off when it comes to the spinning options is massive.
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This isn't particularly good - given that the four test players playing all failed!
A bit odd that we've got our test players playing in these warm up matches!
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I defy you to make any sort of sense of this scorecard - it's a thing of wonder.
NZ-XI vs ENG Cricket Scorecard, Tour match at Hamilton, March 14 - 15, 2018
Get cricket scorecard of Tour match, NZ-XI vs ENG, England in Australia and New Zealand 2017/18 at Seddon Park, Hamilton dated March 14 - 15, 2018.
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@kiwipie Kyle Jamieson is going to be annoyed - he's got a century against England, but his highest first class score remains 40*!
He's an interesting prospect - disturbingly he's listed on Cricinfo as right arm medium, but I think he's quicker than that - google says he can bowl at 135kms.
Most interestingly, he's the same height as Sam Whitelock, so if they can find another 5+ kms in him, he might be very awkward!
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@chris-b said in Black Caps v England Test series:
@kiwipie Kyle Jamieson is going to be annoyed - he's got a century against England, but his highest first class score remains 40*!
He's an interesting prospect - disturbingly he's listed on Cricinfo as right arm medium, but I think he's quicker than that - google says he can bowl at 135kms.
Most interestingly, he's the same height as Sam Whitelock, so if they can find another 5+ kms in him, he might be very awkward!
Obviously knows which end of the bat to hold to make a 100 against that attack. When I saw right-medium I was imagining Colin Munro pace so glad to hear he's livelier than that.
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@bovidae Yep, nothing more than opposed batting practice. I feel very sorry for anyone that paid to watch this game, or indeed anyone that invested any time in it.
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